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Any other girlies finding it hard to get a man to settle down with? Watch

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    (Original post by Smash Bandicoot)
    I'm going to overlook the fact your account is new enough to be a troll because this is far from an isolated incident.

    You see, this is what's laughable about so many modern young women, as I said on Marian's thread just yesterday. They moan about 'finding it hard to settle down', and that a guy with certain masculine attributes only messes them around, but then make stupid lists of alpha traits which few men can reach-6'3 ffs!. When no-one reaches these ludicrous criteria pull out the princess victim card 'woe is me' to attract the white knights and get pity from fellow women. Feminists then allow them to blame men for not reaching these criteria; look at this Elite Daily article for example http://elitedaily.com/dating/men-pss...-dates/746965/

    They want the best of both worlds. They don't realise that most guys are either Sensitive New Age Guys, or bad boys, depending on how they have been socialised to behave around women. When a man pulls the same ****, they're the first to tell him to stop being so shallow and entitled, lower his standards etc. and get him to blame himself; remember women are masters of manipulation, and know how to twist men's arm to get what they want.

    I came to the conclusion that with regards to dating, most [esp. straight] women hamster, game and ****-test (though in younger years they try to hide their predatory sexual nature) and you shouldn't trust them until you and they are at least 25, ideally 30, and when you have a decent job. Until then all they're going to do is play mind games with you, blame you for not reaching their lofty expectations and just generally make your life ****.

    The sad thing is so many guys think that this is their own fault not that of radical feminism due to a continuous process of 'toxic shame' relating to imperfection. I won't bore you with my research yet, likely make a thread about it, but this shift of power from women to men has been at the heart of the social revolution since the end of WWII.
    PRSOM
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    (Original post by Binary Freak)
    PRSOM
    cheers bro, try not to get as angry as me about it all though, I find my mahoosive film list will tide me over smartly
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    No.
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    (Original post by SophF_rth)
    No.
    can you please confirm that OP is being foolish?
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    (Original post by Smash Bandicoot)
    cheers bro, try not to get as angry as me about it all though, I find my mahoosive film list will tide me over smartly
    Can't really have it when near to most females create a benchmark to what the ideal partner would be. Then anyone not matching it gets rejected. Then they bring upon the 'forever alone' mentality
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    (Original post by Binary Freak)
    Can't really have it when near to most females create a benchmark to what the ideal partner would be. Then anyone not matching it gets rejected. Then they bring upon the 'forever alone' mentality
    you see that'd be fine except for the fact that they've made research papers out of what's wrong with men for doing the same thing (Nice Guy, entitlement, self pity, bitter virgin, inability to lower standards oh that's rich, shallow sexist pig, check your privilege, etc.)
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    (Original post by Smash Bandicoot)
    It may be insecure (with good reason if it's true) but it's not entirely stupid or BS, as I've over-heard many conversations IRL and read many articles, stories and conversations online which confirm some of its tenets. Read one just last night.



    OP is a troll but this is what I was trying to point out before I got yelled at for whinging
    Ah I see. It's an interesting topic though.

    From what I've witnessed I feel like society has a huge double standard here, often when a man can't attract a woman he will be faced with arguments like A) he is not entitled to a woman's body (generally said by woman) B) He needs to improve himself, all of which fyi are true.
    Now switch positions and often when a female can't find a guy to lock down the emphasised topics are often A) Media has inflated mens standards B) Men are simple minded dogs who only want sex C) And if she does question if something is wrong with her she is told is nothing wrong, she simply needs to wait for a 'good guy' because apparently everyone who doesn't find her attractive is a bad guy. :K:

    Generally speaking there is often an imbalance in this subject which is often why men sexualise women to such extent, think about this logically- women (with similar attitude to the satire in the original post) often want a man who is better than them. Women are attracted to men who are better than them in different ways, they often want a man is who is older, taller, stronger, smarter, makes more money than them- those are all attractive qualities in a man I can totally understand that. However that means that as a guy on average the girl will be younger, shorter, weaker, dumber, makes less money than me.. so what's left to strike attraction? Dat ass and titties.

