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Is Britain a racist nation?

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Original post by SophiaLDN
Yes, yes and yes.


That's fine, but can you tell me what you are comparing Britain to? Which multiracial paradise makes Britain look so terrible? Because really there's no evidence in all of history to suggest that any people ever have become free of prejudice... and I would suggest that given the enormous changes in demographics that have happened to this country in the last 50 or so years, the British people have actually done far better than most countries would have in adjusting to the changes that have taken place.
Original post by SophiaLDN
Its funny how people try so hard to prove something isn't racist by ignoring comments from people who do face racism and/or comparing it to so and so. Like, oh he killed 9 people, I only killed 3, we're not as bad.

So if a country is multicultural, racism can't possibly exist? :K:

Why is everyone comparing countries? Yes, they are racist too. It's not like there's only one title for the most racist country that's up for grabs. Plenty of racism to go around.


Islam is the epitomy of hatred abs racism. Look around the world. The only people I see trying to plant bombs to kill people are Muslims.
Original post by Catholic_
The only people I see trying to plant bombs to kill people are Muslims.


Really? never heard of the IRA or the Boston Bombers? People need to get off the Islam bandwagon to be honest.
Original post by Time Tourist
That's fine, but can you tell me what you are comparing Britain to? Which multiracial paradise makes Britain look so terrible? Because really there's no evidence in all of history to suggest that any people ever have become free of prejudice... and I would suggest that given the enormous changes in demographics that have happened to this country in the last 50 or so years, the British people have actually done far better than most countries would have in adjusting to the changes that have taken place.


Minorities dont apprectiate anything that's why. All they do is demand. They'd demand a nations heart if they could they have that much recognition for the rights of others. They don't even respect your own space or you to decide how your own lands will be. You can't ever rely on them to be understanding, tolerant at all. That's the last thing you can expect from them. All they do is pursue their own agendas in other nations then call you racist when you catch then trying to turn you out of your country and kick us out of our own lands.
Original post by Baibastaiy
I am an Indian born in the UK . I am 20 years old now and have fully interacted with English people all my life from the poorest to the richest. And to be honest I can no longer deny to myself that White English people are generally racist against South Asians.

The problem is, is that they keep it really well hidden. They don't ever say racist things but you can just tell in other ways. A South Asian person born in England who acts totally British in their mannerisms and has a British accent can never fit in. If they try hard they are socially accepted by their White English peers but then again they are never popular.

They are more likely going to be rude to a South Asian person than a White, Black or a person of any other race. Next time you go a to a cafe notice how the White English staff are treating the other people compared to you. Even if they aren't being rude they are definitely going to be friendlier to the Black or White person, always.

Seriously I hate to break it to you but English people are racist against South Asians as a whole. They simply don't like us. You can be extremely educated and well presented and they are still going to look down on someone just because they are Asian. Strangely enough a lot of South Asians don't seem to realise this over here in the UK.

I think this is because many keep to themselves and with their own communities and don't hang around or try associating themselves with White English people. I am not generalizing here it's just a fact. It's a shame really because I am totally British in my accent, mindset and so forth but I cannot bear living in a society where I am so looked down upon.

At least in a country like Australia they often admit that they are racist. English people hide it really well. Sometimes I wonder if they don't even realise that they are biased and prejudice against South Asians and that negative stereotypes subconsciously affect their thinking. For example from what I have seen they have no problems with Iranians or Afghans a people who both can often look South Asian. An Afghan Pashtun will not receive prejudice but yet a Pakistani one would, the only difference is that one carries the term 'Pakistani' with them.

It's quite saddening for me on my end because I feel very British in my accent and mindset Etc. But the way people view me here and the way they judge me on my race up to such an extent I just cannot see myself living here for the rest of my life. White English people see South Asians as nothing more than people who make food for them and the negative stereotypes that they perceive us with. I am going to look to move to another country in a few years time and I really hope there is a place which is better for South Asians than the UK. Heck I think even America is.


As I said English people aren't ever going to admit how racist they are because frankly they are a bunch of hypocrites who talk about how racism is so wrong and following Mandela when they themselves are biased and racist. And South Asians live in their own world and don't realise how they are perceived by a White English society. What I find strange is how England is considered one of the most racially tolerant countries in the world. Well not in my eyes it isn't. South Asians may not get spat on and get called derogatory names often. And nor is there any job discrimination. If people don't want to know us on the basis of our race and going to dislike us on the basis of that then is still racist.

