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    (Original post by Cellardore)
    well if you think about it, especially in Britain and USA, the law is based alot aroubd Christian beliefs i.e. tho shall not kill/ steal ect

    So if there was no religion, I don't think there will be any structure, law and order or morals.

    Mind you who really has the right to say what is wrong or right?
    Do you have any evidence that nonchtistians think killing stealing etc are good activities? Everybody- including christians- qualifies these statements. Killing or taking things don't always count as murder or theft. Most societies make laws, not on the basis of what someone says is right or wrong, but what most people agree are right or wrong.
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    Are Jehovas witnesses still around? I havn't seen any in a while. They seem to live rather strange lives, determined to knock on peoples doors and hand out little leaflets with pictures of rainbows and smiling people running through grassy fields. All seems rather pointless.
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    (Original post by calumc)
    Are Jehovas witnesses still around? I havn't seen any in a while. They seem to live rather strange lives, determined to knock on peoples doors and hand out little leaflets with pictures of rainbows and smiling people running through grassy fields. All seems rather pointless.
    Next time they call round, invite them in. Pretend you give a **** about what they're saying for a couple of hours then say you'll be right back. Return with candles and pigs' blood. Splatter pigs' blood on the floor and make a pentagram with the candles. Stand in the middle of the pentagram and try to look demonic whilst chanting in tongues. Remember to keep eye contact as they **** themselves. For extra fun, set up a live webcam feed.
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    (Original post by calumc)
    Are Jehovas witnesses still around? I havn't seen any in a while. They seem to live rather strange lives, determined to knock on peoples doors and hand out little leaflets with pictures of rainbows and smiling people running through grassy fields. All seems rather pointless.
    ye man, just look for some really smart people in balck suits

    My dad used to be a jehovah witness, so I know wat they do an stuff

    I'll be happy to discuss it!

    Tom
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    (Original post by austinmetro)
    I'll be happy to discuss it!
    How many people did your dad convert? How many doors did he get slammed in his face?
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    religion is the reason this world is falling apart
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    (Original post by icklehc)
    religion is the reason this world is falling apart
    Elaborate.
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    i hav respect for those who have faith in God however i could not myself because i believe that religion causes social and political problems all over the world.
    Having faith can bring relief to many people and helps them in many ways but when taken too far can create anger and violence.
    When combined with politics and greed it creates War.
    Therefore i think that without religion the world would be a much safer place.
    Plus i dont realy understand how people can have faith in something/someone who cannot prevent death and suffereing all over the world
    its only my opinion so i dont want any abusive posts bak
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    (Original post by randdom)
    I know that there are negative aspects of religion I am not denying this but I don't think that a world without religion would be a good thing. Religion in the past dictated the laws that we now live by. They also in the past have developed so advances in science.
    Religion does not dictate laws, people do. Dont bother replying with any 'OH but such and such a law is obviously drawn from the bible and blahblahblah' because who dictates religious doctrine? the PEOPLE.
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    (Original post by RDoh)
    Next time they call round, invite them in. Pretend you give a **** about what they're saying for a couple of hours then say you'll be right back. Return with candles and pigs' blood. Splatter pigs' blood on the floor and make a pentagram with the candles. Stand in the middle of the pentagram and try to look demonic whilst chanting in tongues. Remember to keep eye contact as they **** themselves. For extra fun, set up a live webcam feed.
    Or you could just tell them you are Catholic.
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    (Original post by Joey_Johns)
    Or you could just tell them you are Catholic.
    But my idea is more amusing. Plus they'd never come near you again
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    (Original post by an Siarach)
    Religion does not dictate laws, people do. Dont bother replying with any 'OH but such and such a law is obviously drawn from the bible and blahblahblah' because who dictates religious doctrine? the PEOPLE.
    I said that religion in the past dictated laws they don't ever more. A lot of laws today were introduced by religion. That doesn't meant that laws can't change just that originally they came from religion. By religion I do not mean the bible. The original 10 comandments I believe came in the old testiment which was Jewish not christian. Religion no longer dictates law but in the past it did.
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    (Original post by randdom)
    I said that religion in the past dictated laws they don't ever more. A lot of laws today were introduced by religion. That doesn't meant that laws can't change just that originally they came from religion. By religion I do not mean the bible. The original 10 comandments I believe came in the old testiment which was Jewish not christian. Religion no longer dictates law but in the past it did.
    The point i was making is that Religion is a human creation, so the *absence* of religion would not make the world a worse place. Previous posts attributed law and order to religion and conveyed the impression that the lack of religion in society would result in a far less pleasant world which is nonsense.

