Why is it only Britain's identity/culture that gets challenged and denied?
It always puzzles me to see people questioning whether there is a British identity and culture, or even going as far to deny that they even exist.
You never see people question India's identity/culture, China's identity/culture, Italy's identity/culture, Pakistan's identity/culture, etc. Even young, melting pot countries such as the USA and Canada don't seem to be subject to the same challenges.
I can only assume that it's part of the British, primarily left-wing, penchant for self-hate and conflation of the notion of a British identity with right-wing politics.
You never see people question India's identity/culture, China's identity/culture, Italy's identity/culture, Pakistan's identity/culture, etc. Even young, melting pot countries such as the USA and Canada don't seem to be subject to the same challenges.
I can only assume that it's part of the British, primarily left-wing, penchant for self-hate and conflation of the notion of a British identity with right-wing politics.
Scroll to see replies
Original post by Lady Comstock
You never see people question India's identity/culture
You never see people question India's identity/culture
Yes, you do. There are hugely controversial debates about Indian national identity:
- Does it have a religious aspect, i.e. are Hindus more authentically Indian than non-Hindus?
- Does it have a language aspect, i.e. are Hindi speakers more authentically Indian than non-Hindi speakers?
- Is the caste system an integral part of Indian culture? And to what extent?
- Are Jammu and Kashmir Indian?
Because most of British culture was actually imported from abroad or so I've been told, like Fish and Chips which was brought to Britain by a man named Apu Sandhu in 1823.
I find the whole concept of national identity fairly bizarre, a best they are pointless (can anyone really claim that being welcoming is an exclusively British trait) and at worse act only to maintain racial/national/religious stereotypes, the kind that this country isn't supposed to believe in because it's so tolerant...
Probably revenge for centuries of British imperialism and cultural assimilation.
I've no idea where you get this ludicrous idea from though.
There are plenty of exploitative documentaries on how 'backwards' India is re: caste system/honour killings/misogyny etc.
Pakistan is slated for its extremist laws re: religion and treatment of women to the point of racism (I first heard the term 'Paki' when I was 8)
China is criticised for being a notorious authoritarian-communist hybrid (an impressive feat it must be said). In particular its one-child policy and police-state laws on the Internet-what's it called, the firewall?
Likewise USA is regularly challenged all the time for the 'America: World Police' trope, Americanisation, the stereotype of its conservative close-mindedness (cf. homophobia), the failure of the American Dream and dangers of capitalism, and on colonialism and immigration. Admittedly I know much less on Canada but doubtless it will be implicated with similar issues to , esp. colonialism and its link with France in the French Revolution.
Bro do you even International Studies?
I've no idea where you get this ludicrous idea from though.
There are plenty of exploitative documentaries on how 'backwards' India is re: caste system/honour killings/misogyny etc.
Pakistan is slated for its extremist laws re: religion and treatment of women to the point of racism (I first heard the term 'Paki' when I was 8)
China is criticised for being a notorious authoritarian-communist hybrid (an impressive feat it must be said). In particular its one-child policy and police-state laws on the Internet-what's it called, the firewall?
Likewise USA is regularly challenged all the time for the 'America: World Police' trope, Americanisation, the stereotype of its conservative close-mindedness (cf. homophobia), the failure of the American Dream and dangers of capitalism, and on colonialism and immigration. Admittedly I know much less on Canada but doubtless it will be implicated with similar issues to , esp. colonialism and its link with France in the French Revolution.
Bro do you even International Studies?
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Smash Bandicoot
There are plenty of exploitative documentaries on how 'backwards' India is re: caste system/honour killings/misogyny etc.
Sorry, but how is this in any way denying or challenging that India has a culture/identity? It in fact reinforces it, as documentaries are criticising what it perceives as the negatives of India's established culture/identity.
Pakistan is slated for its extremist laws re: religion and treatment of women to the point of racism (I first heard the term 'Paki' when I was 8)
See above.
China is criticised for being a notorious authoritarian-communist hybrid (an impressive feat it must be said). In particular its one-child policy and police-state laws on the Internet-what's it called, the firewall?
See above.
Likewise USA is regularly challenged all the time for the 'America: World Police' trope, Americanisation, the stereotype of its conservative close-mindedness (cf. homophobia), the failure of the American Dream and dangers of capitalism, and on colonialism and immigration. Admittedly I know much less on Canada but doubtless it will be implicated with similar issues to , esp. colonialism and its link with France in the French Revolution.
See above.
Bro do you even International Studies?
You've clearly confused denial of a culture/identity with criticism of culture/identity.
Original post by Lady Comstock
Sorry, but how is this in any way denying or challenging that India has a culture/identity? It in fact reinforces it, as documentaries are criticising what it perceives as the negatives of India's established culture/identity.