White English people don't like South Asians. They aren't going to change any time soon. So I am going to leave.


Obviously I know nothing about you, but talking about your feelings when sitting in a cafe and complaining that the staff aren't friendly enough to you compared to all the white people... it comes across like this is more to do with your own insecurities than any racism...

We're not exactly talking about Kristallnacht here are we?
Original post by Baibastaiy
I am an Indian born in the UK . I am 20 years old now and have fully interacted with English people all my life from the poorest to the richest. And to be honest I can no longer deny to myself that White English people are generally racist against South Asians.

The problem is, is that they keep it really well hidden. They don't ever say racist things but you can just tell in other ways. A South Asian person born in England who acts totally British in their mannerisms and has a British accent can never fit in. If they try hard they are socially accepted by their White English peers but then again they are never popular.

They are more likely going to be rude to a South Asian person than a White, Black or a person of any other race. Next time you go a to a cafe notice how the White English staff are treating the other people compared to you. Even if they aren't being rude they are definitely going to be friendlier to the Black or White person, always.

Seriously I hate to break it to you but English people are racist against South Asians as a whole. They simply don't like us. You can be extremely educated and well presented and they are still going to look down on someone just because they are Asian. Strangely enough a lot of South Asians don't seem to realise this over here in the UK.

I think this is because many keep to themselves and with their own communities and don't hang around or try associating themselves with White English people. I am not generalizing here it's just a fact. It's a shame really because I am totally British in my accent, mindset and so forth but I cannot bear living in a society where I am so looked down upon.

At least in a country like Australia they often admit that they are racist. English people hide it really well. Sometimes I wonder if they don't even realise that they are biased and prejudice against South Asians and that negative stereotypes subconsciously affect their thinking. For example from what I have seen they have no problems with Iranians or Afghans a people who both can often look South Asian. An Afghan Pashtun will not receive prejudice but yet a Pakistani one would, the only difference is that one carries the term 'Pakistani' with them.

It's quite saddening for me on my end because I feel very British in my accent and mindset Etc. But the way people view me here and the way they judge me on my race up to such an extent I just cannot see myself living here for the rest of my life. White English people see South Asians as nothing more than people who make food for them and the negative stereotypes that they perceive us with. I am going to look to move to another country in a few years time and I really hope there is a place which is better for South Asians than the UK. Heck I think even America is.


As I said English people aren't ever going to admit how racist they are because frankly they are a bunch of hypocrites who talk about how racism is so wrong and following Mandela when they themselves are biased and racist. And South Asians live in their own world and don't realise how they are perceived by a White English society. What I find strange is how England is considered one of the most racially tolerant countries in the world. Well not in my eyes it isn't. South Asians may not get spat on and get called derogatory names often. And nor is there any job discrimination. If people don't want to know us on the basis of our race and going to dislike us on the basis of that then is still racist.

White English people don't like South Asians. They aren't going to change any time soon. So I am going to leave.


Poor you. It's clear to see the only racist here is yourself. I find is funny comming from an indian. Indians are the most judgemental racist people I have come across. Pakistani & Indian people are the biggeat racists in the nation if you ask me. Your community if full of bigotry and backwards views as a whole tbh. You don't even mix with the 'nons' and are notorious for not intergrating.

Some Indian families will even kill their children in honour killings for marrying another race so don't start that nonsense. Does India give Citizenship to non Indians? No. It's you 'South Asians' that don't like us in fact. You don't want to live here, you want England for yourselves.

You turn up here with a tear in your eye and the race card in your pocket, spitting on the people who accomodate you in their own country.

England has given cretins like yourself enough and all you have to say are terrible things about us on a consitent basis. Maybe people are just beggining to see the truth and are tired of your bull****.
Reply 26
Original post by Baibastaiy
:blah:


How would you know if South Asians experience more racism than black or white people etc.? You're not a chameleon that can change race and experience life as a different race.

You make it sound like white English people have some huge difficulty in stopping themselves be racist against every non white they see like some curse.

I get plenty of racist comments about being white with people saying I should be feeling some huge shame because I was responsible for slavery etc.
Original post by Catholic_
Minorities dont apprectiate anything that's why. All they do is demand. They'd demand a nations heart if they could they have that much recognition for the rights of others. They don't even respect your own space or you to decide how your own lands will be. You can't ever rely on them to be understanding, tolerant at all. That's the last thing you can expect from them. All they do is pursue their own agendas in other nations then call you racist when you catch then trying to turn you out of your country and kick us out of our own lands.