    And before someone jumps on my **** about how that doesn't apply to all relationships and women/men- no **** sherlock.. but I'm not saying that it is. In fact when it comes down to societal patterns rarely does something apply to everyone and there will always be multiple outliers- I accept that and have often witnessed them, so refrain from the incredibly obtuse and stupid post if that's your intention because I specifically used the terms "generally" and "often" so I don't need hear the simple minded rhetoric.
    On the other hand if you have an interesting point to make against my suggestion/observation feel free
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    (Original post by So Instinct)
    Ah I see. It's an interesting topic though.

    From what I've witnessed I feel like society has a huge double standard here, often when a man can't attract a woman he will be faced with arguments like A) he is not entitled to a woman's body (generally said by woman) B) He needs to improve himself, all of which fyi are true.
    Now switch positions and often when a female can't find a guy to lock down the emphasised topics are often A) Media has inflated mens standards B) Men are simple minded dogs who only want sex C) And if she does question if something is wrong with her she is told is nothing wrong, she simply needs to wait for a 'good guy' because apparently everyone who doesn't find her attractive is a bad guy. :K:

    Generally speaking there is often an imbalance in this subject which is often why men sexualise women to such extent, think about this logically- women (with similar attitude to the satire in the original post) often want a man who is better than them. Women are attracted to men who are better than them in different ways, they often want a man is who is older, taller, stronger, smarter, makes more money than them- those are all attractive qualities in a man I can totally understand that. However that means that as a guy on average the girl will be younger, shorter, weaker, dumber, makes less money than me.. so what's left to strike attraction? Dat ass and titties.

    And before someone jumps on my **** about how that doesn't apply to all relationships and women/men- no **** sherlock.. but I'm not saying that it is. In fact when it comes down to societal patterns rarely does something apply to everyone and there will always be multiple outliers- I accept that and have often witnessed them, so refrain from the incredibly obtuse and stupid post if that's your intention because I specifically used the terms "generally" and "often" so I don't need hear the simple minded rhetoric.
    On the other hand if you have an interesting point to make against my suggestion/observation feel free
    PRSOM

    The degree to which we've been socialised with this dichotomy is frequently covered in red pill lit. Which is why I find it hilarious that women keep denying it as a volcano of misogynistic lies.

    Spoiler:
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    You're referring to the concepts of hypergamy(women want a man of higher market value), followed by NAWALT (Not All Women Are Like That; common trope is that red pill only applies to the growing population of female narcissists in hookup culture, conventionally very attractive women of high SMV). However this is why we have the Pareto principle (80% of women want the top 20% of men).

    My friend the rad-fem Octopus Garden tried to get me to amend this 2 nights ago, and she has a point when we take into account the LGBT community, but I've never taken the Pareto principle literally, merely to refer to the bell curve. Generally speaking women, especially hot girls don't recognise the bell curve because betas/low-status men don't register as prospective bachelors much on their radar. In fairness this is the same with men esp. hot guys towards less attractive women, which is why most couples ultimately seem to 'match up' in terms of attractiveness. Why I am taking Octo with a pinch of salt is because she's an older woman with children, this means at some point she matured and settled and the game changes 'post-Wall'. I'm only 22 so can't speak from experience, but from what I've read we have a tendency at this phase of our lives to rationalise ****ty behaviour of our youth. The rationalisation hamster in people adjusting to dating in old age is necessary like the various psychological defence mechanisms we build to protect our ego from cognitive dissonance which would threaten our own self-conception. Defence mechanisms include denial, repression, rationalisation, projection etc. Without these we would easily become depressed or sometimes insane. In the case of dating, we would feel toxic shame for being shallow for years without realising it, and have great difficulty adjusting our behaviour without beating ourselves up for our past.

    (At this point I might as well let you know I am Riku, I've made many insecure threads where I try to fight the defence mechanisms and recognise my low status which drove me quite literally a bit crazy. Anyway I'm working on it.)

