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    I always liked the idea of being a teacher (primary or secondary). However I've read and heard a lot of negative things about the PGCE which frankly just put me off.

    I am still doing my Bachelors in Arts but I thought I'd like to teach, probably abroad and leave the UK for a while.

    Has anyone done teacher training abroad and is it only specific to one country or could you then teach internationally?

    I know there is the CELTA and TEFL but I'm not too keen on 'just' teaching English.

    I'm just exploring options at the moment and it would be great to read from someone who can recommend teacher training abroad
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    What specifically puts you off about the PGCE? And which other countries would you be thinking of doing your training in? The US, for example, is problematic as training and curricula vary widely from state to state, meaning that consequently, once you are qualified in a particular state, you are often only qualified to teach in that state (unless of course they have reciprocal agreements with a few other states, which can happen). Your qualifications would also likely have to be verified by NARIC or a similar organisation on your return to ensure you'd qualified under similar/equivalent standards to the PGCE.

    In European terms, once you've qualified in one member state, then technically/in theory, that means your qualification should be recognised in other member states. However, in practice, this is frequently not the case.

    For what it's worth, I live and teach in France (NB in an international school) and I did look into getting the French teaching qualification (CAPES) at some point. However, it's extremely theoretical and you only pass or fail based on the number of new teachers they actually need that year - meaning that you can actually be very competent in your subject and yet remain in the system for years. You then have to agree to be sent anywhere you're needed if you wish to teach in the public sector - often into the toughest schools - with, as I said, very little in the way of practical training. And of course, you need to be a fluent French speaker to pursue this route - which I am, but the lack of pedagogical instruction involved put me off, and I ended up gaining QTS via the assessment-only route after several years in the international sector.

    If you plan to teach in international schools abroad, it can be the case that some of these schools ONLY hire qualified teachers, in which case it could be better to get the PGCE/NQT year under your belt before leaving anyhow.

    But as I mentioned initially, you'd need to share more ideas about where you'd be thinking of qualifying instead, and what specifically about the PGCE repels you so, before anyone can give you any really meaningful assistance.
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    Thank you for your reply, it was really insightful.

    In regards to the PGCE, I should have said it differently, I meant the situation in the UK which put me off and scared me. All the Ofsted inspections, the pressures of achieving 'Outstanding'. But also from what I've read, many people have quit their PGCEs or found it incredibly hard and exhausting. A friend did the PGCE, too and all the paperwork he had to do instead of teaching just did not sound very enjoyable.

    But then again, perhaps it is in many countries like this and maybe I have very false expectations.

    For what it matters, I know a mature lady who was a (primary, I think) school teacher in Ecuador and she loved that job and teaching children who were really keen and interested in education. That would be what I'd enjoy and how I'd like to see teaching: something that I enjoy and see that people enjoy too and less bureaucratic and less trying to get a rowdy class under control. But perhaps in that case, I'm not made for teaching.. I don't know. On the other hand, I'm not sure if I'd feel mentally unchallenged after years of teachng in primary schoos. I repeat, I'm just looking at options at the moment.

    May I ask what subject(s) you teach?
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    (Original post by meaow1990)
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    Angelil is right. It is a complex world out there. There are these important factors to consider:

    a) Are you fluent in the language of the country you want to teach? - This is vital if you don't want to "just teach English". You will need to be fluent in the country language (that will be Spanish if you want to teach something other than English in Ecuador)
    b) Have you studied the subject you want to teach at secondary level? - This is vital for secondary. In many European countries, if you don't have a degree in x you cannot teach x
    c) Is the country you want to train to teach (and teach) in Europe? - If it isn't, you will need a visa to get in and you will likely need to pay for the teacher training yourself.
    d) Do you have any experience teaching? - I mean teaching not tutoring. This is an important question to answer before you spend money and time on something you might not enjoy. And even if you do, it is important that you get this experience in the country you want to teach in, because of teaching styles vary across cultures.
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    I teach secondary English to students aged 12-18. I also teach humanities to IGCSE students (so aged around 15).

    To add also to Juichiro's very important points:

    a) Some people live/work abroad without speaking the language (possible, if you want to work in the international sector/will be teaching your chosen subject in English). However, I would NOT recommend this - even if you are teaching in English, your work contract will likely be in the language of the country concerned, all utility bills will be in that language, you will likely have to deal with medical professionals in that language etc. In France, it's very much "français, c'est la langue de la république" and if you don't speak it...tough. NO special provisions are made for you.

