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If the woman wants to abort the child Watch

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    (Original post by SophieSmall)
    But how should the law intervene? In what way? What laws do you think should be put in place?

    The only thing I could think of would be forcing the woman to go through with the pregnancy which would go against her autonomy rights.
    But the woman chose to have sex with the man (who may be willing to have children), why should he be punished because of her insensitivity to human life?

    You speak about the rights of the woman but doesnt a man have the right to become a father?
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    (Original post by Professor Purple)
    But the woman chose to have sex with the man (who may be willing to have children), why should he be punished because of her insensitivity to human life?

    You speak about the rights of the woman but doesnt a man have the right to become a father?

    Because of autonomy rights, you cannot force someone to go through a pregnancy for a child they do not want.

    Then he should have chosen a partner who wanted children. I sympathise with men who loose their potential children I do, but I also sympathise with absolute horrors of forced pregnancy and childbirth.
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    The number of means of preventing motherhood, far far outweigh those preventing fatherhood. Motherhood is essentially a voluntary action by a woman in the modern world and if a man therefore decides that he doesn't want to support the child, he shouldn't have to.
    The problem with this is that it is the child who would suffer. Women also have to pay out if they leave the child with the father. The reason they have a choice Pre birth and men don't is something we can't control.

    In the eyes of the law, foetuses are not fully human/ alive, hence abortion is not considered harmful to a human being. But a child does have those rights, and the right for a child to grow up with enough money is considered more important than the uninterested parent's right to keep all their money.

    The contract you suggest is unfeasible for that reason - the prioritisation of rights in the eyes of the law is not in favour of it.
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    (Original post by M1011)
    How could you possibly know what I understand? Don't post if you're not going to add anything...
    By your responses to him? And the fact that he just said the same thing as me :laugh:
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    Overall you're missing my point.

    There have been so many advances in contraception, morning after pills and abortions in recent years (all of these affect women only), that it can be argued nowadays that preventing childbirth is inherently a woman's responsibility and not a man's.

    If a man chooses not to wear a condom, then the women can choose not to sleep with him, or take her own birth control.

    Years ago, Condoms were the only affective means of birth control. That is not the case any more, huge numbers of women take their own birth control regiment. If Condoms split or pills are missed, the morning after pill is there as a back up. This is the woman's responsibility. Following that, Abortion is there. This is the womans responsibility.

    The number of means of preventing motherhood, far far outweigh those preventing fatherhood. Motherhood is essentially a voluntary action by a woman in the modern world and if a man therefore decides that he doesn't want to support the child, he shouldn't have to.
    "There have been so many advances in contraception, morning after pills and abortions in recent years (all of these affect women only), that it can be argued nowadays that preventing childbirth is inherently a woman's responsibility and not a man's."

    This is entirely wrong (in my opinion).

    It isn't the man's responsibility. It isn't the woman's responsibility. It is a joint responsibility. By either party not using contraception, that member is consenting to a potential pregnancy. It is not the man's right to not wear contraception and expect the woman to take that responsibility, any more than it's a woman's right to expect the same the other way around.

    In short, if YOU don't want a child then YOU have the responsibility to use contraception. End of.
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    (Original post by bittr n swt)
    Women have too many rights in this which I feel is outdated.

    Sadly legally we are nothing but sugardaddies (not meant in that way lol)
    We deserve to have rights over our own bodies
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    (Original post by SophieSmall)
    Because of autonomy rights, you cannot force someone to go through a pregnancy for a child they do not want.

    Then he should have chosen a partner who wanted children. I sympathise with men who loose their potential children I do, but I also sympathise with absolute horrors of forced pregnancy and childbirth.
    So why does a man who didnt want the child have to suffer with the horrors of child support payments?
    Women can't have it both ways
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    (Original post by Professor Purple)
    So why does a man who didnt want the child have to suffer with the horrors of child support payments?
    Women can't have it both ways
    I do not believe he should have to, if it can be proven that he did not agree to have the child (such as with a method sulpha suggested)

    I don't believe we should, don't assume to know what I think
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    And we deserve rights over our finances.
    You don't have to live with morning sickness and swollen feet and pains.
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    (Original post by Annabelle-xx)
    We deserve to have rights over our own bodies
    Of course but there's no denying that:

    a) baby is the fathers too
    b) the man can suffer mentally
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    That wouldn't be my decision and I don't deserve to be penalised for it.

    If you can't deal with it then have an abortion.
    So yes,you aren't the one suffering. Your input is very minimal,you don't get to have a say at all.
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    (Original post by Annabelle-xx)
    You don't have to live with morning sickness and swollen feet and pains.
    Childbirth isnt that bad, grow up.

    You just said you have the right to do what you like with your body (in your previous post) but doesnt the child inside the woman allowed to live? Seeing as it has half of the man's genetic info, why should the woman decide?
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    Your attitude belongs in the 1600's. It has no place in the modern world where women can quite easily not have a child.

    It's not a silly idea, obviously in most situations the man will sign and that will be the norm.

    But it will protect men who don't want to have a child. If a man and a woman have sex, the man wants the child and the woman doesn't, the woman can abort it. If the woman wants it and the man doesn't she can keep it. Men have no rights at all. The contract would just mean that men who don't want the child don't have to support it if the woman wants to keep it.
    You make it out like abortion is easy.
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    So just to clarify, the child is yours, is nothing to do with the biological father, he has no input, but still has to financially support it ?
    I said,his input is minimal. He doesn't have to live with the consequences of his actions,the woman does and has to endure it for 9 whole months. Why should he get to decide whether it not she gets to have an abortion? If she wants one he should be more than supportive and bend over backwards to help her.
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    (Original post by Professor Purple)
    Childbirth isnt that bad, grow up.

    You just said you have the right to do what you like with your body (in your previous post) but doesnt the child inside the woman allowed to live? Seeing as it has half of the man's genetic info, why should the woman decide?
    No,if it's aborted early on,it's not really a child just yet. The mother knows what's best for her and it's only fair that she gets to decide. She is the one who has to go through it all. So you've been through childbirth?
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    I don't think it's easy, but I don't see what being hard justifies exactly.
    "If she doesn't want it she can abort it"


    It's not like chucking away a cup of cold tea. Any decision a woman makes regarding an unwanted pregnancy is a lose lose situation.

    At least a man can just walk away.
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    I don't think the man should get to decide whether a woman gets an abortion. I think it's her choice.

    But if the woman does decide to keep it and the man doesn't, he shouldn't have to financially support it.
    But it's half his as it's a born baby.

    You can't compare a brought to term new born to an 8 week old foetus
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    I don't think the man should get to decide whether a woman gets an abortion. I think it's her choice.

    But if the woman does decide to keep it and the man doesn't, he shouldn't have to financially support it.
    He should because he's the one who got her pregnant in the first place unless it was a miraculous conception
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    He can't though, he's legally liable to pay for it for 18 years.

    Having an abortion is hard, I'd argue supporting a child you didn't want for 18 years is harder.
    It's financially harder. Not emotionally or physically. You can pay and not have anything to do with it. And the system is so screwy that a lot of fathers don't pay for their kids and don't get chased up on it
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    (Original post by Sulpha)
    Nope.

    If men have no say in whether they want the child, then women should base her decision upon whether or not she can raise it herself.

    If not, she should abort it.
    That's disgusting. Men should take more responsibility for their actions
 
 
 
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