Case in point.

I'd say generally most people are not racist that being said, there is a lot of racism tparticularly towards Asian men and people can often be quite open about it. Plus compared to other countries people are less vocal about it...you only need to look at various online forums to see what people really think and believe when they can hide under anonymous accounts away from scrutiny. Racism is less likely to affect people's actions...discrimination is lower here because legally and socially it is not tolerated. But I'd say when it comes to prejudices and particular ideologies about other ethnic groups and 'the way they are', British people can be worse than other countries.
(edited 9 years ago)
I think the OP is right. White English people probably do, on the whole look down on South Asians, but it is very subtle and complex.

What can be done about it though? It is illegal to discriminate on the grounds of race or religion or colour, and any verbal expression in the slightest bit negative and possibly racist is proscribed too. The Education system also pursues multiculturalism as an ethos. Whether successfully or not is another matter.

There is no way to make people respect or like other people though. It is just how it is. You either deal with it, or leave, as the OP intends to do.

Good luck with that. She may find the citizens of other countries are even worse towards her, mind. If she emigrates to India she may find people look down on her for having been raised here. In fact that is quite likely I would have thought...
Reply 29
anecdotal rubbish
Reply 30
I don't think so. It is a nation with a lot of racist people in it, but since racism is legally and culturally frowned upon I wouldn't say it is a racist nation.
Original post by Baibastaiy
My heart wants to say, 'absolutely not'. My head says, 'Yes, some people in Britain are extremely racist, some people make racist statements,some people behave in a racist way'.

An article in the Daily Mail earlier this year stated that a third of the people surveyed admitted making comments or being involved in discussions which could be considered racist, 40% made the statement "I'm not a racist, but........." when discussing race issues.

Is Britain a racist nation? One in three Brits 'admits to being racist', according to poll

In my own profession, things are no better. A report in 2001 'Racism in Medicine' published by the King's Fund (a health charity) found that 'discrimination against ethnic minorities entering medicine begins at medical school and lasts until the day they retire from practice'.

Additionally, there was found to be an 'alarming level' of institutional racism in the National Health Service.

Report reveals racism in medical profession

Anecdotally, in our department, I have dealt with patients who have refused to be seen or examined by Medical Staff from different ethnic groups (including those from India), I have intervened when patients have made comments about the staff, or about other patients.

I have called the police when a patient spat into the face of a colleague from India.

The National Health Service itself does not escape attention, a study found that applicants from ethnic minorities found it harder to get a job, were more likely to be bullied and were more likely to have grievances taken out against them.

NHS accused of racism - Telegraph

The statistics make no better adding where education is concerned, between 2007 and 2011, 88,000 racist incidents were recorded. Now, it is obvious that some of these may be due to ignorance (or innocence) of children, but it still makes for grim reading:

Schools saw 87,000 racism cases

A recent article in The Independent found that there was still racism within the UK police force.

Anti-racism smear scandal: Police targeted the sister of black paratrooper who died in custody

An article in the Guardian in April reported that Black and Asian Police Officers in the Metropolitan Police Force still believe that the force is 'institutionally racist', this coming years after the murder of a young, black teenager, is shocking. And distressing.

Metropolitan police still institutionally racist, say black and Asian officers

On a personal level, many of my colleagues are from India and Pakistan. To those of us in the ED family, they are our family, no different to the rest of us.

It saddens me to say that, to many British people, views South Asians are seen to be inferior.

I believe that ALL white people in the UK....and even some black or brown people raised in a society where racism has been (and still is) so prevalent, will have internalized various elements of racist thinking.

So in countries where beliefs in European/white superiority and domination have been historically embedded, it is likely that everyone in such places will have internalized some of that conditioning.

Being white in a racist society has advantages.

The advantages for white people can be :

Material (such as greater opportunity in the labour market, or greater net worth, due to a history in which whites had the ability to accumulate wealth to a greater extent than persons of color)

Social (such as presumptions of competence, creditworthiness, law-abidingness, intelligence, etc.)

Psychological (such as not having to worry about triggering negative stereotypes, rarely having to feel out of place, not having to worry about racial profiling)

"O but ..but but...what about those poor white beggars I see on the street"

You could not get me one white beggar who would swap places with me. Poor white people does'nt disprove that white people do not have head start, the same way rich disabled people do not disprove that being able bodied has it's advantages.

