Novelle
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...aside from getting a PGCE and teaching?

I recently went to the University of Birmingham open day where they offer this degree (and until now it was just another degree on my list of possibilities.)
However I really like how the course seems to delves into education from a range of angles, as well as the theory of education, and as I have been working with children and youth for the past five years this seems to in tune with my interests.

However, my question is if anyone can tell me what kinds of career paths this degree open up? Aside from taking an extra year to do a PGCE and teach primary?
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imabigboynow
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If you want the best chance at getting a good job after uni then dont pick this degree. youre paying 9k a year as a future investment and quite frankly this is a poor degree to chose. ANY degree is enough for a PCGE so it makes sense to pick one that can give you other skills too incase you decide you dont want to go into teaching anymore. Pick a STEM/Science degree or dont go to uni at all imo.
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El Salvador
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A BA in education? You mean a bachelor's degree but without the teaching qualification a BEd would've given you?

What's the point?
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Juichiro
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In my opinion, it is a useless degree. There is nothing that you can do with that degree that you cannot do with other degrees. You would be much better off reading books from the library.
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Snufkin
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(Original post by clh_hilary)
What's the point?
There is every point if you're interested in the history of education, sociology, child psychology and development, social policy, children's literature and philosophy.

I do not understand why so many people on this forum routinely dismiss other people's degree choice as pointless. The vast majority of graduate jobs do not require specific degrees so you might as well study something which interests you.
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El Salvador
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(Original post by Samual)
There is every point if you're interested in the history of education, sociology, child psychology and development, social policy, children's literature and philosophy.
Which you can all learned from a BEd, plus practical experience, plus an actual teaching qualification? :confused:

So what's the point paying for £1 for a bottle of water if £1 can get you two?
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Snufkin
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(Original post by clh_hilary)
Which you can all learned from a BEd, plus practical experience, plus an actual teaching qualification? :confused:

So what's the point paying for £1 for a bottle of water if £1 can get you two?
Not at all, if you actually look at the modules, a BEd is quite different. A BEd is fundamentally a professional degree designed to teach people how to be teachers. A non QTS granting Education degree is a social science degree like any other.
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El Salvador
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(Original post by Samual)
Not at all, if you actually look at the modules, a BEd is quite different. A BEd is fundamentally a professional degree designed to teach people how to be teachers. A non QTS granting Education degree is a social science degree like any other.
Then it's just not as good as a BEd programme you're talking about.

I learned all of them you've mentioned plus international comparisons in my BEd with practical experience, research skills/experience, and even a chance to conduct a professional development workshop. Did I mention it also came with a teaching qualification and linguistic skills and content on the English and Chinese languages? Oh and, I also got to minor in history. And a heavily subsidised immersion to another university in another country.
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Snufkin
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(Original post by clh_hilary)
Then it's just not as good as a BEd programme you're talking about.

I learned all of them you've mentioned plus international comparisons in my BEd with practical experience, research skills/experience, and even a chance to conduct a professional development workshop. Did I mention it also came with a teaching qualification and linguistic skills and content on the English and Chinese languages? Oh and, I also got to minor in history. And a heavily subsidised immersion to another university in another country.
Who cares if education degrees in Asia are different to those in the UK? That really is beside the point. If you have nothing sensible to add, I think we're done here.
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Juichiro
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(Original post by Samual)
There is every point if you're interested in the history of education, sociology, child psychology and development, social policy, children's literature and philosophy.

I do not understand why so many people on this forum routinely dismiss other people's degree choice as pointless. The vast majority of graduate jobs do not require specific degrees so you might as well study something which interests you.
a) Sociology - Psychology or any other Social Science/Field and Education

b) Child Psychology - Psychology or Education

c) Social Policy - Public Policy, Psychology (?) or Education

d) Children's literature - Literature, English or Education

e) Philosophy - All degrees in the Humanities field and most degrees in the social science

The point is that if you want to merely learn this stuff you can go to the library, buy the books on Amazon or/and pay yearly membership to a couple of academic databases. 9K per year (which you must pay back) seems a bit too much just to satiate your curiosity. I wonder if parents would be willing to pay this amount (accept the 9K debt) for their child's early education. I also wonder if they would be willing to pay the amount or accept the debt for fulfilling their child's curiosity in a particular topic.

Fulfilling your curiosity and learning for its own sake is nice. But it is questionable whether it is worth 9K in debt (plus maintenance loan).
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Juichiro
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(Original post by Samual)
Not at all, if you actually look at the modules, a BEd is quite different. A BEd is fundamentally a professional degree designed to teach people how to be teachers. A non QTS granting Education degree is a social science degree like any other.
Well, it is deffo not a science. The keyword is "BA". As far as I know, Education does not really have a scientific method of its own. Instead it sometimes borrows the scientific methodology from from psychology and sociology. But it seems to be mainly influenced by non-scientific empiricism.
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Snufkin
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(Original post by Juichiro)
a) Sociology - Psychology or any other Social Science/Field and Education

b) Child Psychology - Psychology or Education

c) Social Policy - Public Policy, Psychology (?) or Education

d) Children's literature - Literature, English or Education

e) Philosophy - All degrees in the Humanities field and most degrees in the social science
You're missing the point. Apart from education, what other degrees would allow you to study all those subjects simultaneously?