    There are irritating people in every sect of society, because they are all human. Being religious is no guarentee of character quality or of strong principles, ethics etc. The greatest hypocrites i know are people who profess themselves to be 'christians' but get drunk ,take drugs , lie, **** around and so on regardless while some of the most principled hold no religious beleifs.
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    (Original post by an Siarach)
    The point i was making is that Religion is a human creation, so the *absence* of religion would not make the world a worse place. Previous posts attributed law and order to religion and conveyed the impression that the lack of religion in society would result in a far less pleasant world which is nonsense.
    I don't think anyone can really know what the world would be like without religion. It may be a better place or it may be a worse place we have not way or figuring it out. It's like saying would Britain be a better place if we hadn't been invaded by the normans. People just can't know. People who are religious often believe that religion was made by god and therefor the absense of religion would mean the absence of god on earth which in their view would make the world worse. I don't really know if i believe that but it is what some people believe.
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    (Original post by randdom)
    I don't think anyone can really know what the world would be like without religion. It may be a better place or it may be a worse place we have not way or figuring it out. It's like saying would Britain be a better place if we hadn't been invaded by the normans. People just can't know. People who are religious often believe that religion was made by god and therefor the absense of religion would mean the absence of god on earth which in their view would make the world worse. I don't really know if i believe that but it is what some people believe.
    Religion is a human creation, a human interpretation of how the world came to be, how it works and how we should conduct ourselves. If there were no religion there would still be laws and society, only of a different form. As you say its pointless wondering what the world would be like if such and such an event hadnt occured. My point was merely that as religion is a human creation, its absence would be filled by another human substitute so the suggestion that the world would be a worse place isnt true, as Human character would have to be fundementally changed for our situation to be radically worse or better.
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    (Original post by an Siarach)
    The point i was making is that Religion is a human creation, so the *absence* of religion would not make the world a worse place. Previous posts attributed law and order to religion and conveyed the impression that the lack of religion in society would result in a far less pleasant world which is nonsense.

    There are irritating people in every sect of society, because they are all human. Being religious is no guarentee of character quality or of strong principles, ethics etc. The greatest hypocrites i know are people who profess themselves to be 'christians' but get drunk ,take drugs , lie, **** around and so on regardless while some of the most principled hold no religious beleifs.

    But British Law is very clearly based on Chrisitian laws, and these don't originate in Britain, so the British Laws could easily be based on another religion, like the paganism that was practised before Christianity was brought here. So even if religion is purely man-made, it is perfectly correct to say that religions influence law and society, particularly if the religion was not created by the people of that society.


    Obviously if they're hypocrites, they're not really Christians. You can't discredit a religion by pointing to people who claim to be Christain while not living by those beliefs. It's like discrediting the police force because of a couple of dishonest/racist/homophobic officers - it doesn't mean all police officers are bad, or that the idea of police officers is flawed.

