Are the Tories going too far? Watch

Gnomes&Knights
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The Conservative Party will introduce new powers to close down any mosque which hosts extremists, Theresa May said today.

The new 'mosque closure orders' would give the government widespread powers to close down any premises which are either run by, or welcome, extremist speakers.

May said she would also introduce new banning orders against extremist groups, review the sharia court system and introduce new "extremism disruption orders" against individual extremists.

In a decidedly neo-Conservative speech, May channeled the language of George Bush, saying the nation faced a new battle between "them and us".

For too long we have let the extremists define the 'them and us,
she told a press conference in central London.

We, the 'us' will form a new partnership and show 'them' that we want nothing to do with their hatred bigotry and ignorance.
Those refusing to join this new alliance would feel the full force of the law, she said.

To those people who do not want to join this partnership. To those people who choose consciously to reject our values, the message is equally clear.

The game is up. We will no longer tolerate your behaviour. We will expose your hateful beliefs for what they are.

Where you seek to spread hate, we will disrupt you. Where you break the law we will prosecute you. Where you seek to divide us we will stand united and together we will defeat you.
May admitted that she has not secured agreement from her coalition partners for the new measures but said they would be included in the upcoming Conservative manifesto.

Her speech comes at an unfortunate time for the party, as one of their own candidates comes under fire for allegedly trying to form an alliance with the far-right extremists the EDL.

Labour today criticised Theresa May for not acting sooner.

She has had five years as Home Secretary to do all these things, yet too many of her promises are the opposite of what she has done in Government,
shadow home secretary Yvette Cooper said.

She could have had banning orders, reviewed sharia courts, and insisted preachers speak English five years ago, rather than leaving it until now.

Everyone other than the extremists agree that we should robustly defend and actively promote the pluralistic values our society rightly holds in esteem. But it isn't enough for the Home Secretary to say it, she needs to act.

We need to work in as many communities as possible, throughout the UK, to support civil society and defeat extremism. And we should never tie the hands of our agencies and the police in confronting dangerous, violent extremists. The Government's record is one of making that harder, not easier.
http://www.politics.co.uk/news/2015/...closure-orders
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MatureStudent36
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Why do you think it's too far?
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Rakas21
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This is an excellent policy and May is right when it comes to Islamists.. it's them or us.
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Gnomes&Knights
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(Original post by MatureStudent36)
Why do you think it's too far?
Are you aware how much Muslims donate for the maintenance of a Mosque?
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Gnomes&Knights
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(Original post by Rakas21)
This is an excellent policy and May is right when it comes to Islamists.. it's them or us.
Well they should target the Islamists not the Mosques. If my local Mosque was closed down I would feel quite hurt especially when it's the only one that is close to me.
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Skip_Snip
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Maybe it will make muslims clean up their own house. Closing mosques would be a lot more effective than arresting individuals.
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Rakas21
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(Original post by Raymat)
Well they should target the Islamists not the Mosques. If my local Mosque was closed down I would feel quite hurt especially when it's the only one that is close to me.
Pressure must be put on the Muslim community not to attend these speeches by radical Imans, this is one way to do that.

Frankly i'd stop them coming in the country but people like free speech.
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Gnomes&Knights
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(Original post by Skip_Snip)
Maybe it will make muslims clean up their own house. Closing mosques would be a lot more effective than arresting individuals.
Talks/speeches don't always take places in Mosques you know.
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Gnomes&Knights
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(Original post by Rakas21)
Pressure must be put on the Muslim community not to attend these speeches by radical Imans, this is one way to do that.

Frankly i'd stop them coming in the country but people like free speech.
Mosque committees should prevent radical imams/speakers from giving talks/speeches in their Mosques and I think a lot of them already do. I've been going to the Mosque for years now and never witnessed my local mosques (or any other mosques I've been to) invite radical speakers to give radicalising lectures.
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Rakas21
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(Original post by Raymat)
Mosque committees should prevent radical imams/speakers from giving talks/speeches in their Mosques and I think a lot of them already do. I've been going to the Mosque for years now and never witnessed my local mosques (or any other mosques I've been to) invite radical speakers to give radicalising lectures.
Well that's good, i'm sure you local mosque won't be affected... but there are some and if closing a mosque will piss the congregation off enough then it might stop Imans or mosque committees being willing.