    What I'm getting at here is, women are taught to do a lot of denial, repression, rationalisation, projection etc. In Octo's case, she probably did want hot or (in her eyes, according to her value system) high status guys in her youth, but as she 'lost' some of her raw red pill attractiveness (for women it's pretty ****ty tbh, youth/beauty/fertility) she then 'settled' with a man of lower value, in a relationship built upon more egalitarian and humanistic values.


    I've seen your posts around for the past year or so and you seem to know the score, mate. Have you read No More Mr. Nice Guy? It's really insightful into why men have changed in the past 50 years in a way women don't like. It's American but there do seem to be parallels one can draw in the UK. From the US perspective, long story short there was a population boom of needy Nice Guy (™) and momma's boys due to detrimental post-modernism:

    i) shifts in the economy from agrarian to urban leading to a physical or emotional absence of male role models.

    ii) little boys growing up in said fatherless houses or houses with submissive father figures, raised by their mothers. This taught men to fear women and be dependent upon their approval, including in shaping their conception of masculinity through the eyes of women. Women's eyes at risk of sounding sexist are flawed on the issue of masculinity, for various rather controversial and ambiguous reasons relating to evo-psych. and most women esp. young privileged ones in the West having lack of understanding of the way that both genders have been socialised for better or worse.

    iii) Almost always these boys are at some point neglected or abandoned in multiple ways by their mother [or father] figure. 'Abandonment' includes many psychic wounds including being controlled, smothered, sheltered, used by a parent to live the life they wanted through their child, growing up as a carer for their unstable parents/family, etc. Due to children's ego-centrism and physical vulnerability if this happens they grow up being terrified of being abandoned again, blaming themselves for it (they can't conceive that "it's not always about me, the world doesn't revolve around me") and therefore being overly nice and people-pleasing to the extent of becoming a needy pushover/doormat with no boundaries or assertiveness skills-which obviously women do not find attractive.

    iv) an education system primarily dominated by women reinforces the dynamic matriarchal households hold in the public sphere; little boys are surrounded by female authority figures with no male hand to guide them through life

    v) Angry Young Men of the post-war baby boom, turning to hippy culture and leftism to protest the horrors they'd witnessed, ostensibly at the hands of their fathers, in WWII, Vietnam etc.

    vi) Feminism of course. Women have been socialised by radical feminists since the '60s to see men as the enemy, blame men for general social injustices or biological forces of nature, and to not need them. This at the same time as men have been taught to fear, need and have to please women to be qualified as men. This is then enforced in law and statute, to create a dynamic where women are gaining power both in public and private while men are losing it.

    And now, women are professionally in high places of power, often higher than men. Due to centuries of hypergamy and chivalry, women have a lot of difficulty internalising this as anything but 'I am moving up, these men are now below me'. The interesting thing about being a gentleman is, if you're high-status it's unattractive, if you're low-status then women see it largely as needy and supplicating. [see: princess syndrome below]


    [b]Interesting to note also that as less women need men for financial security, charisma, talent, sexual dominance, social status/dominance and without a doubt looks have become more of a necessity to attract women. Hence why so many women now go for aesthetic and strong 'alpha males' or when younger good-looking and rebellious 'bad boys'. There are also reasons in evo-psych. for this behaviour but I'm guessing you're aware of them and don't want to teach Grandma how to suck eggs...

    vii) The book doesn't cover it but the post-modern/Information Age has now led to men being physically feminised: lowering testosterone and fitness levels due to poorer diets; lack of fresh air and exercise or manual labour as desk jockeying and commercial/consumer products (TV, Internet/videogames, porn) have largely replaced good natural food, exercise and manual labour; the normalisation of late nights and unnatural working days [night shifts] etc. All this makes men hormonally more effeminate and 'depressed', therefore it's more difficult for them to break the negative social conditioning

    All of this has basically reversed the standard male/female dynamic to male: submissive, female: dominant, outside of the bedroom as well as in. As I said, NAWALT, you'll get the odd hardcore feminist woman who's alright with that dynamic but most straight women are biologically attracted to traditionally masculine attributes and moreover socialised to be un-attracted to feminine ones [internalised misogyny].

