The BIG Classics Discussion Thread

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theone
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#21
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#21
(Original post by hypnos)
I agree. The translation is obvious by sense alone. However my source (doctor of classics oxfd uni...) assures me that there is some sophisticated grammatical point that makes 'because' impossible.
Well, you'd have to supply 'it' because there is no word for it. Now we both know that we can do this fairly safely with most latin authors, but if we are to take it literally, perhaps this is important?
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Amrad
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#22
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#22
Anyone doing Catullus? Opinions?
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hypnos
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#23
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#23
Incidentally, what's your Classics situation TheOne?
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hypnos
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#24
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#24
Catullus is very cool in my opinion, though I do hate the waffley questions we get about him.
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Amrad
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#25
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#25
Think Catullus is fantastic as well and the questions aren't bad considering they are AS and there are limits on what they can ask. What I don't like is how you don't get any extra reward for being smart about the latin. Haven't even started learning it yet... dreading 64.
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hypnos
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#26
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#26
Which set of poems are you doing? Or are you doing both and no prose?

But yes, Catullus good stuff. Makes a change from the usaul weighty classical texts.
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Amrad
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#27
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#27
Both sets. Most of the shorter poems are fairly straightforward and I could more or less translate them at the moment, some of 64 is fiendishly difficult though and I don't suscribe to the standard method of learning an english translation so might have some trouble. Think its all fabulous stuff though.
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hypnos
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#28
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#28
Do you have any commentaries etc for Catullus?
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Amrad
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#29
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#29
Well I'm in the process of doing some but have only typed up 1,2,3,5,7,8 so far... not sure if I will get round to 63 and 64!
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hypnos
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#30
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#30
Well I'd be interested in seeing yours but I actually meant professional ones. I have one by Kenneth Quinn (BCP 1979) which is very good. There's also some useful stuff in the Catullus chapter in "The latin love poets" by ROAM Lynne
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Amrad
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#31
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#31
We use the book edited by Quinn with notes in the back and I am planning on having a look through these at some point - is what you are talking about any different? Have been recommended to look through the Lyne chapter as well so will try get round to that! You using any other resources? Which poems you doing?
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hypnos
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#32
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#32
Well I've also got my hands on the Fordyce commentary though that's more technical and less interesting than the Quinn.
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theone
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#33
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#33
My teacher produced complete commentaries for us for all our poems, as well as the Ovid and Cicero we're doing this year, they're really good. As for catullus 64, don't worry, it really isn't that bad, except for the really 'epic' description of the ship near the start

As for my classics situation, hypnos, i'm doing latin this year (u6th) and have done a little bit of greek before.
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fairieboi
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#34
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#34
oh william.
you must get outside dear boy ;p

is there a computer in dr burnand's room? i can't remember. i feel a desperate urge to show this to everyone in greek tomorrow afternoon, heh
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Amrad
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#35
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#35
(Original post by theone)
My teacher produced complete commentaries for us for all our poems, as well as the Ovid and Cicero we're doing this year, they're really good.
Spoonfeeding! our teacher is so against that type of stuff its not funny. its like 'you're smart people you can figure this sort of stuff out in the exam if you understand the latin'
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theone
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#36
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#36
(Original post by Amrad)
Spoonfeeding! our teacher is so against that type of stuff its not funny. its like 'you're smart people you can figure this sort of stuff out in the exam if you understand the latin'
Oh don't be so naive. Does it really matter if our commentary is one that we find in a book somewhere or not? Both commentaries are prepared so it doesn't matter. Otherwise, you may not spot certain important things first time you read it through. Literary commentaries are made to help strengthen the understanding of those who learn the text. Of course, we're not machines, we do not methodically learn the notes for the exam, we use our intuition in the exam and what looks important. But the point of a commentary is twofold, to give us assitance translating the original, and to help us build up this understanding. All people, when first translating 'original' latin works need some form of guidance, it's natural, it's only the most brilliant people that don't. Of course, certain things are obvious to the accustomed eye, but it is getting to this state of mind that requires the commentary and help. Otherwise the subject would take far far more time than it needs to....
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fairieboi
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#37
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#37
i am in complete concurrance.. being 'spoonfed', so to speak, is of course not what classics is about; however, how can a teacher expect you to come up with interesting and critical analysis of texts without first knowing what to look for? i adore the literary criticism side of classics, and i can often think of things that my teacher has never mentioned to me, but if it weren't for his 'starting line' then i would be just sitting in confusion.

i advise you to tell your teacher he is a moron, and he isn't being paid to make you educate yourself.
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Amrad
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#38
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#38
(Original post by theone)
Oh don't be so naive. Does it really matter if our commentary is one that we find in a book somewhere or not? Both commentaries are prepared so it doesn't matter. Otherwise, you may not spot certain important things first time you read it through. Literary commentaries are made to help strengthen the understanding of those who learn the text. Of course, we're not machines, we do not methodically learn the notes for the exam, we use our intuition in the exam and what looks important. But the point of a commentary is twofold, to give us assitance translating the original, and to help us build up this understanding. All people, when first translating 'original' latin works need some form of guidance, it's natural, it's only the most brilliant people that don't. Of course, certain things are obvious to the accustomed eye, but it is getting to this state of mind that requires the commentary and help. Otherwise the subject would take far far more time than it needs to....
My comment was slightly tongue in cheek... sorry if you misinterpreted. I think the teacher partly feels like that because AS doesn't really require that thorough an appreciation of the text and she would rather we use our initiative and look at a book than her spend her time putting together something for us.
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hypnos
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#39
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#39
For anyone who's wondering, Fairie boi just so happens to be at my school in my greek set (not to mention going to Bryanston); he's just a little excited at finding my little 'project' here

And now he's contributed to the thread. How hypocritical of you Sam.
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fairieboi
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#40
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#40
i'm allowed to be hypocritical. it's the internet.

and it's not called 'bryanston'; it's called 'greek camp'...
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