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    here's what labour do :

    make up and exaggerate problems,
    talk about them endlessly
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    Examples
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    (Original post by curtis110)
    Examples
    Well, how about everything Miliband says about the NHS at PMQs ?

    Waiting times, shortages of staff, etc
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    (Original post by curtis110)
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    Even the BBC has called them out on it this week.

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    Another Labour apparatchik struggles with the facts vs her memorised soundbites from the party line:

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    How do private healthcare markets have higher costs than the NHS?

    Oh, I just realises he means costs for the consumer. Derp. So much for making healthcare outcomes the most important thing.
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    All parties love to try to use the NHS in their favour when they can because they know the British people love it and consider it a national icon.

    The Tories do this the least because people don't really believe them when they say they are protecting it or making it better. So they just ignore it.

    But yeah the British public's view on this is pretty damaging as it basically blocks any kind of substantive reform that needs to take place to make the NHS sustainable.
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    Saw an interesting article on Labour's NHS strategy. Labour have always won on healthcare, they have always been trusted with the NHS more than the tories. WHich suggests it's not really an argument they can win an election on. It can help, but making it their sole platform is not going to end well. They are trying to have an argument they've already won.
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    (Original post by TorpidPhil)
    How do private healthcare markets have higher costs than the NHS?

    Oh, I just realises he means costs for the consumer. Derp. So much for making healthcare outcomes the most important thing.
    Because, of course, the NHS is so much more severely "privatised" now than it was 5 years ago! Of course, the electorate's memory is too short to recall that a hell of a lot of "privatisation" was done under New Labour, including the biggest argument against it.


    (Original post by Aj12)
    Saw an interesting article on Labour's NHS strategy. Labour have always won on healthcare, they have always been trusted with the NHS more than the tories. WHich suggests it's not really an argument they can win an election on. It can help, but making it their sole platform is not going to end well. They are trying to have an argument they've already won.
    I have seen several articles, admittedly Torygraph, basically saying that a load of the New Labour boys think that it's stupid and won't really work.
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    what are labour doing about the EU ? nothing
    immigration ? nothing
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    (Original post by The_Mighty_Bush)
    All parties love to try to use the NHS in their favour when they can because they know the British people love it and consider it a national icon.

    The Tories do this the least because people don't really believe them when they say they are protecting it or making it better. So they just ignore it.

    But yeah the British public's view on this is pretty damaging as it basically blocks any kind of substantive reform that needs to take place to make the NHS sustainable.
    To be honest i wonder just fickle the electorate as a whole is. I honestly think it's entirely possible that a government could win just by making lots of small reforms to the economy, health and immigration while completely ignoring any major reform and basically leaving every other department alone (or rather, simply reacting to real world events rather than changing the structure).

    It seems to me that the British people don't like people that actually do things and want to change the world (Gove, Lansley, IDS for example - though they may be right on the last two), they just want somebody who will tinker in the main policy areas. Even stuff like gay marriage and plain packaging and obesity gets supported, but not one person will vote for it at the ballot box. In May, it won't be 'how nice was that Cameron letting the gays marry', it'll be 'ooo that nasty bedroom tax'. In that sense, politicians waste their time completely doing anything outside a few select departments.
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    (Original post by democracyforum)
    what are labour doing about the EU ? nothing
    immigration ? nothing
    As per my reply above, nobody cares enough about the EU on election day. It's why the EP turnout was 34% and why Ukip got 3% of the vote in 2010.

    People do care about immigration though and that's why old Labour types are flocking to a party further right than the Tories (though i suspect they are more bothered about Muslims and Africans than Poles who are collateral damage).
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Because, of course, the NHS is so much more severely "privatised" now than it was 5 years ago! Of course, the electorate's memory is too short to recall that a hell of a lot of "privatisation" was done under New Labour, including the biggest argument against it.

    I have seen several articles, admittedly Torygraph, basically saying that a load of the New Labour boys think that it's stupid and won't really work.
    To be fair to Ed and his strategy, what they actually say is that highlighting the problem is not enough (which is what Burnham is doing) if you don't any meaningful reforms. Labour's NHS plan right now seems to be simply to roll back the clock to the last government.

    They were right to highlight the NHS and remind people so to speak (the coalition does with the economy) because it strengthens their lead in this area. But after a week or two of hearing about it, there's no more to be gained for another few months because everybody has already decided 'nasty Tories/Labour scare stories'.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    To be fair to Ed and his strategy, what they actually say is that highlighting the problem is not enough (which is what Burnham is doing) if you don't any meaningful reforms. Labour's NHS plan right now seems to be simply to roll back the clock to the last government.

    They were right to highlight the NHS and remind people so to speak (the coalition does with the economy) because it strengthens their lead in this area. But after a week or two of hearing about it, there's no more to be gained for another few months because everybody has already decided 'nasty Tories/Labour scare stories'.
    I imagine people trust the Labour Party most on the NHS because they brought it in in 1948 against vociferous protests from the Conservatives and many Doctors. In those days if you hadn't got the cash you didn't get the treatment, in the main. Doctors' practices being run as businesses. Much as the Conservatives want now?

    Since then with the access of medical training being opened up students from less monied backgrounds more many Doctors are terrified of what a future Government might do to the NHS.

    In particular the Conservative supported TTIP. The secretive Trans Atlantic agreement which will allow American Corporations to sue democratically elected Governments if their policies mean that their profits could be hit. Do we want US Companies driving out our NHS so that they can make huge profits as in America?

    David Cameron is there to protect the interests of Business- by which he means Multi - National Oligarchs who care less about us. Most jobs in this country are provided by small and medium size businesses and their interests are largely the interests of all the population but definitely not of those who just want to take their ( untaxed ) profits and run.
 
 
 
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