    One needs to remember that at the same time as women receive the feminist message, they also receive the Disney fairytale, both literally by Disney and by the media, that they're entitled to the top 20% of men and-seriously-are victims of malevolent external forces which need correcting if they can't attract him. You note this yourself, they're taught 'if a guy doesn't like me, it's because he's a bad person, I've done nothing wrong'. Absolving responsibility for their life status and culpability for one's own actions. We call this 'princess syndrome/mentality', also called Snow White mentality in The Chimp Paradox and it indeed creates the most hideous double standard :laugh:


    I'm considering making a thread about it for the lonely betas once I've read it all (only on Chapter 2)

    Sorry for all of my bracketing and parentheses bro, hope you can make sense of this mini-essay!
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    (Original post by Maid Marian)
    Don't bother. There are no gentlemen in England anymore.
    It died out when there no women left.
    At least now you have your coveted equality and your chance to be a 'strong independent woman'.
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    (Original post by LaMandarine)
    I did, but then I realised that I have a degree to finish so I actually don't have time for that now.
    And once I'll graduate I'll either become a diplomat or work for the Metropolitan Museum of Art, so I'll be busy, and I won't have time for a relationship then either.
    Then upon my retirement I will circle the world, so I won't have time to settle down then either
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    :sad: fml

    Yeah, no one with a degree and a successful job ever managed a relationship before...
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    You want a guy to settle down with, but you're already picking how what features he must have and even what nationality he must be! Its nice to dream, but the right guy for you could have already been and gone and you're focusing way too much on aesthetics to give them a chance.
    My boyfriend and I were best friends in high school, and I never saw him as anything else as a friend, and two years ago we got back in touch, and you know what, this whole time he has absolutely been the perfect guy for me, we got together when I started uni this year and we couldnt be happier!
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    (Original post by Complex solution)
    It died out when there no women left.
    At least now you have your coveted equality and your chance to be a 'strong independent woman'.
    Funny you should say that as I'm not a feminist at all.
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    (Original post by Le Nombre)
    Yeah, no one with a degree and a successful job ever managed a relationship before...
    My aunt didn't :cry:and so far I'm walking in her footsteps, even career-wise
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    (Original post by LaMandarine)
    My aunt didn't :cry:and so far I'm walking in her footsteps, even career-wise
    One swallow does not a spring make. Plenty of very successful women have perfectly happy marriages. Angela Merkel has to run Europe during the day, but has been happily married for nearly 30 years.
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    (Original post by vault101)
    You want a guy to settle down with, but you're already picking how what features he must have and even what nationality he must be! Its nice to dream, but the right guy for you could have already been and gone and you're focusing way too much on aesthetics to give them a chance.
    My boyfriend and I were best friends in high school, and I never saw him as anything else as a friend, and two years ago we got back in touch, and you know what, this whole time he has absolutely been the perfect guy for me, we got together when I started uni this year and we couldnt be happier!
    Just FYI OP is a guy trolling as a woman. Thank you for your input all the same, it's reassuring. OP is being stupid for choosing to settle with someone for physical attributes alone, and then wondering why choosing on shallow criteria attracts shallow men who then only want to pump and dump
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    (Original post by Complex solution)
    It died out when there no women left.
    At least now you have your coveted equality and your chance to be a 'strong independent woman'.
    Now let's get this straight, at the risk of white-knighting.

    I am not a flat-out misogynist. I am not personally pro-trad. gender roles. I am cool with women going out to work, and having high positions of employment, and being dominant sometimes, and do not want a personal lapdog. At the same time, I do value modesty, I am attracted to feminine women, I do enjoy occasionally being chivalrous (not always), it would be nice to be able to come home after a hard day's work and be heard out. She does not have to make me a sandwich kek, I will cook for her as much as she does for me.

    What I find frustrating is the same women who want flexibility in women's gender roles, enforce the traditional male gender role on men. They are either completely oblivious to this conditioned double standard, or actively turn a blind eye to it because it benefits them and rationalise why such hypocrisy is justifiable.

    Worse than this, for the past decade or so women have started enforcing the criteria of women's
    gender role onto men, on top of the expectations of traditional masculinity, male disposability etc. at the same time as teaching women they have to do neither.