Don't it twisted - everyone has problems - but for whites, dealing with race, not just in the UK but worldwide, is not a problem for you.
(edited 9 years ago)
Britain has colonized a huge part of the world and now they are complaining about immigrants-quite ironic although I must say I find UK's history and culture very impressive. Nonetheless, brits are a little disadvantaged by immigrants who work harder and better and cheaper. And there are always thieves and beggers who are usually regarded as immigrants(sometimes unfairly). I would say that UK is a racist country, but the people are friendly... wierd
(edited 9 years ago)
Britain is a white country... therefore the whites don't see racism because they don't experience it and therefore believe it doesn't happen.

Racism is pretty ingrained in UK culture.

When I grew up there was considerable anti Jewish sentiment. Jewish people pretended not to be Jewish because of this. The Jewish cemetery gets vandalised several times a year. This still happens.

I also got beat up a lot for being seen as somebody weaker than the natives. Go on show us your Bruce lee moves then. Wottaahhh Karate chop me. My nose has been broken so many times I can't breathe through it.

However.

It depends how you define racism. (I'm ethnically Chinese btw for full disclosure)

Name calling I don't consider racism... as it is like football fans calling each other *ankers.

However I've been name called plenty of times regularly almost. Bruce lee type taunting noises occur EVERY SINGLE DAY. This is not just children who know no better but grown men and women.

In work places they'll say go see the ch*nky guy at the back. Even in the council where I worked briefly with me stood behind the bosses they'd say oh your teacher is the ch*nk, Lets go for a ch*nky take out.


Other things

Racism is heavy in the work place. I always try a trick. I apply with my real name and I also apply as Mr Ken Morgan. Ken Morgan gets many more replies than my real name there is no explanation for this other than racism.

Or the fact that shop keepers see you're Chinese and expect you to give them a tip. I went for a hair cut the other day. it was £7. I gave him £10. He didn't give me any change. I challenged him about it and he said all ch*nks are rich and they always give it me as a tip.

People always say where do you come from then implying this isn't my home.

People always say where are you from? no where do you really come from

People always say when are you going back implying this isn't my home.

People always say oh your English is so good.

My car is assumed to be GIVEN to me by the government because I'm deemed to be an immigrant.



Identity crisis

I don't fit in back home in Asia either.
Original post by CarlNorthWest
You could not get me one white beggar who would swap places with me.


This is really twisted. I doubt you have ever been homeless.
Original post by CarlNorthWest
Don't it twisted - everyone has problems - but for whites, dealing with race, not just in the UK but worldwide, is not a problem for you.


That is a pretty bold statement and wrong.
Original post by cymon tuggs
I think the OP is right. White English people probably do, on the whole look down on South Asians, but it is very subtle and complex.

What can be done about it though? .




The problem will resolve itself in Britain by 2050. White people are simply going to be completely outbred and will be a minority. I'm not kidding. Because in Southern China a certain group of ethnic non Han Chinese were dominant. The Han Chinese then moved in and outbred this group at a rate of 6-1. It ended up in a massive civil war. This small group did not practice footbinding and women were required to fight as well.

The population declined from about 4 million to about 132,000 today.
Original post by Justpin
The problem will resolve itself in Britain by 2050. White people are simply going to be completely outbred and will be a minority. I'm not kidding. Because in Southern China a certain group of ethnic non Han Chinese were dominant. The Han Chinese then moved in and outbred this group at a rate of 6-1. It ended up in a massive civil war. This small group did not practice footbinding and women were required to fight as well.

The population declined from about 4 million to about 132,000 today.


Wow, willing people to become a minority in their own land then talking about 'racism'.


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Original post by Baibastaiy

White English people don't like South Asians. They aren't going to change any time soon. So I am going to leave.



This isn't a panacea.

In that I am similar to you (but older). I find myself not really accepted where my parents were born.

The fact I look slightly different (food, exercise, climate, attitude), walk differently and even speak the language but with 20 years out of date mannerisms and slang means people can pin you for an outsider immediately.

I also reject many ingrained ideas of automatic respect.

Respect me cus I'm older than you!

I pop their bubbles by saying why should I.

There is also white privilege and reverse racism. In China for instance they will hire an unqualified white person over heavily qualified black, Indian or Far Eastern Asians.


Or they'll hire you but pay you less.

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