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how much would the whole NHS sell for Watch

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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    Provide a good service to those who can afford it and only to those who can afford it.
    Healthcare is a right, not a luxury.
    Healthcare is a luxury for developed nations.

    All of Europe seems to manage to provide healthcare with a public/private finance model.

    I think you're falling for the horror story's the trades Union are coming out with.
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    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    Healthcare is a luxury for developed nations.

    All of Europe seems to manage to provide healthcare with a public/private finance model.

    I think you're falling for the horror story's the trades Union are coming out with.
    And we have better healthcare than anyone else in Europe.
    It's no horror story, one only has to look at how it is in America.
    Unless you want a system where only the rich should be allowed to live?
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    Provide a good service to those who can afford it and only to those who can afford it.
    Healthcare is a right, not a luxury.
    There are many different packages you can take. While its clearly not feasible to offer heart surgery through private insurance at an affordable cost, I was recently quoted 7 quid a month for outpatient insurance which includes plenty of the type of stuff (foot specialists ECT..) that you'd spend 2 years on an NHS waiting list for.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    There are many different packages you can take. While its clearly not feasible to offer heart surgery through private insurance at an affordable cost, I was recently quoted 7 quid a month for outpatient insurance which includes plenty of the type of stuff (foot specialists ECT..) that you'd spend 2 years on an NHS waiting list for.
    That's because the NHS is massively underfunded...
    It's not a bottomless pit. Maybe if the very wealthy didn't tax avoid there wouldn't be a 2 year waiting list.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    That's because the NHS is massively underfunded...
    It's not a bottomless pit. Maybe if the very wealthy didn't tax avoid there wouldn't be a 2 year waiting list.
    And people who earn less than £10k a year...
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    They avoid it by sticking their money in an offshore bank account and avoid paying tax. Phillip Green puts everything in his wifes name and sends it over to Monaco.

    How would I get money from them?
    Simple, create legislation to close down the loopholes. Make tax avoidance illegal and have very heavy penalties for those who continue to do it.
    So they avoid tax on interest which is currently at historically low levels?

    Can you be specific about what legislation you'd bring in? 'loopholes' is a very generic cop-out term - like when governments say they'll cut down on 'waste'.

    So when I put money in an ISA to avoid tax, you'd put a very heavy penalty on me?
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    That's because the NHS is massively underfunded...
    It's not a bottomless pit. Maybe if the very wealthy didn't tax avoid there wouldn't be a 2 year waiting list.
    How much money should the NHS have then? - if its not a bottomless pit that must be quantifiable.
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    (Original post by Quady)
    So when I put money in an ISA to avoid tax, you'd put a very heavy penalty on me?
    :yawn: Again??111!!/

    Paying money into an ISA is not tax avoidance.
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    (Original post by n00)
    :yawn: Again??111!!/

    Paying money into an ISA is not tax avoidance.
    Pretty sure I'm avoiding tax....
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    (Original post by Quady)
    Pretty sure I'm avoiding tax....
    That's nice.
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    (Original post by Quady)
    So they avoid tax on interest which is currently at historically low levels?

    Can you be specific about what legislation you'd bring in? 'loopholes' is a very generic cop-out term - like when governments say they'll cut down on 'waste'.

    So when I put money in an ISA to avoid tax, you'd put a very heavy penalty on me?
    Tax avoidance costs the country 125 billion pounds a year.
    Benefit fraud, which is wrong also costs the country 1 billion a year.
    Guess which one the government and right wing press focus more on.

    Is it acceptable that the already exceptionally wealthy get away with paying tax?
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    (Original post by Quady)
    How much money should the NHS have then? - if its not a bottomless pit that must be quantifiable.
    It should have as much money as it needs to ensure everyone in the country has a high quality, free at the point of use healthcare without long waiting times.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    It should have as much money as it needs to ensure everyone in the country has a high quality, free at the point of use healthcare without long waiting times.
    So it is a bottomless pit then?

    'High quality' and 'long waiting times' could mean anything.

