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    National ID cards have long been advocated as a means to enhance national security, unmask potential terrorists, and guard against illegal immigrants. i mean they had it in Spain and did it do any good??? did they get attacked? yes so they are pointless.
    i mean i wouldnt mind because i am not a crimial or whatever but its just costing too much, you have to fork out £80 and i seriously dont think that it will do any good, the UK hasnt been attacked ... yet, they have stopped the major attacks from happening (when they fount the ammonia thing in a mans garage).

    "Although it would be compulsory to possess a card, Mr Blunkett stressed it would not be mandatory for holders to carry it." (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/1802847.stm)
    if they are not "mandatory" tehn why have then???

    (For people who say that its invasion of privacy, please justify your answers)
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    (Original post by vmong)
    National ID cards have long been advocated as a means to enhance national security, unmask potential terrorists, and guard against illegal immigrants. i mean they had it in Spain and did it do any good??? did they get attacked? yes so they are pointless.
    That line of reasoning is invalid. One example does not prove pointlessness, i'm sure the Spanish Secruity Services have stopped loads of attacks, possible because of ID cards.

    i mean i wouldnt mind because i am not a crimial or whatever but its just costing too much, you have to fork out £80 and i seriously dont think that it will do any good, the UK hasnt been attacked ... yet, they have stopped the major attacks from happening (when they fount the ammonia thing in a mans garage).
    The major problem I have with ID cards is how the government expect you to pay such an excessive amount for them. It is essentially becoming an 'identity tax' - which I think is wrong.
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    (Original post by corey)
    That line of reasoning is invalid. One example does not prove pointlessness, i'm sure the Spanish Secruity Services have stopped loads of attacks, possible because of ID cards.


    The major problem I have with ID cards is how the government expect you to pay such an excessive amount for them. It is essentially becoming an 'identity tax' - which I think is wrong.
    However on your second point surely if it prevented fraud, identity thief and helped with terrorism prevention it would be a far more effecting way of spending Government money than on new helecopters for our armed forces. What is the justification for making the individual pay for it?
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    i read passports and driving licenses are going up in price two fold to subsidise this scheme.
    they say that the chips are hard to copy but given time, it could be very profitable for someone to find out how to do it, and indeed do it.
    it all feels too big brother-ish for me
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    (Original post by rae)
    i read passports and driving licenses are going up in price two fold to subsidise this scheme.
    they say that the chips are hard to copy but given time, it could be very profitable for someone to find out how to do it, and indeed do it.
    it all feels too big brother-ish for me
    How is it big brotherish? If the government want to track you, they can already do it effectively as they would be able to do with ID cards.
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    What right does the government have to tell me that I must possess anything? Cheeky buggers. Even if carrying the cards is made compulsory I can tell you already I won't be carrying one. If the government wants to make a criminal out of me, then they can do that.

    However, I like the idea of one item which will prove identity. It will hopefully get around the problems people have prooving who they are when opening back accounts etc.
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    ID cards are a fantastic idea, i think if Labour bring them in it will almost guarantee they will get elected again.

    I don't see why people think it is 'Big Brother' style monitoring, the government can check up on you at anytime, the vast majority of the population have nothing to worry about, just the small proportion who benefit from no ID cards (criminals) that really have any reason to seriously object.
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    (Original post by Absolution)
    ID cards are a fantastic idea, i think if Labour bring them in it will almost guarantee they will get elected again.

    I don't see why people think it is 'Big Brother' style monitoring, the government can check up on you at anytime, the vast majority of the population have nothing to worry about, just the small proportion who benefit from no ID cards (criminals) that really have any reason to seriously object.
    Ya what?

    How is something so controversial, and expensive, going to guarantee Labour's electoral success?
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    no need if u ask me
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    The government will be keeping a database with everyones details in it. This is big brotherish if you ask me. Next thing we know we'll have electronic chips planted in our arms and barcodes on our foreheads. It's not as though the government cares about the populace anymore than a farmer cares about his cattle.

    Terrorists only want one terrorist attack to get their point accross, one attack was all that was needed in Spain to influence the withdrawal of troops from Iraq. ID cards did not prevent that one attack from occuring in Spain.

    Tednol, I think the government are making not obtaining an ID card a civil offence rather than a criminal offence, specifically to prevent 'martyrs' from going to prison. Instead, you would be facing a fine of £2,500.
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    (Original post by benm)
    The government will be keeping a database with everyones details in it. This is big brotherish if you ask me. Next thing we know we'll have electronic chips planted in our arms and barcodes on our foreheads. It's not as though the government cares about the populace anymore than a farmer cares about his cattle.

    Terrorists only want one terrorist attack to get their point accross, one attack was all that was needed in Spain to influence the withdrawal of troops from Iraq. ID cards did not prevent that one attack from occuring in Spain.