    b) Quite right. As true abroad as in the UK. In international schools it may even be worse in some respects - for languages, for example, many schools will only hire native speakers to teach that language (i.e. Brits, Americans etc to teach English, French people to teach French, Spanish people to teach Spanish and so on), so even if, say, you'd done a French degree as a British person at a British university, your options would be closed to you in a way that they wouldn't be in the UK. Saying that, though, it can work both ways - some schools are prepared to employ a degree of flexibility. My degrees are in Classics, English and Linguistics, so my teaching English makes a lot of sense. However, as mentioned above, I also teach humanities - specifically, an IGCSE course called Global Perspectives, which is a complex mixture of geography, politics, business, economics, current affairs, sociology, and so on. I have an A Level in History. I only studied geography until I was 14 (and, frankly, was crap at it). I never had a chance to study economics. Didn't want to study politics, business or sociology even though I had the chance to do so. So you wouldn't think I was exactly a prime candidate to teach this subject! However, my school believed in me/thought I had sufficient transferable critical skills to make it work. And I do. The kids who choose to sign up love it, and clearly it wouldn't be sustainable if they didn't - no kids who want to take it equals no class. So in short, there *can* be some flexibility, but don't bank on it.

    c) Yep.

    d) I acknowledge that my route into teaching was a little special. I volunteered for four months in a secondary school in the UK, and then worked for 2 months as a teaching assistant in a primary school in France before transferring to secondary teaching. I'd also babysat in the UK for many years, as well as privately tutoring a variety of students, so with all that together, I could claim to have some experience of children and teaching. But many schools will require more than that. I was lucky. You may not be - hence my original advice to get your PGCE and NQT in the UK before heading off.

    You could also ask on the TES Teaching Overseas forum - the people there have a lot of experience and will be thus very well-equipped to advise.
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    (Original post by Angelil)
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    PRSOM
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    haha, I get that a lot for you and Juichiro too
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    (Original post by meaow1990)
    On the other hand, I'm not sure if I'd feel mentally unchallenged after years of teachng in primary schoos. I repeat, I'm just looking at options at the moment.

    May I ask what subject(s) you teach?
    I don't really think there's too much of an issue of feeling mentally under challenged in primary education. There is plenty to think about in terms of how to approach education effectively besides subject knowledge.
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    (Original post by meaow1990)
    On the other hand, I'm not sure if I'd feel mentally unchallenged after years of teachng in primary schoos. I repeat, I'm just looking at options at the moment.

    May I ask what subject(s) you teach?
    Personally, I find this rather insulting and feel it shows your lack of maturity and understanding.

    Spend a week shadowing a primary school teacher, then tell me again if you think you would feel 'mentally unchallenged'.
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    I apologise if you read an insult in that post, I did not mean to insult anyone?

    I did some afternoon classes/clubs with primary school children but it was in a totally different context so I cant say I have or havent gained a lot of experience. Probably not.
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    (Original post by meaow1990)
    I always liked the idea of being a teacher (primary or secondary). However I've read and heard a lot of negative things about the PGCE which frankly just put me off. I'm just exploring options at the moment and it would be great to read from someone who can recommend teacher training abroad
    If you've read the local newspapers or you have good lecturers who've told you the state of the teaching fraternity or the overall quality of teachers that are churned out annually, then you'll know that going abroad for quality teacher training would hold you in good stead.

    Besides the fact that the wages for teachers are significantly higher abroad along with perks like free housing and so on, you may get to work in a select few countries which has high qualities of teacher training, better quality control and you will realize that the education sector in those few countries is free from outside influence and it is very systematic.

    Don't be surprised if when you try to do exam questions which are set in those few countries, you may actually pose difficulties. Experiences like this will open your eyes. You can try contacting the British Council as they run dialogue sessions every now and then on topics like going abroad for study/work.
    Spoiler:
    Show
    I find it strange that a former journalist was the former education secretary . I often asked myself what would an ex journalist know about managing schools and teachers, assessing whether the quality of the syllabus needed further refinement, ensuring that examinations are of the highest rigour and so on.
    I applaud you for wanting to break out of this vicious cycle of being stuck in the same, failing system and instead wanting to undergo better teacher training elsewhere. Well done!
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    (Original post by puss n boots)
    If you've read the local newspapers or you have good lecturers who've told you the state of the teaching fraternity or the overall quality of teachers that are churned out annually, then you'll know that going abroad for quality teacher training would hold you in good stead.

    Besides the fact that the wages for teachers are significantly higher abroad along with perks like free housing and so on, you may get to work in a select few countries which has high qualities of teacher training, better quality control and you will realize that the education sector in those few countries is free from outside influence and it is very systematic.

    Don't be surprised if when you try to do exam questions which are set in those few countries, you may actually pose difficulties. Experiences like this will open your eyes. You can try contacting the British Council as they run dialogue sessions every now and then on topics like going abroad for study/work.
    Spoiler:
    Show
    I find it strange that a former journalist was the former education secretary . I often asked myself what would an ex journalist know about managing schools and teachers, assessing whether the quality of the syllabus needed further refinement, ensuring that examinations are of the highest rigour and so on.
    I applaud you for wanting to break out of this vicious cycle of being stuck in the same, failing system and instead wanting to undergo better teacher training elsewhere. Well done!
    What examples of countries are you thinking of? I'm intrigued. And what is your source of this information?

