UK parliamentary democracy is broken. PR voting can fix it. Sign the petition.

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Reformed2010
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#1
Report Thread starter 7 years ago
#1
You are being ruled by a tyranny of the minority.

Today the British people are going be governed by a party that secured 36% of the vote but thanks to our FPTP voting system grab 51% of the seats. All the policies and laws that will be imposed on you by the UK government will be because 36% gave their consent. What about the 64% that did not give their consent? If you heard that Putin imposed laws on the Russian people against the majority we would cry foul. If we heard the Obama administration imposed laws on the American people despite losing a referendum we would cry foul. But when the UK government impose laws despite not winning 64% of the vote we do what?

It is time we stopped this madness, time we realise that it is not 1900s any more and that the needs of this country far outweigh the benefits FPTP gives any one party. Our concept of democracy has always evolved in response to the times. Where once we thought it was democratic to deny black people the right to vote, where we once we thought it right to deny women the right to vote and even the working class (without property) too. We thankfully don't any more. Black, female and working class. A description that fits my grandmother and I guess helps to partly explain why the issue of representation and democracy makes me so passionate. She has always reminded me of the ridicule her mother got for calling for better representation, whenever I bored her about my desire for a better more proportional voting system.

Is British democracy as bad as it was before 1928? of course not. But can it improve? damn right it can. My great grandmother was a black working class female. A Labour supporter (supposedly) who died too early and never got the chance to have her voice fairly represented. Perhaps it's time we gave the millions of under represented voters in the United Kingdom a stronger voice?

Let 2020 election be the first British election that never waste a vote again.

Please support this petition for a fairer and more proportional voting system. Together we can force the agenda on electoral reform.
https://www.change.org/p/party-leade...rated_trending
180,010 supporters and counting.

Yes I know we had a AV referendum but that was on a low turn out, AV wasn't really wanted by PR enthusiasts and now millions more have had their vote wasted they may realise what needs to be done.
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username1862217
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#2
Report 7 years ago
#2
Signed!
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kumon
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#3
Report 7 years ago
#3
You realise if PR is implement UKIP come into power. Which is why despite wanting more democracy, I don't want tyranny by the masses of scared people voting in a crazy party that preys on the weak and those not responsible for the finical crash.
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Shaughney
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#4
Report 7 years ago
#4
(Original post by kumon)
You realise if PR is implement UKIP come into power. Which is why despite wanting more democracy, I don't want tyranny by the masses of scared people voting in a crazy party that preys on the weak and those not responsible for the finical crash.
Firstly UKIP wouldn't necessarily have come into power in this election even with PR, it also doesn't necessarily mean they would get more votes, what it means is that when you vote you don't feel it is wasted. Also, now Farage has quit I don't know if UKIP will sustain its support over the next five years anyway.

I think what we should have is compulsory voting, at least then the winning party would be more representative of the view of the people. When you think about it only 66% of the population turned out to vote, that means there are nearly the same number of non-voters as supporters of the tories. Also that means only 24% of the population actually want Cameron as Prime Minister.

I think it is ironic that people had the opportunity to switch to a different voting system a few years ago but dismissed it, now people are calling for a reform of it (don't get me wrong I support electoral/voting reform but it is a bit annoying the electorate dismissed it but now calls for it again).
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Dilmurod Dilmu
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#5
Report 7 years ago
#5
No thankyou.
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ChoccyPhilly
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#6
Report 7 years ago
#6
Single tranferable Vote is the way forward.

That being said, the referendum to use that years ago didn't work but I think that was more because we didn't see it as necessary and we don't like change. I was living in london at the time and that feeling seemed widespread but it seems now more than ever that that method is most fair
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Reformed2010
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#7
Report Thread starter 7 years ago
#7
(Original post by kumon)
You realise if PR is implement UKIP come into power. Which is why despite wanting more democracy, I don't want tyranny by the masses of scared people voting in a crazy party that preys on the weak and those not responsible for the finical crash.
That is like the white people in South Africa being afraid of the black voters or the upper-class in Victorian Britain being afraid of the working class.
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username1862217
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#8
Report 7 years ago
#8
(Original post by kumon)
You realise if PR is implement UKIP come into power.
Democracy.

I don't support UKIP, but I will respect and listen to the views of those that do. I will not reject a system just to silence 4 million people and keep my own party in power.
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an_atheist
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#9
Report 7 years ago
#9
But all PR does is encourage many minority government, and we get nothing done. I get you dont like having the Tories in power, but they won he seats fairly and they have a majority. Grow a pair and live with the fact that Labour didn't return to **** everything up again
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Reformed2010
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#10
Report Thread starter 7 years ago
#10
(Original post by an_atheist)
But all PR does is encourage many minority government, and we get nothing done. I get you dont like having the Tories in power, but they won he seats fairly and they have a majority. Grow a pair and live with the fact that Labour didn't return to **** everything up again
This has nothing to do with Labour losing, with PR Tories and UKIP might have a majority together and I have voted Greens and Liberal Democrats in various elections. So try again. I rather get fewer things done with the people in the country happy and wanting it than have it forced upon them by minority. If you support 36% ruling 64% then I hope you realise that is not a democracy by any modern standards.
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WilliamSlim
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#11
Report 7 years ago
#11
Nope, the first past the post system works and works well. We vote for our local candidate who governs us and that's how it works best.
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Alfissti
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#12
Report 7 years ago
#12
No thanks, Sharia and all the other types of looneys may just be able to make big inroads in UK should there be PR.
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ridwan12
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#13
Report 7 years ago
#13
(Original post by Reformed2010)
You are being ruled by a tyranny of the minority.

