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Why are you against feminism? watch

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    I'm just curious, after a recent post. Just to clarify: Feminism is defined as the equal rights of men and women. Just wondering, not asking for a debate as such or comments from people who think it is anything other than how it is defined...
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    I don't want the society to change because the current unfair state of things benefits me and I don't care about other people?

    Oh wait I'm not against feminism :P Maybe we should just start saying egalitarianism or something because the "fem" part makes some people go crazy.
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    Because I don't want women to be superior. They want to be superior and oppress men. They don't care about us, only about their rights.


    This is why I support mens right movement.
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    (Original post by Viridiana)
    I don't want the society to change because the current unfair state of things benefits me and I don't care about other people?
    Why does it translate to not caring about other people?
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    (Original post by angel2015)
    I'm just curious, after a recent post. Just to clarify: Feminism is defined as the equal rights of men and women. Just wondering, not asking for a debate as such or comments from people who think it is anything other than how it is defined...
    For the last time. Feminism is defined in more ways than the one you give.

    For the last time. Even the single definition you posted can and is interpreted in a great many ways - hence the innumerable wings of feminism.

    For the last time. What a movement claims to want and what it actually pursues and its effect in reality are two different things.

    There are very, very few people nowadays who don't support gender equality in some form, but many of these people don't believe feminism is a force for good in achieving this, and even that it introduces more inequality into society than it removes.
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    (Original post by catsis)
    Why does it translate to not caring about other people?
    If you don't care about half the society having it worse, it's probably because you don't care or you enjoy it?
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    (Original post by Viridiana)
    If you don't care about half the society having it worse, it's probably because you don't care or you enjoy it?
    Women don't 'have it worse' than men in our society today - abandon the victim complex.
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    (Original post by Birkenhead)
    Women don't 'have it worse' than men in our society today - abandon the victim complex.
    I'm not acting like a victim and saying people chase me in the streets or want to stone me (the majority :P), I'm just stating the fact which is that being male = privilege. Be it, in a modern society, slight.

    And my previous statement was theoretical. If you're against equality then you're for inequality, so you're OK with some people having it worse for no reason.
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    (Original post by Viridiana)
    I'm not acting like a victim and saying people chase me in the streets or want to stone me (the majority :P), I'm just stating the fact which is that being male = privilege. Be it, in a modern society, slight.

    And my previous statement was theoretical. If you're against equality then you're for inequality, so you're OK with some people having it worse for no reason.
    Please see above. Being against feminism does not mean you are against equality.
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    (Original post by Viridiana)
    I'm not acting like a victim and saying people chase me in the streets or want to stone me (the majority :P), I'm just stating the fact which is that being male = privilege. Be it, in a modern society, slight.
    I completely disagree. Men are not 'privileged'. Both sexes have their own share of problems but if anyone is privileged I should think it would be the gender favoured in custody, helped by quotas and positive discrimination, given more redress by the justice system in cases of domestic violence, given significantly softer sentences... I don't see much male privilege but I see rather a lot of it for women.

    And my previous statement was theoretical. If you're against equality then you're for inequality, so you're OK with some people having it worse for no reason.
    If you're for equality of opportunity and not an artificially created equality of outcome then you expect and accept that an inequality of outcome is likely and that this is not a bad thing.
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    Let's take your definition of feminism (which I believe is the correct theoretical definition). My first issue is: if the movement wants equality for men and women, then why is the movement clearly biased towards and fighting for women to a greater extent, with regards to the word "feminism"? This is clearly a hypocritical stance.

    The main reason I am against feminism is simply the way they go about things. Feminist preachings often portray all men as evil, groping, sexually harassing pigs and women as victims in nearly every single encounter between two or more members of the opposite sex. Let's take, for example, politely holding a door open. To feminists, this is like the man has just drop kicked a baby. For another guy or a less hateful woman this is just a polite gesture, a gesture which we carry out when it is us at the door first as we would like people to do the same for us. Why are the different connotations of the same action? I myself hold doors open for people if they are going to be reaching it in a few seconds no matter if they are a guy or a girl - it doesn't make much difference.

    That's what really gets me. How the *fem*inists campaign for equal rights and position in society, yet oppress and vindicate men whenever possible (generally when men are just simply being polite, courteous human beings); they see this as completely fine, yet if men acted the same way towards women, they would instantly play the sexism card. They hate men (which still goes against the whole equality thing) which is completely unfair - we didn't choose to be born male. It's not like we all used some sort of telepathic communication before we were born to plan our evil schemes against women... "pay for her drink, that will really piss her off, even though it's no different to what you would do for your best guy friend!".

