Do you agree with the referendum question ?

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democracyforum
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#1
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I think it is too confusing, and loaded towards staying in.

it should not be a yes / no option on the ballot paper.

It should be a stay/leave option,

‘Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union?’
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gladders
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Seems fine to me. Certainly no worse than 'Should the United Kingdom leave the European Union?'

Ultimately, Mr. Cameron's renegotiations are what will inform the referendum, and on that basis, is makes a lot more sense to ask people if they want to stay based on the renewed arrangements the Government negotiates rather than asking 'despite the Government's achievement, do you want to leave?'
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zippity.doodah
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it should just be "should the UK leave the EU?" because obviously that's what makes this referendum unique - it might mean we actually *do* leave, as opposed to staying in it which we're already doing
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democracyforum
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actually it should be neutral

"stay in or leave the EU ?"

tick stay or leave
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Rakas21
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(Original post by democracyforum)
I think it is too confusing, and loaded towards staying in.

it should not be a yes / no option on the ballot paper.

It should be a stay/leave option,

‘Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union?’
I'd have preferred 'Should the United Kingdom retain it's membership of the European Union' however i'm fine with the question as is.

Skeptics were always going to be annoyed if a pro-EU PM held the referendum (especially since the Out campaign need something akin to an Edinburgh agreement to make any promises since if they win, it would not be the kippers negotiating our exit) but that's the price of making it an issue when you don't hold power.

My advise to the skeptics is simple, man up and convince me (i'm an undecided who finds good and bad from both sides thus far) instead of whining about technicalities so they can call the result they don't like rigged.
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gladders
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(Original post by Rakas21)
My advise to the skeptics is simple, man up and convince me (i'm an undecided who finds good and bad from both sides thus far) instead of whining about technicalities so they can call the result they don't like rigged.
Hell yes, this. It's depressing that these people are seeking excuses as to why the result's rigged. To do so suggests a profound lack of trust in democracy akin to those who protest against a Conservative government being elected.
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Reformed2010
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#7
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I have no issue with it, but I am a firm believer in the need for a EU parliamentary democracy anyway.
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Quady
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(Original post by democracyforum)
I think it is too confusing, and loaded towards staying in.

it should not be a yes / no option on the ballot paper.

It should be a stay/leave option,

‘Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union?’
Whats confusing about it?

If someone can't work out what their answer is to it (especially after six months of campaigning) they really don't deserve the vote.
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L i b
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I don't like the whole yes-no thing on ballot papers. I prefer a wording like

"Indicate your preference--

The United Kingdom should remain a member of the European Union [ ]
The United Kingdom should not remain a member of the European Union [ ]"

Equally there is also the (less used in the UK) option of changing the order of the options, so - say - in half of them the 'stay in' option is on the top, and on the other half it is on the bottom. Better yet, side-by-side.
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SaucissonSecCy
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(Original post by democracyforum)
I think it is too confusing, and loaded towards staying in.

it should not be a yes / no option on the ballot paper.

It should be a stay/leave option,

‘Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union?’
Psychological studies suggest that this is biased. It should be stay or leave, with tow options, because asking whether to 'remain' or 'leave' with yes no option influences people choice. Apparently people are more against a loss than an equivalent gain, they find it more psychogically damaging. So if the question is phrased like above, the loss is suggested by 'no to remaining'. If the question was 'Should the United Kingdom leave the European Union?' then a loss is suggested by 'yes to leaving'-these phrases could have very different psychological effects. If we also take into account that in neutral questions people may have a preference for one of yes or no, rather than 50/50, this also prejudices matters.

I suspect that they have framed the question as they did, rather than how you suggest, because they are fully aware it makes remaining in more likely.
Mainstream are fake Eurosceptics, only to appease some of the public and the right of their party. They are fully sold on the EU.
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HigherMinion
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I hope we don't leave the EU. It will crumble without us and immediately after that point, Europe will be back at war as it always has been. We can't have national sovereignty over a massacred people! A-a--and we have no money to support ourselves; we depend on the EU treasury for our bread and butter.
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A Mysterious Lord
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I was expecting something like "Do you want continued free trade with Europe?", so this is just about neutral enough.
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MatureStudent36
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(Original post by HigherMinion)
I hope we don't leave the EU. It will crumble without us and immediately after that point, Europe will be back at war as it always has been. We can't have national sovereignty over a massacred people! A-a--and we have no money to support ourselves; we depend on the EU treasury for our bread and butter.
Are you trolling?
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HigherMinion
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(Original post by MatureStudent36)
Are you trolling?
Come on MS: trolling is such a vague and vulgar word. I was being sarcastic, using irony to mock the pro-EU side and baiting for a response.

