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What is more competitive: S&T or IBD?

5

Having seen the large interest in threads involving recruitment figures, i was wondering if there was a large difference in competition for jobs and internships in the different areas of the bank. If anybody on this board had relevant data that would be great...

I personally expect IBD to be more competitive because it is accesible to a much larger number of degree students. From what i have theard the majority of people that go into S&T have quantitative degrees such as maths or engineering, whereas IBD tend to have a much broader range of degree subjects.

Reply 1

Cliché

IBD it seems due to less stringent quantative requirements hence attracting more people with non-quantative backgrounds.

Reply 2

Kinetic87

OP

5

Does anyone have any figures for this? Maybe someone who is working in IB at the moment.. Chassez, Ben, Citytrader?

Reply 3

Tortle

9

You don't have to have a maths or engineering degree for trading, and I doubt the majority of traders do.

There are many different types of trading, some types require way more quant skills than others. You can't just lump all trading together.

Reply 4

Kinetic87

OP

5

Tortle, you are right, but it has to be said generally there are people with more 'numerical' degrees in S&T as oppose to IBD, especially in FI.

You don't need high level technical skill but you need to have a quick, logical mind and these are generally, though not always found with people that have a quantitive element to thier degree.

Reply 5

JrW

14

Kinetic87

Tortle, you are right, but it has to be said generally there are people with more 'numerical' degrees in S&T as oppose to IBD, especially in FI.

You don't need high level technical skill but you need to have a quick, logical mind and these are generally, though not always found with people that have a quantitive element to thier degree.

That is certainly a generalistation...there are some exotic/credit products that few traders touch withoout PhDs in Maths, Physics etc

Reply 6

Big4Monkey

The application ratios are a fair bit higher in IBD, but as mentioned this is largely because they are much more welcoming of grads from all disciplines, whereas the vast majority of S&T grads have quantitative backgrounds.

Reply 7

Tortle

9

CityTrader

The application ratios are a fair bit higher in IBD, but as mentioned this is largely because they are much more welcoming of grads from all disciplines, whereas the vast majority of S&T grads have quantitative backgrounds.

I would classify an economcis degree as a quant degree, but I would classify maths/physics/engineering as super quant degrees

What I'm saying is that this super quant level isn't needed across the board, but only in some types of trading.

Reply 8

Kinetic87

OP

5

AlphaX

That is certainly a generalistation...there are some exotic/credit products that few traders touch withoout PhDs in Maths, Physics etc

X, yeh your right, but it is very difficult to enter those kind of desks from undergraduate degree, i was thinking about undergraduate hires... btw i know from other boards that you have a real interest in IB, do you know what area you have decided to go into... what degree have you chosen?

Was it you who was asking if CASM would be adequate for credit derivatives? It would be interesting to know your situation...

Reply 9

flyingkolours

1

is msc accounting and finance a quantitative degree according to you guys? :smile:

Reply 10

President_Ben

15

CityTrader

The application ratios are a fair bit higher in IBD, but as mentioned this is largely because they are much more welcoming of grads from all disciplines, whereas the vast majority of S&T grads have quantitative backgrounds.

Yep.

Sales interns have often been hired. IBD hiring was up this year.

Not so many traders seem to be taken.

Reply 11

love2learn

4

Technically, it should depend on the bank. I.e. People should research a bank and find out what their strengths (and weaknesses) are. SO if a bank excels in M&A, but it's equity sales are poor, you should find it's more competitive to get into M&A.

Having said that though, the vast majority just apply to the same division in a load of banks regardless of this point!

Reply 12

love2learn

4

The other things is that the margins on equities and the more simple fixed income products are rapidaly reducing, so the banks are mostly looking to more exotic tools, which of course means that looking to the future a highly quantitative degree and postgrad studies will be pretty essential for the sales / trading side of things.

What is more competitive: S&T or IBD?

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