    Tednol, I think the government are making not obtaining an ID card a civil offence rather than a criminal offence, specifically to prevent 'martyrs' from going to prison. Instead, you would be facing a fine of £2,500.
    Your details are already on lots of databases, eg: databases credit companies use to give you credit ratings. In fact every time you fill out a form for insurance/new car/washing machiene/television your preferences go into databases so the I.D cards will make little difference in that respect. You are also trying to justify your claims using a slippery slope arguement, that does not consider the benifits of introducing the cards but only what it could led to in the future taking the worse case example which is extremely unlikely to happen.
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    driving license allows you to drive

    passport allows you to travel freely

    ID card allows you to do what....exist?!

    personally i dont feel like justifying my existence to the state, it should be the other way round.:rolleyes:

    if anything, the technology planned for ID cards could be incorpated into a new passport system.
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    If an ID card were to count as your passport, your driving license, birth certificate, had on it your NHS number, your NI number, all the vaccinations you've ever had and all the other documentation that we're supposed to have in a filing cabinet, then it would be a fantastic invention. It can quite easily contain all this information, and if it became biometric then even better - would be extremely difficult to counterfeit. Then, we wouldn't have to pay for a passport or a driving license and the cost would be greatly reduced.

    Only problem is if you lost it, which I think I would. Cos then everything's gone and you're stuck.

    Also, you would need a massive secure database in order to do this which would be very efficient and reliable. Would be difficult with roughly 60 million of us. And to those who complain about invasion of privacy - all the details that i mentioned above are freely available to the government and those who wish to search for it. Obviously you couldn't have anyone requesting someone else's info but govt bodies could and it would save a lot of admin costs.
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    (Original post by vmong)
    National ID cards have long been advocated as a means to enhance national security, unmask potential terrorists, and guard against illegal immigrants. i mean they had it in Spain and did it do any good??? did they get attacked? yes so they are pointless.
    i mean i wouldnt mind because i am not a crimial or whatever but its just costing too much, you have to fork out £80 and i seriously dont think that it will do any good, the UK hasnt been attacked ... yet, they have stopped the major attacks from happening (when they fount the ammonia thing in a mans garage).

    "Although it would be compulsory to possess a card, Mr Blunkett stressed it would not be mandatory for holders to carry it." (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/1802847.stm)
    if they are not "mandatory" tehn why have then???

    (For people who say that its invasion of privacy, please justify your answers)
    I think national ID cards could be a good thing, though they should be optional, not compulsory. Basicly A passport is to big to fit in your wallet and it is cumbersome to drag around everywhere. In addition it is a disaster if you lose it. Id love to have a real ID card in my wallet to replace my passport, drivers license and Visa. Basicly i dont want ID cards to enhance surveilance. I want a card which collects all my cards in one place. Although I realise information security measures would have to be much tighter so that people do not steal your identity.

    (Original post by Jonatan)
    I think national ID cards could be a good thing bla bla bla
    You would - Norwegians cant exactly understand the Anglo-Saxon spirit for individual liberty from unnecessary interference from the state.
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    (Original post by Just an LSE guy)
    You would - Norwegians cant exactly understand the Anglo-Saxon spirit for individual liberty from unnecessary interference from the state.
    Dude, a couple of things. 1: Im Swedish I only live in Norway and I am just sick off all the state interference in the market here. 2: I never said I wanted these cards to be used for state interference. Read my post again. I wanted them to be an alternative to enhance the INDIVIDUALS ability to confirm his/her identity. 3: I lost half my relatives in Auschwitz so dont come and tell me I dont understand the concept of individual liberty against interference from the government. However if I WANT to be able to identify myself wherever I go without having to drag my passport around everywhere thats MY choice. Thats why I think these cards should be offered as an optional alternative to passports within the EU.

    (Original post by Jonatan)
    Dude...
    I stopped reading your reply after that unwelcome appearence of the "dude" word - please kindly delete that ghastly American word and repost your comments.
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    (Original post by Just an LSE guy)
    I stopped reading your reply after that unwelcome appearence of the "dude" word
    And thus I have no intention to waste my time further on a person who doesnt eaven bother to read my posts before making a judging comment about the entire post. Your comment about my nationality is at best ignorant, at worst racist; yet you complain when I call you "dude" ? I must say I am surprised LSE would accept a brat like you, but then Im not certain you are honset with your profile either...

    (Original post by Jonatan)
    I must say I am surprised LSE would accept a brat like you, but then Im not certain you are honset with your profile either...
    Sorry "dude", I only speak English, not Norwegianese.
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    (Original post by Just an LSE guy)
    Norwegianese.

    dear me, you even lack a grasp of the English language, let alone the history
 
 
 
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