See above.
See above.
See above.
You've clearly confused denial of a culture/identity with criticism of culture/identity.
See above.
See above.
See above.
You've clearly confused denial of a culture/identity with criticism of culture/identity.
To clarify, I am referring to challenging the merits of a culture/identity, which are rife, not denial per se-Britain is more complex because we are a melting pot of cultures hence identities in this day and age
Original post by perfectsymbology
Because most of British culture was actually imported from abroad or so I've been told, like Fish and Chips which was brought to Britain by a man named Apu Sandhu in 1823.
Culture is language, religion and environment. Everything else is choice, so of course with greater choice people make different choices.
Original post by Lady Comstock
It always puzzles me to see people questioning whether there is a British identity and culture, or even going as far to deny that they even exist.
You never see people question India's identity/culture, China's identity/culture, Italy's identity/culture, Pakistan's identity/culture, etc. Even young, melting pot countries such as the USA and Canada don't seem to be subject to the same challenges.
I can only assume that it's part of the British, primarily left-wing, penchant for self-hate and conflation of the notion of a British identity with right-wing politics.
You never see people question India's identity/culture, China's identity/culture, Italy's identity/culture, Pakistan's identity/culture, etc. Even young, melting pot countries such as the USA and Canada don't seem to be subject to the same challenges.
I can only assume that it's part of the British, primarily left-wing, penchant for self-hate and conflation of the notion of a British identity with right-wing politics.
It is done by the government to attack the Cultural basis for law and weaken the state which enforces it. It is an active policy of the government and many political parties. The exceptions being the UKIP, Britain First, and the Unionist parties in Ulster. That is about it.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Smash Bandicoot
To clarify, I am referring to challenging the merits of a culture/identity, which are rife, not denial per se-Britain is more complex because we are a melting pot of cultures hence identities in this day and age
So is the USA/Canada - to a greater extent in fact - yet I rarely ever see denial that that they have an identity/culture.
OP, Google 'cultural marxism" and suddenly all will become clear.😊
Original post by Lady Comstock
So is the USA/Canada - to a greater extent in fact - yet I rarely ever see denial that that they have an identity/culture.
where do you see denial of British identity? I see some anxiety about English nationalism from the pro-cosmopolitan liberals and some fairly obvious scuffles between England, Scotland, Northern Ireland, the Republic of Ireland and Wales but no outright denial.
Original post by Lady Comstock
It always puzzles me to see people questioning whether there is a British identity and culture, or even going as far to deny that they even exist.
Why does it puzzle you? Do you think there is a British identity and culture? If so, what are they?
Original post by Lady Comstock
You never see people question India's identity/culture, China's identity/culture, Italy's identity/culture, Pakistan's identity/culture, etc. Even young, melting pot countries such as the USA and Canada don't seem to be subject to the same challenges.
I can only assume that it's part of the British, primarily left-wing, penchant for self-hate and conflation of the notion of a British identity with right-wing politics.
I can only assume that it's part of the British, primarily left-wing, penchant for self-hate and conflation of the notion of a British identity with right-wing politics.
I agree with mojojojo101 in that I find the concept of a national identity/culture bizarre.
Identity and culture are very broad terms which both cover many aspects of life, regardless of how important or trivial they may be. I think the words are meaningless unless you are talking about an individual or a group of people that are very much alike. Since people in the UK are very different I doubt that a British identity or culture exists. In saying that a British identity and culture exist you're saying that we're all very similar, which we're not.
Smaller populations are easier to label.
I think it's perhaps because of the alleged freedoms that we have in this country, and the mass integration of cultures that some have accepted (because hi, we've been integrated culturally for hundreds of years now). and some have not.
Don't forget that we Brits thought we were the dogs danglies not too long ago, and decided to invade everywhere. You'll see bits of British culture in all of the places that were invaded by the British.
A lot of Indian curries for example were introduced by the British. The Tikka massala for example, it's believed to have originated in the United Kingdom. Who'd have thunk it?
To further answer the question, I do not believe that it is *only* British culture that is questioned, (as someone already pointed out) we just know more about that because we're more exposed to it. News that we get from other countries is tailored to suit whatever agenda is appropriate at the time.
Cultures are forever changing and evolving worldwide, and that can only be a good thing. What was considered normal 500 years ago is considered insanity now.
Don't forget that we Brits thought we were the dogs danglies not too long ago, and decided to invade everywhere. You'll see bits of British culture in all of the places that were invaded by the British.
A lot of Indian curries for example were introduced by the British. The Tikka massala for example, it's believed to have originated in the United Kingdom. Who'd have thunk it?
