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    The majority of the population is not that size.
    Should we stop casting attractive men and women in films too?

    (Original post by mipmapped)
    Should we stop casting attractive men and women in films too?
    Is it life threatening to be beautiful? Because being anorexic is. Having an unhealthy relationship with food is bad news.
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    Is it life threatening to be beautiful? Because being anorexic is. Having an unhealthy relationship with food is bad news.
    It's life threatening being a stuntman (or stuntwoman). People still do it, because there's a demand for it, and they're good at it, and they enjoy it.

    I think it's wrong to assume that all models are anorexic, although, I have no data on the rates of eating disorders in models.
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    My repsonse was more directed to your assertion that models aren't representative of the general population.

    Most men don't look like Mr Pitt or Depp.

    (Original post by mipmapped)
    It's life threatening being a stuntman (or stuntwoman). People still do it, because there's a demand for it, and they're good at it, and they enjoy it.

    I think it's wrong to assume that all models are anorexic, although, I have no data on the rates of eating disorders in models.
    You're missing the point entirely, people are good at being skinny? Er...

    Advertising is the topic.
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    You're missing the point entirely, people are good at being skinny? Er...

    Advertising is the topic.
    The right of individuals to do as they wish with their own bodies, and the rights of privates companies to employ those people is completely relevant to the topic.
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    (Original post by DanGrover)
    But they are apparently denying the right of private organisations to advertise how they like.
    Yup. Just as we do with smoking, drinking, and indeed all advertising

    (Original post by DanGrover)
    I don't understand how this is relevant.
    Basically, your rights to do something are not equal to your rights to do it for money. Strange, but fortunately true.
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    (Original post by Mercer)
    Yup. Just as we do with smoking, drinking, and indeed all advertising.
    The fact those limitations to freedom exist isn't justification for more to exist. We shouldn't be sacrificing liberty just to keep up continuity. For what reason shouldn't they be allowed to model in advertising?

    Basically, your rights to do something are not equal to your rights to do it for money. Strange, but fortunately true.
    'Fortunately' ? :confused: Anyway, I understand what you said, I just don't understand it's relevance. This debate is about whether bullemic girls should be allowed to be used in advertisement.
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    (Original post by DanGrover)
    The fact those limitations to freedom exist isn't justification for more to exist. We shouldn't be sacrificing liberty just to keep up continuity. For what reason shouldn't they be allowed to model in advertising?
    Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that. I was simply pointing out that it isn't a totally off the wall idea. Obviously if you think smoking adverts are OK, drink adverts implying it's good for you etc should be allowed - in other words if you believe the market sorts stuff out - then you would reject this off-hand.

    If not, then it's still highly debateable, and I don't have a clear position. I think it can be argued on the grounds that the people influenced are often underage, which undermines the rationality argument, and because adverts so clearly use the idea that the person in them is aspirational. Of course, you could also argue that the models shouldn't be in a position where they have to be unhealthily thin to keep their jobs, akin to normal health and safety regulations, bans on bare-fist-boxing etc.

    (Original post by DanGrover)
    'Fortunately' ? :confused: Anyway, I understand what you said, I just don't understand it's relevance. This debate is about whether bullemic girls should be allowed to be used in advertisement.
    Fortunately because it would mean that poor people or people bad at reading contracts would have a LOT more to lose, and that would just cause misery.

    It's only relevant for those arguing from a 'market anarchist' perspective really.
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    (Original post by Timeslikethese)
    From advertising? I don't often see that..
    Obesity is a greater threat to health than anorexia, generally, therefore fat people should be censored from our adverts.

    (Original post by Timeslikethese)
    It's true that most models are underweight and they seem to be the pick of the advertising crop, I don't understand why to be quite honest. The majority of the population is not that size. So it's extremely aspirational, in adverts the message is clear - do as I do.
    Because skinny people look better than overweight people.
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    (Original post by poltroon)
    Obesity is a greater threat to health than anorexia, generally, therefore fat people should be censored from our adverts.
    That's actually very dodgy. You have to be extremely fat for it to be more damaging than anorexia. Plus, very few adverts make being fat aspirational

    (Original post by poltroon)
    Because skinny people look better than overweight people.
    Anorexic people don't. Unless these adverts have worked on you....
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    [QUOTE=Mercer]That's actually very dodgy. You have to be extremely fat for it to be more damaging than anorexia. Plus, very few adverts make being fat aspirational

    I heard that the UK was facing an 'obesity crisis' because of expanding waistlines. Recent data demonstrates that we're the fatties of Europe. I'm sure you can agree that, of the two extremes, obesity rather than anorexia poses the greater threat to the general well-being of the UK's population.

