Four in 10 students say university not good value

Says you, who doesn't know the difference between 'have' and 'of'.

OMG hahahahah. Finding grammatical mistakes in my post because you can't find any mistakes in my actual argument. Oh god, you must be such a fun person.

Your 'argument' is totally stupid. I've already responded to a similar line of thought in this thread so I'm not going to waste my time doing it again just because you're incapable of reading through. How you think you can go around calling graduates 'dumb' when you don't even have a basic grasp of grammar is beyond me. Trying to deflect my point by insinuating that I'm not a 'fun' person is totally irrelevant and shows your lack of ability to engage in any kind of mature discussion.

If your argument technique is to belittle and stay away from the point, then I wish you good luck with your future endeavors
I made a perfectly valid point, referring to the obvious correlation between the quality of student + their resultant qualification, and whether they thought the degree was worth the money. Completely valid point. You cannot even attempt to say there is zero correlation there. I just expressed it in a relaxed way, no perfect construction, no perfect grammar, none of which is needed to convey a point fairly. Therefore, the only point you could come up with in your argument - of me being a hypocrite - is flawed. Got a better stance you can argue from? It's fine if not, you can just accept my point is true

Deflect your point? You could only bring up my grammar. Not exactly an excellent point if you ask me. You really are deluded.

f*cking idiots

The people that think it's not value for money are the ones doing Land Economy at Kingston University.

Take for example the 'career prospects' section on the website for my degree:

Graduates in Philosophy obtain work in such fields as advertising, the arts, broadcasting, commerce, the Civil Service, computing, journalism, marketing, politics, law, management and teaching.
Sounds great, right?

Then uni stats tells you the truth:

Typical salary £14-20K
40% In employment
15% In further study
10% Studying and working
30% Unemployed

Of those in employment:

50% in a professional/managerial role
50% not in a professional/managerial role

So of those 40% who actually have a full time job, 50% of them are not in graduate roles. So they're doing entry level things that I've mentioned - shop work/call center/care work etc and 30% of the overall are on the dole! My Alma Matter is a top 30 RG and the course is hardly Basket Weaving BA Hons.

I made a perfectly valid point, referring to the obvious correlation between the quality of student + their resultant qualification

Basically 4/10 University students are too stupid for University and shouldn't of gone...

You don't know that. There are graduates from RGs/Top 30s who are unsatisfied with the value of their degree. By just waving off the whole debate with that remark you're totally missing the point. There are people in the UK with good degrees from good universities who are on school leaver salaries or on the dole.

Right to education is a human right.

Whether it will be a right our Tory overlords give is another question I guess....

Connecting degrees so closely to jobs here might be part of the problem, on two levels. Firstly, there is the rather depressing fact that a lot of people see their degree, and education in general, in purely instrumental terms. If one attaches no value to the actual process of education one is likely to attach less value to the sum of the process and the economic result. Secondly, if you start your degree on the (usually) mistaken assumption that it alone will be enough to get you the job you want, without your developing your CV in other ways, you're likely to find that you can't get the jobs you thought you could, and end up blaming your degree, whereas really it's on you.

Right to education is not a human right, literally there is no such thing as human right imo. Human rights are provided by the 5% smartest people to secure their place (or to obtain their place) in a cleverer way than oppressing on the 95% of common people.

...

You can't appeal to articles in international conventions to establish that it 'is' a 'human right' in a moral sense. It just doesn't work.

I wasn't trying to.

In which case I would expect us to agree that when you argue, say, that it's not ungrateful to complain and consider oneself oppressed when one only gets 18 years of free education and a bunch of extremely favourable credit for further education because education is a 'human right', you're rather missing the point.

sheesh, are you following me around?

I agree in a sense. it's nothing like being say tortured. But you can still complain about it.

But you don';t have to be grateful about having human rights. They are not a privileged bestowed on you from above, rather something people fought for and won meaning that you are entitled to just for being a human being. I agree however that free uni education does not come under that. HOWEVER. In the uni fees debate the person was auguring with brought up lower state education, like you are lucky to have that as it is stop complaining, well access to education up to 18 is verging on human rights territory. You are not lucky to have access to free state schools. They are your right.

It's all idiotic. Most people don't pay back their loan so "9k a year" means diddly squat to them.