    The result is that women effectively control any m/f dynamic except by a natural alpha male, with alpha traits of high status etc. but a feminist mindset, and that mindset towards women alone. It takes exceptional men, Ryan Gosling calibre to maintain this standard.

    As I'm just a cog in a ****ed-up machine, I adapt to the system as much as necessary to survive, hence my reading. But ultimately still seek the unicorn who recognises Patriarchy Hurts Men Too.
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    (Original post by Smash Bandicoot)
    I'm going to overlook the fact your account is new enough to be a troll because this is far from an isolated incident.

    You see, this is what's laughable about so many modern young women, as I said on Marian's thread just yesterday. They moan about 'finding it hard to settle down', and that a guy with certain masculine attributes only messes them around, but then make stupid lists of alpha traits which few men can reach-6'3 ffs!. When no-one reaches these ludicrous criteria pull out the princess victim card 'woe is me' to attract the white knights and get pity from fellow women. Feminists then allow them to blame men for not reaching these criteria; look at this Elite Daily article for example http://elitedaily.com/dating/men-pss...-dates/746965/

    They want the best of both worlds. They don't realise that most guys are either Sensitive New Age Guys, or bad boys, depending on how they have been socialised to behave around women. When a man pulls the same ****, they're the first to tell him to stop being so shallow and entitled, lower his standards etc. and get him to blame himself; remember women are masters of manipulation, and know how to twist men's arm to get what they want.

    I came to the conclusion that with regards to dating, most [esp. straight] women hamster, game and ****-test (though in younger years they try to hide their predatory sexual nature) and you shouldn't trust them until you and they are at least 25, ideally 30, and when you have a decent job. Until then all they're going to do is play mind games with you, blame you for not reaching their lofty expectations and just generally make your life ****.

    The sad thing is so many guys think that this is their own fault not that of radical feminism due to a continuous process of 'toxic shame' relating to imperfection. I won't bore you with my research yet, likely make a thread about it, but this shift of power from women to men has been at the heart of the social revolution since the end of WWII.
    It would have been a lot shorter to just write that you hate women
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    (Original post by Odd socks)
    It would have been a lot shorter to just write that you hate women
    That's just a straw-man extreme of my confusion and frustration though. I dislike the double standard that is prevalent in the West in particular, and I find most straight young girls have been bought into it or at least don't challenge it. Emphasis on 'many modern young women'.

    I find it gets better as everyone gets older, but right now it is a problem, this is the system we have to work with. Now in fairness I don't know many bi girls IRL, and whether they would be more flexible. I've tested with lots of different women of varying types both offline and online and at this age, the vast majority fit into this rule.

    By you saying that all I'm saying is 'I hate women', you can effectively close the thread so we can't have earnest debate about it. That being said I think I've said my piece for today.
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    (Original post by Smash Bandicoot)
    That's just a straw-man extreme of my confusion and frustration though. I dislike the double standard that is prevalent in the West in particular, and I find most straight young girls have been bought into it or at least don't challenge it. Emphasis on 'many modern young women'.

    I find it gets better as everyone gets older, but right now it is a problem, this is the system we have to work with. Now in fairness I don't know many bi girls IRL, and whether they would be more flexible. I've tested with lots of different women of varying types both offline and online and at this age, the vast majority fit into this rule.

    By you saying that all I'm saying is 'I hate women', you can effectively close the thread so we can't have earnest debate about it. That being said I think I've said my piece for today.
    as much as you dress it up with Internet slang and all your red pill theories, that's what everything you say boils down to, you just don't like it when women call you on your misogyny.


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    (Original post by Odd socks)
    as much as you dress it up with Internet slang and all your red pill theories, that's what everything you say boils down to, you just don't like it when women call you on your misogyny.


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    please explain then why some guys agree with me and some of the women here disagree with the entitled and slightly shallow attitude conveyed by OP (which earnestly I did not realise was a troll).

    Ngl my 4th paragraph was probably a bit strong and sexist. Sorry The rest of it, I think you will find has some backing. In particular the issues created by No More Mr. Nice Guy, which is probably the least misogynist red-pill book out there.
 
 
 
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