    (Original post by Mercer)
    Anorexic people don't. Unless these adverts have worked on you....
    I meant skinny in the thin rather than the anorexic sense.
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    (Original post by Mercer)
    Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that. I was simply pointing out that it isn't a totally off the wall idea. Obviously if you think smoking adverts are OK, drink adverts implying it's good for you etc should be allowed - in other words if you believe the market sorts stuff out - then you would reject this off-hand.
    Woahhh, you made quite a leap there from "drink adverts implying it's good for you' - which is a blatant lie - from some underweight girls wearing some clothes. There's no lie, no illusion there.

    If not, then it's still highly debateable, and I don't have a clear position. I think it can be argued on the grounds that the people influenced are often underage, which undermines the rationality argument, and because adverts so clearly use the idea that the person in them is aspirational. Of course, you could also argue that the models shouldn't be in a position where they have to be unhealthily thin to keep their jobs, akin to normal health and safety regulations, bans on bare-fist-boxing etc.
    Is that any different to actors who have to lose/put on weight for a movie role? Specifically altering your weight and thus image like that isn't good for you either, but they have to do it to get jobs.

    Fortunately because it would mean that poor people or people bad at reading contracts would have a LOT more to lose, and that would just cause misery.
    I really don't understand what you're talking about here.

    It's only relevant for those arguing from a 'market anarchist' perspective really.
    There is a fairly large gap between being an anarchist and believing it's right for the government to censor advertisments that don't lie or mislead.
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    (Original post by poltroon)
    I heard that the UK was facing an 'obesity crisis' because of expanding waistlines. Recent data demonstrates that we're the fatties of Europe. I'm sure you can agree that, of the two extremes, obesity rather than anorexia poses the greater threat to the general well-being of the UK's population.
    True. But fat people on screen probably don't cause that.

    (Original post by poltroon)
    I meant skinny in the thin rather than the anorexic sense.
    What's that got to do with the problem of extremely underweight models? :confused:

    (Original post by DanGrover)
    Woahhh, you made quite a leap there from "drink adverts implying it's good for you' - which is a blatant lie - from some underweight girls wearing some clothes. There's no lie, no illusion there.

    I really don't understand what you're talking about here.

    There is a fairly large gap between being an anarchist and believing it's right for the government to censor advertisments that don't lie or mislead.
    All of these relate to the fact I was talking about market anarchism of numero sept's kind. If you have a more case by case basis, which you seem to, then they're probably not pertinent.

    (Original post by DanGrover)
    Is that any different to actors who have to lose/put on weight for a movie role? Specifically altering your weight and thus image like that isn't good for you either, but they have to do it to get jobs.
    True. But there are less cases, it's less widespread, and actors tend to get more choice as the sort of actor asked to do that is usually quite well known.
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    (Original post by Mercer)
    True. But fat people on screen probably don't cause that.

    Why wouldn't they? Take any famous fat person, like that comedian, what's his name? Peter Kay, for example, is an overweight role model, displaying his body on screen amounts to saying that fat is good, because fat people can be hugely successful, too.

    (Original post by Mercer)
    What's that got to do with the problem of extremely underweight models? :confused:

    I was just saying that skinny models are in demand because they make clothes look better than fat people would.
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    Ok, so the girls who are models need to be 5'10" at least and a size ten, because that's the size designer make their samples in. So, a far simpler solution to all this would be to make the samples larger, say size 12. For someone of that height they are going to look better at a size 12 than a size ten. I know, because I'm 6' tall and with a size 16 bum and a size ten waist, if I tried to lose 15kg to get to be a size ten all over, my hip bones would stick out more (they do at the mo!) and I'd have no tits. Which would be a travesty for mankind.

    Models are always going to be skinny/slim. They don't need to look like they need a good feed.
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    Should advertising using muscular male models be banned, in case it encourages guys to use steroids? Or should companies have the freedom to advertise in any way they want?
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    (Original post by DanGrover)
    Woahhh, you made quite a leap there from "drink adverts implying it's good for you' - which is a blatant lie - from some underweight girls wearing some clothes. There's no lie, no illusion there.
    ok so getting underwieght girls then airbrushing their photos to hide all the boney unnattractive bits, the putting them in an ad implying that if you buy x product you will look as great as the woman in the picture is somehow better than implying that drinking is good for you? *finaly takes a breath*

    and to dyslexic banana: the men in adverts usually look slim and healthy with small but well defined muscles. if they looked like arnie in his hay day then you would have a point.
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    (Original post by poltroon)
    Why wouldn't they? Take any famous fat person, like that comedian, what's his name? Peter Kay, for example, is an overweight role model, displaying his body on screen amounts to saying that fat is good, because fat people can be hugely successful, too.
    Fat comedians aren't chosen for their fat. Many are very self-deprecating about it. The fact you say 'hugely successful, too' just shows the attitude: EVEN fat people can be attractive.

    With models on the other hand, they're chosen for their skinniness, and it's their looks, not their humour, which is presented as aspirational.

    (Original post by poltroon)
    I was just saying that skinny models are in demand because they make clothes look better than fat people would.
    Again, there's no problem with skinny, against fat. There's a problem with anorexic, against healthy.
 
 
 
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