    As someone else commented, there are situations in which men are treated unfairly. For example, feminists think it's so unfair they if they get paid a bit less than a male counterpart (who, being a man, is obviously is a lazy molester who is awful at his job, turns up to work drunk and is favoured by the boss because of their chats about football, and obviously the woman is better than him because, well...she's a woman), and whilst demanding higher pay also demand a maternity leave that seems to stretch into bloody retirement. Why do men get less paternity leave than women? We don't see them raising that point. Again, previously mentioned are significantly softer sentences, divorces going in favour of the mother, etc. But of course it is always the man's fault.

    To summarise, then - what pisses me off most about feminism is not the theory and the cause, but the way they practise it. Men are punished for being a man, which is actually quite ironic seeing as they want to oust sexism.
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    Basically, if feminists had it their way, George Orwell's famous line in Animal Farm would sum up society perfectly:

    "All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others*"

    *(where the feminists are Napoleon, Squealer etc who are a bit more equal than everyone else)
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    (Original post by Birkenhead)
    If you're for equality of opportunity and not an artificially created equality of outcome then you expect and accept that an inequality of outcome is likely and that this is not a bad thing.
    Exactly this.
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    (Original post by Birkenhead)
    I completely disagree. Men are not 'privileged'. Both sexes have their own share of problems but if anyone is privileged I should think it would be the gender favoured in custody, helped by quotas and positive discrimination, given more redress by the justice system in cases of domestic violence, given significantly softer sentences... I don't see much male privilege but I see rather a lot of it for women.



    If you're for equality of opportunity and not an artificially created equality of outcome then you expect and accept that an inequality of outcome is likely and that this is not a bad thing.

    You see what you want to see. I am not saying men have it better in all aspects of life. I'm saying we shouldn't let people's sex define how we see them. It's feminists who say that men should be allowed paternal leave, or not be looked down upon for having a "feminine" job, or not be scorned for displaying their feelings publicly, or that men can be raped and shouldn't be laughed at for claiming that they were, or that they can, indeed, be victims of domestic violence and that they shouldn't be expected to just "deal with it" because they're men.

    I don't believe in concepts like forced parity in the parliament or shoving women into prestigious business positions just so that there are some women on important meetings. I know that biologically, statistically, whatever, the average male will be more dominant and career-driven than the average female, and that the average female will be more likely to want to work with small kids or be a stay at home parent. Thus I would never expect nor want to live in a world where we force a situation where people are unhappy and unable to chase their dreams because we so desperately tried to make them fit their lifestyles into political correctness.

    For me, however, feminism (or the general strive for equality) is about noticing that people are not ultimately defined by their sex. Sure, more blokes will be happy to pursue a military career and more will be able to physically withstand it. But there are physically weak men and there are pacifist men who wouldn't ever want to be soldiers - and there are some strong women who would be at their best in the military/police force etc. I don't like the fact that we are brought up to think that a woman has to be and certainly is weak, peaceful, delicate, brittle, compassionate, and a man is a warrior, a conqueror, a protector.


    (Original post by DiddyDec)
    Please see above. Being against feminism does not mean you are against equality.
    My definition of feminism is trying to decrease the hurtful differences in treatment based on one's sex. Sounds like equality to me.
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    (Original post by bittr n swt)
    Because I don't want women to be superior. They want to be superior and oppress men. They don't care about us, only about their rights.


    This is why I support mens right movement.

    Feminists are not against men and do not want to be more superior than men, they want to be equal as men and get equal pay and equal as men.
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    (Original post by Viridiana)
    My definition of feminism is trying to decrease the hurtful differences in treatment based on one's sex. Sounds like equality to me.
    Here is the problem with feminism, everyone has a different definition. So I could be against one persons definition and for another persons. But does that mean I am for or against feminism as a whole?

    It is easier to be for equality but not to associate yourself with feminism that way you don't have to define yourself in any way. Your views are easily understood without getting into a debate about semantics.
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    (Original post by noramaria)
    Feminists are not against men and do not want to be more superior than men, they want to be equal as men and get equal pay and equal as men.
    No
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    yes
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    feminists don't want equality, they want superiority but obviously they can't openly say that but their actions,views and rhetoric shows this.
 
 
 
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