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how much would the whole NHS sell for Watch

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    (Original post by Quady)
    How are they the main culprits since most of the economy is made of SMEs?

    So where does the VAT go that I pay to Vodafone? How do they avoid paying NI and income tax? How do they avoid business rates?

    Edit
    And I asked how you would 'get the money from them'.
    They avoid it by sticking their money in an offshore bank account and avoid paying tax. Phillip Green puts everything in his wifes name and sends it over to Monaco.

    How would I get money from them?
    Simple, create legislation to close down the loopholes. Make tax avoidance illegal and have very heavy penalties for those who continue to do it.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    How about getting the money from big corporations who put all their money in off shore bank accounts and pay no tax?
    Rather than letting people who can't afford healthcare die on the streets.
    So a tiny fraction of the business sector then.

    Nobody dies on the street in developed countries who cannot afford health care.
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    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    So a tiny fraction of the business sector then.

    Nobody dies on the street in developed countries who cannot afford health care.
    How about USA? where 40 million can't afford healthcare and people have to sell their houses to get treatment? My grandfather got life saving treatment on the NHS that he could not have afforded otherwise.

    Yeah you're right though. Let's live in a world where only the rich deserve to be able to live.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    How about USA? where 40 million can't afford healthcare and people have to sell their houses to get treatment? My grandfather got life saving treatment on the NHS that he could not have afforded otherwise.

    Yeah you're right though. Let's live in a world where only the rich deserve to be able to live.
    Prove that this is going to happen in the UK.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    How about USA? where 40 million can't afford healthcare and people have to sell their houses to get treatment? My grandfather got life saving treatment on the NHS that he could not have afforded otherwise.

    Yeah you're right though. Let's live in a world where only the rich deserve to be able to live.
    You mean the is that had Medicare and has now moved to a universal healthcare system.

    Europe seems to manage with a mix of private and public healthcare treatment.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    It would not really be feasible to sell the NHS as one huge block given how few competitors would have the capital to bid, especially if you obligated them to maintain universality.

    Instead a sale of the NHS (actual sale rather than franchising) would see it broken down into its constituent functions.
    There are big healthcare companies that could be interested in buying it out.

    what's the current book value of NHS ?
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    £1 like the Evening Standard
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    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    You mean the is that had Medicare and has now moved to a universal healthcare system.

    Europe seems to manage with a mix of private and public healthcare treatment.
    Absolutely correct! I must have been on 100s of threads saying this, they use private hospitals who are refunded by the taxpayer, apart from in the Netherlands I think but can't imagine Sweden doing that
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    (Original post by zedeneye1)
    There are big healthcare companies that could be interested in buying it out.

    what's the current book value of NHS ?
    Yes but the government would want the most bidders to force up the price.

    Lib said around 45bn.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Prove that this is going to happen in the UK.
    Why wouldn't it?
    Private healthcare is private healthcare. It runs on an insurance based system and therefore patients (people) are treated as assets.
    If you have been ill in the past or overcome cancer you would be regarded as too much of a liability and not cost worthy, you would be denied healthcare. This happens with thousands of people in America.
    Then there's the fact that you have to be able to afford healthcare, if you can't you're left with a very poor quality state system because they don't direct much taxation there.
    The rich can afford to live, the poor can't.

    They don't care about the people, they care about their profits.
    I for one think it is morally repugnant to treat peoples' health as a business.

    But as for asking me to prove it? Well mate the onus is on you to prove it wouldn't because you're the one advocating for change for the officially best healthcare system in the world and you have to prove this change wouldn't be detrimental.
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    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    You mean the is that had Medicare and has now moved to a universal healthcare system.

    Europe seems to manage with a mix of private and public healthcare treatment.
    The universal healthcare system is so poor because so little taxation goes there.
    Europe may manage but the NHS is officially rated the best in the world so i'll take our public healthcare system.

    Businessmen should not be allowed near peoples' health.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    Why wouldn't it?
    Private healthcare is private healthcare. It runs on an insurance based system and therefore patients (people) are treated as assets.
    If you have been ill in the past or overcome cancer you would be regarded as too much of a liability and not cost worthy, you would be denied healthcare. This happens with thousands of people in America.
    Then there's the fact that you have to be able to afford healthcare, if you can't you're left with a very poor quality state system because they don't direct much taxation there.
    The rich can afford to live, the poor can't.

    They don't care about the people, they care about their profits.
    I for one think it is morally repugnant to treat peoples' health as a business.

    But as for asking me to prove it? Well mate the onus is on you to prove it wouldn't because you're the one advocating for change for the officially best healthcare system in the world and you have to prove this change wouldn't be detrimental.
    I meant prove that we'll end up with a private system in the UK.

    I'm not advocating that scale of change. I want outpatient services removed from the NHS unless your a pensioner, child or unemployed but for the most part in happy with current NHS (just dislike the blank cheque and think services should be reduced).

    We have the second most efficient (behind France and its social insurance model incidentally). I've seen nothing to suggest we are top for outcomes.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    I meant prove that we'll end up with a private system in the UK.

    I'm not advocating that scale of change. I want outpatient services removed from the NHS unless your a pensioner, child or unemployed but for the most part in happy with current NHS (just dislike the blank cheque and think services should be reduced).

    We have the second most efficient (behind France and its social insurance model incidentally). I've seen nothing to suggest we are top for outcomes.
    I want far more taxation directed there and to keep private companies and vested interests as far away from such a sensitive issue as possible.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    The universal healthcare system is so poor because so little taxation goes there.
    Europe may manage but the NHS is officially rated the best in the world so i'll take our public healthcare system.

    Businessmen should not be allowed near peoples' health.
    The American system is poor because their concept of universality was simply to make having private insurance mandatory. They are less efficient not because of a lack of subsidies per say (they actual spend more capita) but because of a lack of competition (in the UK private health insurance is cheap because people have the NHS as an option).

    With that being said however the US does have its good aspects. Actual outcomes and quality of care are comparable to Europe and the UK for the most part and actually many businesses do provide health insurance which given strained NHS resources is certainly something that we should take away from them.

    I disagree with your last point. The NHS has improved significantly since Blair introduced market components and it has become no worse under the coalition despite around 20bn of internal cuts and the Lansley reform, if anything its a shame that they are too scared politically to do much.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    I want far more taxation directed there and to keep private companies and vested interests as far away from such a sensitive issue as possible.
    What benefits will these measures bring beyond satisfying the ideological whims of the left.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    What benefits will these measures bring beyond satisfying the ideological whims of the left.
    It would bring far more money and It means it won't be treated as a business and they won't be looking to cut custs and cut corners to the detriment of the patients.
    It's morally disgusting to treat peoples health as a business, especially necessary treatment.
    The NHS is rated the best in the world. Why change it?
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Yes but the government would want the most bidders to force up the price.

    Lib said around 45bn.
    45bn is not too expensive. And companies of this size are not completely sold off. Only a share, say 40% of it may be sold for lets say USD20B. And there are many companies that could buy it whole as well with leverage.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    The universal healthcare system is so poor because so little taxation goes there.
    Europe may manage but the NHS is officially rated the best in the world so i'll take our public healthcare system.

    Businessmen should not be allowed near peoples' health.
    The NHS is rated as one of the best in the world.

    Businessmen run BUPA. That seems to provide a good service.
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    I think if they ran it as an auction as they did with 3g and 4g they could end up getting far more than the £100bn it is probably worth
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    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    The NHS is rated as one of the best in the world.

    Businessmen run BUPA. That seems to provide a good service.
    Provide a good service to those who can afford it and only to those who can afford it.
    Healthcare is a right, not a luxury.
 
 
 
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