(Original post by Juichiro)
The point is that if you want to merely learn this stuff you can go to the library, buy the books on Amazon or/and pay yearly membership to a couple of academic databases.
I hope you realise this is true for nearly every subject, including most of the sciences.

(Original post by Juichiro)
Well, it is deffo not a science. The keyword is "BA". As far as I know, Education does not really have a scientific method of its own. Instead it sometimes borrows the scientific methodology from from psychology and sociology. But it seems to be mainly influenced by non-scientific empiricism.
You can get BA degrees in sociology, psychology, economics, geography, anthropology etc etc - are they not social sciences either? You seem to be clutching at straws here. I'm curious, would you be so quick to dismiss someone who studied education at Cambridge?
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Juichiro
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(Original post by Samual)
1. You're missing the point. Apart from education, what other degrees would allow you to study all those subjects simultaneously?



2. I hope you realise this is true for nearly every subject, including most of the sciences.



3.You can get BA degrees in sociology, psychology, economics, geography, anthropology etc etc - are they not social sciences either? You seem to be clutching at straws here.

4. I'm curious, would you be so quick to dismiss someone who studied education at Cambridge?
1. I think you need to think outside the box. There is possibly no single honours that lets you study the neural basis of cognition, the great literary works of 19th century France, Eastern mysticism and graphic design. Does that mean that you can't learn all of this? Of course, not! You can take courses and get books. You don't need to go to university to learn stuff (plumbers and electricians know this very well). The point is that you should be flexible with the ways in which you approach your subjects of interest. And sometimes, due to a variety of factors, a university degree is not the best way to go.

2. lol It is not. If you want to learn about biochemical interactions, you need a lab and equipment. If you want to learn just the theory, then you can just read a book/papers. If you want to learn experimental physics, you need a lab and equipment. If you want to learn theoretical physicists, you can take an online course and read books (some may disagree here, they are welcome). If you want to learn neuroscience, you need a lab and equipment. If you just want to learn theories, you can take an online course and read books. So nope, it ain't true for most of the sciences.

3. The "BA" or "BSc" tends to refer to the methodology used even if some universities use it loosely. So BA often means using non-scientific empirical methodologies while BSc often means using scientific methodologies and mathematical tools. I am not aware of sociology degrees with preeced with modules containing applications of the scientific method. Economics is not a science but more of an empirical field. The use of the scientific method in economic is still in its early stages and for good reasons! Geography does have a scientific element but I am not sure if it is significant enough. A good question to ask would be: how much stats and experimental studies are analysed/carried out by students during their degree? From checking out propectuses, it does not seem to be that much. BPS-approved Psychology tends to be heavily scientific. Just like the BPS like it. Anthropology is just as vast and varied as non-BPS psychology so it seems unfair to confer scientific status to the whole field.

4. Have you seen the prospectus? It is highly academic subject which means that it is only good if you intend to go for an academic career in that field. The same applies to OP's degree. It does seem fairly useless/low-ROI for anything else, including learning about the subject (compared to other degrees). Of course, the Cambribdge brand name might help you get in other close fields but that's it.
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hellodave5
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Do what you enjoy, but if you honestly don't know what to do after your degree do something generally useful which will allow you to change fields if you wish.
I did that for psychology, as I had an interest in neuroscience. You can always specialise later on in your career (i.e. MSc/MA/PhD) in a more specific area.

Have a career aim, then tailor your degree to that aim.

Take a look at the prospects guide if you don't know what to do with your life :P helps a lot, even if it just to confirm.
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El Salvador
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(Original post by Samual)
Who cares if education degrees in Asia are different to those in the UK? That really is beside the point. If you have nothing sensible to add, I think we're done here.
In the UK, you can also do a BA in education but with practical and QTS.
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Snufkin
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#16
(Original post by Juichiro)
snip
I am not interested in debating this any further. I don't have the energy to contradict your post line by line and I suspect I'd be wasting my time anyway. I don't know why you think non-STEM subjects are beneath you but I'm not going to waste my time trying to convince you of their worth, or why they should be studied at university and not in libraries. All I can hope is that prospective educationalists reading this thread haven't been swayed from studying a subject they enjoy.

(Original post by clh_hilary)
In the UK, you can also do a BA in education but with practical and QTS.
As I have already said, professional, teacher-training education degrees do not offer the same modules as non-QTS granting education degrees. Why would a person who only had an academic interest in education do a QTS-qualifying degree if it meant not being able to study the very modules they are interested in?
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El Salvador
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#17
(Original post by Samual)



As I have already said, professional, teacher-training education degrees do not offer the same modules as non-QTS granting education degrees. Why would a person who only had an academic interest in education do a QTS-qualifying degree if it meant not being able to study the very modules they are interested in?
Someone told me his degree at Durham was a BA in education but it's optional for them to also go for a placement and end up with also a QTS.

It does seem to be the programme mentioned here just isn't as good.
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Bekbuzar
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1.Librarian Careers
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5.Social Worker Careers
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