Thanks for playing.
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MatureStudent36
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(Original post by HigherMinion)
Come on MS: trolling is such a vague and vulgar word. I was being sarcastic, using irony to mock the pro-EU side and baiting for a response.

Thanks for playing.
It was your claim that the UK is reliant on EU money. You do know that the UK pays more in than it gets out?
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nulli tertius
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(Original post by L i b)
I don't like the whole yes-no thing on ballot papers. I prefer a wording like

"Indicate your preference--

The United Kingdom should remain a member of the European Union [ ]
The United Kingdom should not remain a member of the European Union [ ]"

Equally there is also the (less used in the UK) option of changing the order of the options, so - say - in half of them the 'stay in' option is on the top, and on the other half it is on the bottom. Better yet, side-by-side.
There are two things more significant than any implied bias in being the "yes" option.

The first is that the vote truly reflects voters' intentions. The experience with referenda round the world is that it is very easy to mislead voters. Your suggestion provides a one word difference in a relatively complex sentence. I think you will get a lot of people who simply do not understand what they are presented with.

Secondly both sides have to be able to run coherent campaigns that coincide with the choice offered to voters. The slogan "Vote 'The United Kingdom should remain a member of the European Union'. You know it makes sense" isn't exactly catchy.

In some places they run referenda campaigns on the basis "Vote Option A" or "Vote Option 2" but that raises the same issue as wishing to be "yes" in any campaign.
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cambio wechsel
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#17
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#17
Should be:

"Better out than in". Discuss.
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Reformed2010
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The UK is a liberal, democratic and open society. So many things we take for granted are seen as still near utopian to those marginalised people in Eastern Europe and the world. The right to life, vote, fee trade, equality, open justice, the ability to tolerate differences and the yearning for a high living standard. Being a part of the EU has enabled us, along with France and Germany, to peacefully spread these norm and values across an entire continent. The ECHR? Championed by Britain. The Single market? Championed by Britain. The EU common security and foreign policy? Championed by Britain. A federal Europe? Championed by Churchill himself! The TTIP? Championed by Britain. The EU Single patent? Championed by Britain. To turn our back on EU would be turning our back on British influence, success and power.

(Original post by HigherMinion)
Come on MS: trolling is such a vague and vulgar word. I was being sarcastic, using irony to mock the pro-EU side and baiting for a response.

Thanks for playing.
(Original post by MatureStudent36)
It was your claim that the UK is reliant on EU money. You do know that the UK pays more in than it gets out?
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Davij038
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The only way that we can get free trade agreements with non EU countries is by leaving the EU- this is why successful countries like Germany are not held back by EU red tape! (Think I'll let that sink in for a moment ...)



I think this high lights how monumentally ridiculous euro sceptic claims are: you think people are clever enough to have the choice to choose the UKs future but might be put off having to choose between a more positive yes and no is absurd. I should also point out that the Scottish independence had the yes option too. The hard euro sceptics will accept only one vote as genuine if people vote to stay in it's because of brainwashing- (the fact that about half of the newspapers are highly euro sceptic shouldn't be accounted )
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HigherMinion
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(Original post by Reformed2010)
The UK is a liberal, democratic and open society. So many things we take for granted are seen as still near utopian to those marginalised people in Eastern Europe and the world. The right to life, vote, fee trade, equality, open justice, the ability to tolerate differences and the yearning for a high living standard. Being a part of the EU has enabled us, along with France and Germany, to peacefully spread these norm and values across an entire continent. The ECHR? Championed by Britain. The Single market? Championed by Britain. The EU common security and foreign policy? Championed by Britain. A federal Europe? Championed by Churchill himself! The TTIP? Championed by Britain. The EU Single patent? Championed by Britain. To turn our back on EU would be turning our back on British influence, success and power.
You say that as if the Spanish hated other Spanish people and wished them ill, unless they were wealthy before the EU. This couldn't be further from the truth. The same in Portugal. These European peoples have always taken care of their own and to have the arrogance to suggest that the UK, France and Germany do these things BETTER in the context of our own people is demonstrably incorrect. Spain is a very family-centric nation and care for their people (old and young alike) in a way we wish we would (voluntarily). We have not helped these countries' people become better. We have only made things worse.

Who cares if Churchill championed anything? He was a warmonger and a Zionist. That war was the pivotal moment marking the reversal in Britain's fortune.

P.S. The European Court of Human Rights and the declaration of human rights, etc. is a nonsense.

(Original post by Davij038)
The only way that we can get free trade agreements with non EU countries is by leaving the EU- this is why successful countries like Germany are not held back by EU red tape! (Think I'll let that sink in for a moment ...)
Yes, because the reverse is also true. So let's get our sovereignty and the sovereignty for every other European nation back in the hands of each respective state, and then deal with trade after. The fearmongering comes from those who bring the economy in to the argument.
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