    Your comment about "exam questions[...]set in those few countries" is very vague. More details?
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    (Original post by Angelil)
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    (Original post by puss n boots)
    If you've read the local newspapers or you have good lecturers who've told you the state of the teaching fraternity or the overall quality of teachers that are churned out annually, then you'll know that going abroad for quality teacher training would hold you in good stead.

    Besides the fact that the wages for teachers are significantly higher abroad along with perks like free housing and so on, you may get to work in a select few countries which has high qualities of teacher training, better quality control and you will realize that the education sector in those few countries is free from outside influence and it is very systematic.

    Don't be surprised if when you try to do exam questions which are set in those few countries, you may actually pose difficulties. Experiences like this will open your eyes. You can try contacting the British Council as they run dialogue sessions every now and then on topics like going abroad for study/work.
    Spoiler:
    Show
    I find it strange that a former journalist was the former education secretary . I often asked myself what would an ex journalist know about managing schools and teachers, assessing whether the quality of the syllabus needed further refinement, ensuring that examinations are of the highest rigour and so on.
    I applaud you for wanting to break out of this vicious cycle of being stuck in the same, failing system and instead wanting to undergo better teacher training elsewhere. Well done!
    What Angelil said. The grass is not greener in other countries. It has a different colour so not sure you can really compare.
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    (Original post by Angelil)
    What examples of countries are you thinking of? I'm intrigued. And what is your source of this information?

    Your comment about "exam questions[...]set in those few countries" is very vague. More details?
    Hi there.

    I am referring to countries like South Korea, Finland and Singapore, that have very good education systems and very high levels of examination standards.

    Take your time to read through these articles.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/education-25751988
    http://www.bbc.com/news/education-32174423
    http://www.bbc.com/news/business-31087545

    Previous education ministers have made education into a political football. One by one, they make promises. But if anything, whats been happening is one scandal taking place after another. You couldn't make it up! Let me refresh your memory by giving you just a few examples.

    1)Third class degree holders being allowed to undergo teacher training?
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...collapses.html

    2) Corruption of exam boards?
    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/to...nation-boards/

    3) Teachers falsely passing unworthy students?
    http://www.theguardian.com/education...whistleblowers

    4) Examiners suspended for giving teachers unfair advice?
    http://www.bbc.com/news/education-16197500

    Should you quote me again and in the event I don't reply then it means that i've already said what I've wanted to say and i know that on my part, theres nothing more to say
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    I'm not denying that there are not things wrong with the British education system. But it doesn't mean that the system elsewhere is perfect either. Recently the Korean language teacher at my school gave us a talk about the South Korean education system. What she described sounded like a nightmare. This was a view expressed openly by several colleagues and she did not deny it. In fact, she said from the outset that her niece and family have moved to New Zealand as they believe the niece will have a better education (and better work/life balance) there...South Korean students have no time to socialise, and the pressure imposed by the hagwon system there is immense.

    I know less about the Finnish and Singaporean systems, although I do not need you to remind me of their good reputation internationally. Nonetheless, to come back to the original point of the OP, the concerns that I urged them to consider still stand (if nothing else, I strongly doubt that you can qualify to become a teacher under any of the systems that you mention without being a fluent speaker of that country's official language[s]). I am not saying it's impossible. But it's also not as simple as you're trying to make out. Furthermore, do you actually have any experience of any of the systems you endorse above (as a student or teacher), or are you basing your entire opinion on the views expressed by blogs and tabloid newspapers?

    (Original post by puss n boots)
    Hi there.

    I am referring to countries like South Korea, Finland and Singapore, that have very good education systems and very high levels of examination standards.

    Take your time to read through these articles.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/education-25751988
    http://www.bbc.com/news/education-32174423
    http://www.bbc.com/news/business-31087545

    Previous education ministers have made education into a political football. One by one, they make promises. But if anything, whats been happening is one scandal taking place after another. You couldn't make it up! Let me refresh your memory by giving you just a few examples.

    1)Third class degree holders being allowed to undergo teacher training?
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...collapses.html

    2) Corruption of exam boards?
    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/to...nation-boards/

    3) Teachers falsely passing unworthy students?
    http://www.theguardian.com/education...whistleblowers

    4) Examiners suspended for giving teachers unfair advice?
    http://www.bbc.com/news/education-16197500

    Should you quote me again and in the event I don't reply then it means that i've already said what I've wanted to say and i know that on my part, theres nothing more to say
 
 
 
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