    But yes, I agree: religious people do not have a monopoly on "being good". Jesus' message, for example, was a very humanist one, and you don't have to believe that he was the Son of God to appreciate that being nice to other people, which was his main message, is a good one. Religion may have guided some people on doing what is right, others don't need it.
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    (Original post by hitchhiker_13)
    But British Law is very clearly based on Chrisitian laws, and these don't originate in Britain, so the British Laws could easily be based on another religion, like the paganism that was practised before Christianity was brought here. So even if religion is purely man-made, it is perfectly correct to say that religions influence law and society, particularly if the religion was not created by the people of that society.


    Obviously if they're hypocrites, they're not really Christians. You can't discredit a religion by pointing to people who claim to be Christain while not living by those beliefs. It's like discrediting the police force because of a couple of dishonest/racist/homophobic officers - it doesn't mean all police officers are bad, or that the idea of police officers is flawed.

    But yes, I agree: religious people do not have a monopoly on "being good". Jesus' message, for example, was a very humanist one, and you don't have to believe that he was the Son of God to appreciate that being nice to other people, which was his main message, is a good one. Religion may have guided some people on doing what is right, others don't need it.
    Wow. This had developed into a rather serious debate. Hitchhiker_13: Very wise words. I agree totally.

    People seem to claim that religion is needed to show the difference between wrong and right, and what to do and what not, but I think that is human nature, not something force upon people by religion. People say that religion is good, and God works through people on all manner of projects. But when the Salvation Army get people of the streets who is doing the work, God or the people?
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    (Original post by hitchhiker_13)
    But British Law is very clearly based on Chrisitian laws, and these don't originate in Britain, so the British Laws could easily be based on another religion, like the paganism that was practised before Christianity was brought here. So even if religion is purely man-made, it is perfectly correct to say that religions influence law and society, particularly if the religion was not created by the people of that society.


    Obviously if they're hypocrites, they're not really Christians. You can't discredit a religion by pointing to people who claim to be Christain while not living by those beliefs. It's like discrediting the police force because of a couple of dishonest/racist/homophobic officers - it doesn't mean all police officers are bad, or that the idea of police officers is flawed.

    But yes, I agree: religious people do not have a monopoly on "being good". Jesus' message, for example, was a very humanist one, and you don't have to believe that he was the Son of God to appreciate that being nice to other people, which was his main message, is a good one. Religion may have guided some people on doing what is right, others don't need it.
    I dont deny that our laws are based on religious ones! How many times do i have to say it, my point is that as religion is man made, it would merely be replaced by another man made creation from which laws would be based.
    My statement as to hypocritical christians was merely to make the point that yes some of them are truly irritating, AS ARE THOSE OF ANY OTHER SECT OR CLIQUE. This is what i hate about debates relating to something religious, they always end up being so ****ing pedantic.
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    (Original post by Louise_1988)
    When I was waiting for a concert a few months ago some jehova's witnesses came up and started preaching to us. It was a bit unfair that we were in a que and couldn't get away so had to listen, they had ovbiously targeted us, then they had the cheek to insult us and tell us we would go to hell because we were drinking **shock horror** beer. They also told us we would go to hell and have red hot nails put through our eyelids. It wasn't only annoying having them interupt our conversation but they were plain rude. I know not all are like this but that's just my experience with some.
    are u sure they were rude? they are meant to be all nice and stuff..
    we get them coming to our front door and preaching... they are always so nice and my mum gets really annoyed by them, u can tell them to f**k off and they will stil say ok sorry to bother you!
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    (Original post by samdavyson)
    Wow. This had developed into a rather serious debate. Hitchhiker_13: Very wise words. I agree totally.

    People seem to claim that religion is needed to show the difference between wrong and right, and what to do and what not, but I think that is human nature, not something force upon people by religion. People say that religion is good, and God works through people on all manner of projects. But when the Salvation Army get people of the streets who is doing the work, God or the people?
    Youve summed it up there much better than ive managed over the last 3 or 4 posts, human nature is responsible for our society and laws. The good in the world is the result of the good in humanity just as the evil is our responsibility also. That some of us explain ourselves through religion does not make us reliant upon it.
 
 
 
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