Today the British people are going be governed by a party that secured 36% of the vote but thanks to our FPTP voting system grab 51% of the seats. All the policies and laws that will be imposed on you by the UK government will be because 36% gave their consent. What about the 64% that did not give their consent? If you heard that Putin imposed laws on the Russian people against the majority we would cry foul. If we heard the Obama imposed laws on the American people despite losing a referendum we would cry foul. But when the UK government impose laws despite having not winning 64% of the vote we do what?

It is time we stopped this madness, time we realise that it is not 1900s any more and that the needs of this country far outweigh the benefits FPTP gives any one party. Our concept of democracy has always evolved in response to the times. Where once we thought it was democratic to deny black people the right to vote, where we once we thought it right to deny women the right to vote and even the working class (without property) too. We don't thankfully any more. Black, female and working class. A description that fits my grandmother and I guess helps to partly explain why the issue of representation and democracy makes me so passionate. She has always reminded me of the ridicule her mother got for calling for better representation, whenever I bored her about my desire for a better more proportional voting system.

Is British democracy as bad as it was before 1928? of course not. But can it improve? damn right it can. My great grandmother was a black working class female. A Labour supporter (supposedly) who died too early and never got the chance to have her voice fairly represented. Perhaps it's time we gave the millions of under represented voters in the United Kingdom a stronger voice?

Let 2020 election be the first British election that never waste a vote again.

Please support this petition for a fairer and more proportional voting system. Together we can force the agenda on electoral reform.
https://www.change.org/p/party-leade...rated_trending
115,027 supporters and counting.

Yes I know we had a AV referendum but that was on a low turn out, AV wasn't really wanted by PR enthusiasts and now millions more have had their vote wasted they may realise what needs to be done.
What I don't understand is how 6% more vote share for the Tories equals a 98 seat advantage of labour.
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Shaughney
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#14
Report 7 years ago
#14
(Original post by an_atheist)
But all PR does is encourage many minority government, and we get nothing done. I get you dont like having the Tories in power, but they won he seats fairly and they have a majority. Grow a pair and live with the fact that Labour didn't return to **** everything up again
I mean it's not like Denmark, Norway, other Scandinavian countries who regularly have minority/coalition governments are good countries is it? Oh wait they're consistently voted highly in HDI/education/GNI PPP rankings, I think coalition governments can work.

P.S. (as I don't want to derail the thread)
Also grow up and get yo facts straight, Labour did not ruin the economy (tories could have actually made things a lot worse with greater deregulation), read my post (no.17) on this thread:
http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/show...9#post55567789
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an_atheist
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#15
Report 7 years ago
#15
(Original post by ridwan12)
What I don't understand is how 6% more vote share for the Tories equals a 98 seat advantage of labour.
Becasue the labour vote would be more concentrated. So when Labour won seats they would win by a larger margin than the Tories.
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Shaughney
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#16
Report 7 years ago
#16
(Original post by Alfissti)
No thanks, Sharia and all the other types of looneys may just be able to make big inroads in UK should there be PR.
Just because you have PR it doesn't mean people are going to start voting for crackpot parties etc.
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Reformed2010
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#17
Report Thread starter 7 years ago
#17
(Original post by WilliamSlim)
Nope, the first past the post system works and works well. We vote for our local candidate who governs us and that's how it works best.
You are happy to have 5 million people have no representation and lack any voice in their own parliament? this is going to further erode any faith in our parliament.
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ChaoticButterfly
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#18
Report 7 years ago
#18
(Original post by kumon)
You realise if PR is implement UKIP come into power. Which is why despite wanting more democracy, I don't want tyranny by the masses of scared people voting in a crazy party that preys on the weak and those not responsible for the finical crash.
No you don't. If you did you would accept people vote UKIP.

I'm toally finw with allying with UKIP on electoral reform grounds.
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Erzan
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#19
Report 7 years ago
#19
(Original post by Alfissti)
No thanks, Sharia and all the other types of looneys may just be able to make big inroads in UK should there be PR.
What the hell are you talking about? there are 2,786,635 million (4% of the country) Muslims in the UK. Even if every single one of them voted for some UK Sharia law party you couldn't even have enough MPs to go into coalition let alone pass sharia law.

(Original post by Keyhofi)
Democracy.

I don't support UKIP, but I will respect and listen to the views of those that do. I will not reject a system just to silence 4 million people and keep my own party in power.
Exactly but do you think Labour or some Tories give in?
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The_Internet
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#20
Report 7 years ago
#20
With all due fairness, BOTH systems have flaws. Supporters of this should know this. In theory, I do support PR. In practise, I don't, because it's so much harder to pass laws, it's more likely we have a hung parliament too. Think Weimar Republic
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