    It could mean having three doctors in your house 24/7 and a hospital on every street...
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    (Original post by Quady)
    So it is a bottomless pit then?

    'High quality' and 'long waiting times' could mean anything.

    It could mean having three doctors in your house 24/7 and a hospital on every street...
    Well it clearly doesn't mean that.
    Stop being pedantic and all technical.
    I mean enough money that one doesn't have to wait 6 months for a hip replacement or 6 days to see a doctor.
    125 billion is lost every year in tax avoidance. That's 125 billion that could go to the NHS.

    The NHS is badly underfunded, it needs a hell of a lot more money pumped into it.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    Tax avoidance costs the country 125 billion pounds a year.
    Benefit fraud, which is wrong also costs the country 1 billion a year.
    Guess which one the government and right wing press focus more on.

    Is it acceptable that the already exceptionally wealthy get away with paying tax?
    I'd quibble with the NAO methodology from my experience of the benefits system. When it came to crisis loans I felt it was more like 1/3 of claims weren't genuine. But whatever,.

    I think they more focus on people who claim legitimately but the press feel the people should be able to claim (eg families with 15kids, or unemployed over a year or are on disability benefit for 'depression'. None of those things are fraud though.

    The Government has put much more money into combating tax evasion.

    Can I ask again, what laws you would put in place? ie to turn avoidance into evasion.

    Or have you no idea?
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    Well it clearly doesn't mean that.
    Stop being pedantic and all technical.
    I mean enough money that one doesn't have to wait 6 months for a hip replacement or 6 days to see a doctor.
    125 billion is lost every year in tax avoidance. That's 125 billion that could go to the NHS.

    The NHS is badly underfunded, it needs a hell of a lot more money pumped into it.
    Can you stop being generic?

    So £125bn/year would do it?
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    (Original post by Quady)
    I'd quibble with the NAO methodology from my experience of the benefits system. When it came to crisis loans I felt it was more like 1/3 of claims weren't genuine. But whatever,.

    I think they more focus on people who claim legitimately but the press feel the people should be able to claim (eg families with 15kids, or unemployed over a year or are on disability benefit for 'depression'. None of those things are fraud though.

    The Government has put much more money into combating tax evasion.

    Can I ask again, what laws you would put in place? ie to turn avoidance into evasion.

    Or have you no idea?
    I'm not a politician mate.
    I don't know the ins and outs and intricate, finer details and neither do you.
    To say that something that is morally wrong, that costs this country hundreds of billions of pounds every year should be allowed because a poster on TSR can't give a succinct definition of the words of legislation to combat tax avoidance is a ridiculous argument. It's not my job to, it's the job of those in power.
    I don't however buy into the view that 'it's impossible' ,pull our own trousers down for them and dance to their tune.
    Especially when the government then decides to make up this lost revenue from the poor and by selling off public services.

    The government has done nothing to combat tax avoidance. Why would they when two of their biggest donors, Ashcroft and Green, are two of the biggest culprits? They are not going to go against their backers. It's not in the Conservative party's interests to do so.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    I'm not a politician mate.
    I don't know the ins and outs and intricate, finer details and neither do you.
    To say that something that is morally wrong, that costs this country hundreds of billions of pounds every year should be allowed because a poster on TSR can't give a succinct definition of the words of legislation to combat tax avoidance is a ridiculous argument. It's not my job to, it's the job of those in power.
    I don't however buy into the view that 'it's impossible' ,pull our own trousers down for them and dance to their tune.
    Especially when the government then decides to make up this lost revenue from the poor and by selling off public services.

    The government has done nothing to combat tax avoidance. Why would they when two of their biggest donors, Ashcroft and Green, are two of the biggest culprits? They are not going to go against their backers. It's not in the Conservative party's interests to do so.
    They haven't done much because there's not much that can be done - that's why I'm asking what the solution is, because nobody else seems to know...

    Getting cross border VAT sorted a bit yesterday was a bit of a win though wasn't it?
 
 
 
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