Out of interest does your local mosque ever talk about opposing extremists and stuff or is all not talked about.
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MatureStudent36
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(Original post by Raymat)
Are you aware how much Muslims donate for the maintenance of a Mosque?
ARe you aware the of the damage a radicalised islamic terrorist can cause?

Places of religious activity have always been dealt with sensitivity, but if they're being used for illegal activity they're fair game.

There were quite a few Catholic churches turned over in NI during the troubles.
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Gnomes&Knights
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(Original post by MatureStudent36)
ARe you aware the of the damage a radicalised islamic terrorist can cause?

Places of religious activity have always been dealt with sensitivity, but if they're being used for illegal activity they're fair game.

There were quite a few Catholic churches turned over in NI during the troubles.
And do you think this radicalisation goes on in mosques? A lot of it is from Islamic schools and predominantly the internet. I've never witnessed radicalisation going on in the mosque.
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simon_g
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Well... in the worst case scenario speeches will be given in a private places, or over Skype or something similar.
It's a funny thing to see how everyone is for "free speech" et al. as long as that someone do agree with them; otherwise one has to be banned.
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MatureStudent36
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(Original post by Raymat)
And do you think this radicalisation goes on in mosques? A lot of it is from Islamic schools and predominantly the internet. I've never witnessed radicalisation going on in the mosque.
Quite a bit has happened in mosques.

I give you as exhibit A the de facto mosque for radicalised nutters.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North...Central_Mosque


But as we're finally seeing the Muslim community mobilising themselves against these retards then hopefully such legislation won't be needed.

I'm glad you've never witnessed radicalisation at your mosque. I assume that it never goes on at the majority of mosques, but the sad reality is that it does happen.
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Thoth's World
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On the one hand it is good because in theory it should lower the possibility of terrorist attacks ultimately, because closing a mosque with an extremist orator prevents large scale indoctrination. It also may deter mosque from allowing extremist speakers within their premises for the fear of being shut down.

But it also has its possible negative effects. Shutting down the mosque due to one extremist being present may cause agitation in the community because they may have no other place of worship or have to commute far to go to a Mosque: if they are devout Muslims this could be quite the change.

Also forgive my naivety but isn't an extremist allowed to express their views? You have extreme nationalist which threaten to hurt other members of society but they are not punished because it comes under the category of free speech. If May only punished Muslim extremist wouldn't that be discriminatory?

I understand the reasons why she have proposed this idea in reality Britain's number of Muslim extremist are rising but I think this could anger more people than needed.
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MindTheGaps
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I really despise Theresa May. She has consistently shown complete disregard for civil liberties. If it weren't for the fact that the last Labour government were just as bad on that score she would make it pretty hard for me to vote Conservative. If I could kick anyone out of the party it would be her.

We should not do a damn thing about non-violent extremists, apart from pointing out in public just how ridiculous they are as frequently as possible. Since when has restricting freedom of expression been a British value?
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neal95
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Excellent initiative. We must comant radical Islamism on our shores. Our forefathers didn't the nazis for this
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Gnomes&Knights
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(Original post by Troytheboy)
On the one hand it is good because in theory it should lower the possibility of terrorist attacks ultimately, because closing a mosque with an extremist orator prevents large scale indoctrination. It also may deter mosque from allowing extremist speakers within their premises for the fear of being shut down.

But it also has its possible negative effects. Shutting down the mosque due to one extremist being present may cause agitation in the community because they may have no other place of worship or have to commute far to go to a Mosque: if they are devout Muslims this could be quite the change.

Also forgive my naivety but isn't an extremist allowed to express their views? You have extreme nationalist which threaten to hurt other members of society but they are not punished because it comes under the category of free speech. If May only punished Muslim extremist wouldn't that be discriminatory?

I understand the reasons why she have proposed this idea in reality Britain's number of Muslim extremist are rising but I think this could anger more people than needed.
Well hate speech isn't allowed and hate speech is quite a major element in the talks/lectures on non-Muslims given by radical speakers.
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User1824259
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I would be interested to see the reaction from the public if this ever comes to pass.
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InnerTemple
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Seems to be going a bit too far, yes.

It makes sense that this has come from Theresa May. A most objectionable character.

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