To further answer the question, I do not believe that it is *only* British culture that is questioned, (as someone already pointed out) we just know more about that because we're more exposed to it. News that we get from other countries is tailored to suit whatever agenda is appropriate at the time.
Cultures are forever changing and evolving worldwide, and that can only be a good thing. What was considered normal 500 years ago is considered insanity now.
(edited 9 years ago)
I feel that Britain has little culture owing to the fact that industrial capitalist consumerist civilization (a destroyer of culture) originated here and has been developed primarily in the English speaking world for centuries.
Speaking more broadly though, white countries in general are denied expressions of ethnic pride. This is because:
1) The Nazis. Ethnic pride + white people must be intrinsically evil because the Nazis believed in it in an extreme form. At least, this is what left wing academics after WW2 believed and propagated.
2) Multiculturalism as an ideology suits the rich and powerful as they get to make use of a cheap workforce of slaves who they can pay virtually nothing. Ethnic pride undermines this.
3) America promulgates it's own perspectives to other Western countries. America is a melting pot, so other western countries should be too. This is also why you will find left wing teenage Norwegians or whatever with white guilt about slavery and racism even though it's nothing to do with their country.
There are other reasons but these are the main ones I can think right now.
Speaking more broadly though, white countries in general are denied expressions of ethnic pride. This is because:
1) The Nazis. Ethnic pride + white people must be intrinsically evil because the Nazis believed in it in an extreme form. At least, this is what left wing academics after WW2 believed and propagated.
2) Multiculturalism as an ideology suits the rich and powerful as they get to make use of a cheap workforce of slaves who they can pay virtually nothing. Ethnic pride undermines this.
3) America promulgates it's own perspectives to other Western countries. America is a melting pot, so other western countries should be too. This is also why you will find left wing teenage Norwegians or whatever with white guilt about slavery and racism even though it's nothing to do with their country.
There are other reasons but these are the main ones I can think right now.
(edited 9 years ago)
Brainwashed white self hating cultural marxist tossers, and their ethnic minority friends who hate this country do this yes.
They know that British culture exists, it's just that they hate it - their real point is that it shouldn't be allowed to exist.
Or if it exists it's nothing more than 'fairness' - 'tolerance' - 'compassion' etc.
As if some countries define themselves by being unfair or intolerant etc...
They know that British culture exists, it's just that they hate it - their real point is that it shouldn't be allowed to exist.
Or if it exists it's nothing more than 'fairness' - 'tolerance' - 'compassion' etc.
As if some countries define themselves by being unfair or intolerant etc...
Its only white English people that hate themselves and no longer feel any sense of nationalism or belonging, not the "British". There is still a very strong Scottish and Irish (even in NI) sense of national identity and culture. What you are talking about really is a specifically English thing, the rest of the UK generally takes pride in their countries (as do most other places in Europe)
I dont really understand it either - it must feel terribly lonely not to feel part of, and take pride in, your country and history.
3) America promulgates it's own perspectives to other Western countries. America is a melting pot, so other western countries should be too. This is also why you will find left wing teenage Norwegians or whatever with white guilt about slavery and racism even though it's nothing to do with their country.
This is true, and one of the worst and most destructive trends of the last few years (it has really amplified with the rise of the internet and social media). But the average white American still takes far more pride in their country than the average European, let alone the average Englishman.
I dont really understand it either - it must feel terribly lonely not to feel part of, and take pride in, your country and history.
3) America promulgates it's own perspectives to other Western countries. America is a melting pot, so other western countries should be too. This is also why you will find left wing teenage Norwegians or whatever with white guilt about slavery and racism even though it's nothing to do with their country.
This is true, and one of the worst and most destructive trends of the last few years (it has really amplified with the rise of the internet and social media). But the average white American still takes far more pride in their country than the average European, let alone the average Englishman.
(edited 9 years ago)
Quick Reply
Latest
Trending
Last reply 2 days ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 2 days ago
Is it true that British unis are prejudiced towards degrees from Scottish unis?Last reply 2 days ago
If the Russell Group was now a fair representation of what it still claims to beLast reply 2 weeks ago
TSR Goes Green: How important will the environment be in this year's election?Last reply 2 weeks ago
Research Rankings of universities if you add Research Quality & Intensity percentagesLast reply 1 month ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?Trending
Last reply 2 days ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 2 days ago
Is it true that British unis are prejudiced towards degrees from Scottish unis?Last reply 2 days ago
If the Russell Group was now a fair representation of what it still claims to beLast reply 2 weeks ago
TSR Goes Green: How important will the environment be in this year's election?Last reply 2 weeks ago
Research Rankings of universities if you add Research Quality & Intensity percentagesLast reply 1 month ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?
