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Online Focus Group: Black Students in British Education watch

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    (Original post by H&E)
    Let's not get into this argument again! It lasted 12 pages, and a very great deal of very, very rude language last time.
    Indeed, Jools wants new ideas. If he wants to follow that argument up I think the point was made more than enough times in the last thread!
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    (Original post by blissy)
    Indeed, Jools wants new ideas. If he wants to follow that argument up I think the point was made more than enough times in the last thread!
    I particularly like the emphasis on "made more than enough times" here.
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    Jools, I was talking about this with someone today and I won't reapeat what hase been said on the previous pages, but it could be interesting to look into what the black comedian Bill Crosby has said. In some ways his words are more useful than a white man's because he cannot appear racist. Although he mainly talks about America I think many of his explanations for why blacks are poorer are relivant in this country because many young males are influenced by their equivilents in America. Generall he attacks the kind of culture their parents bring them up in. This could be compared to people from east Asia having a very good work ethic because many parents force their children to work very hard. A large amount of society and culture stems from how your parents bring you up.
    This report here shows what he said. http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?n...d=237827&rfi=6

    I don't know if this is relevant to what you are doing, but it is interesting anyway.

    Louise
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    (Original post by samd294)
    Human DNA hasn't evolved one jot since the start of human civilisation let alone since some form of tangible technological warfare that would in any way replace the kind of "instinctive behaviour" you mention.
    It is FACT that black people and white people have different charatersitics since modern humans first arrived. Very slight but enough to easily be seen. Whether the DNA has changed or not isn't the point, clearly there are differences.

    I think perhaps competition could be a big reason why blacks have fallen down to whites in the past. When Africa was not over run by naughty white people out for a quick buck there was no competition so there was no need to change. In Europe however due to constant wars etc people had to go one better than their oppontants and the result of that is better weapons etc. I'd argue that localised competition is a big factor as well.

    The reason why the Greek empire fell was because they only fought each other for such a long time, they were only prepared to fight each other. When others invaded the area with different techniques and methods they were slaughtered.
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    NAACP! That's the organisation that we learnt in history!

    I think this is a big thing to take on, a very tough challenge Jools!
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    (Original post by samd294)
    That is abolutely proposterous! The idea that white DNA has somehow evolved differently in the last 900 years since the invention of modern weaponry is ridiculous.
    Indeed it is, I had a debate with somebody which went down this path some time ago (LSE vs. Sheffield thread):

    Afterall, Mendel back in C19th proved that the whole human 'race' (for wont of a better phrase) can attribute its genotype to a common genetic pool. It has also been proven that there is more genetic variance within racial groups than between the separate groups - therefore the whole idea of race as a classification based on science is flawed (it could be argued). Race is an engineered concept, fuelled and perpetuated by people's ignorance (coupled with a desire to preserve the socio-economic status-quo). This is what I am alluding to when I (rightly) question 'What is Race'?
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    (Original post by H&E)
    Let's not get into this argument again! It lasted 12 pages, and a very great deal of very, very rude language last time.
    Agreed. Jools asked me to make comment so I have. It is what I believe from my own observations. Any difference I talk about is VERY slight, I cannot SAY this enough.

    Jools wants some points for his degree, not a load of idiotic racist claims and foolish comments.
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    The reason black pupils achieve relatively little academically is their nurture, not their nature, quite simply.

    However, this isn't to say there isn't the possibility of disparities between races with regards to IQ. Let's look at this objectively and not let liberal knee-jerk reactions rule the roost.
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    (Original post by Lepr)
    The reason black pupils achieve relatively little academically is their nurture, not their nature, quite simply.

    However, this isn't to say there isn't the possibility of disparities between races with regards to IQ. Let's look at this objectively and not let liberal knee-jerk reactions rule the roost.
    Such as?
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    (Original post by Lepr)
    The reason black pupils achieve relatively little academically is their nurture, not their nature, quite simply.

    However, this isn't to say there isn't the possibility of disparities between races with regards to IQ. Let's look at this objectively and not let liberal knee-jerk reactions rule the roost.
    Excellent.
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    (Original post by mobbdeeprob)
    Such as?
    Such as one race being inherently more intelligent than another....
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    (Original post by Lepr)
    Such as one race being inherently more intelligent than another....
    Well if you're going to go about it that way (I have an open mind) then what race do you think has the highest IQ? With reasons.
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    (Original post by Joey_Johns)
    Agreed. Jools asked me to make comment so I have. It is what I believe from my own observations. Any difference I talk about is VERY slight, I cannot SAY this enough.

    Jools wants some points for his degree, not a load of idiotic racist claims and foolish comments.
    Indeed. However, I think both I and Davey_Boy have outlined fairly clearly that in the context of Jools' investigation, which is attempting to explain very dramatic differences, genetic factors are a side issue. Therefore I don't think they are worth dwelling over at any great length.
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    "liberal knee-jerk reactions" thats one of gnostics finest if ere i saw one.
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    (Original post by Lepr)
    The reason black pupils achieve relatively little academically is their nurture, not their nature, quite simply.

    However, this isn't to say there isn't the possibility of disparities between races with regards to IQ. Let's look at this objectively and not let liberal knee-jerk reactions rule the roost.
    But you assume IQ is the best test off intelligence. There are many different types of intelligence IQ tests do not test them all. There is also a large amount of aptitude when it comes to university. In the current schooling system being intelligent will only get you so far, being hard working is also required. Being hard working comes from having aspirations which may be something which blacks are lacking. Mnay idols for blacks are sportsmen, rappers ect. these people do not provide the right kind of aspiration for these people.(Bill Crosby also said some interesting thing about this)
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    Sorry wait, let me use the liberal jargon. Not more intelligent, more 'suitable at responding to an assortment of intellectual tasks'. Not more stupid, just 'intellectually challenged'. I detest it when political correctness goes past the realm of tact and respect and into the realm of absurdity.
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    (Original post by Lepr)
    Such as one race being inherently more intelligent than another....
    Perhaps a so-called 'master race' which several civilizations (not just the obvious one) in history have tried to prove exists. I think this is nonesense quite frankly, especially when one considers that race has very little grounding in actual science. Long may resources be channeled into proving this end, and long may they be wasted as a result of this.
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    (Original post by Lepr)
    Sorry wait, let me use the liberal jargon. Not more intelligent, more 'suitable at responding to an assortment of intellectual tasks'. Not more stupid, just 'intellectually challenged'. I detest it when political correctness goes past the realm of tact and respect and into the realm of absurdity.
    **** off
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    (Original post by Mysticmin)
    Well if you're going to go about it that way (I have an open mind) then what race do you think has the highest IQ? With reasons.
    Ah, a liberal trap to condemn me as a racist. I have not, and will not suggest that one particular race is more intelligent than another, I'm simply pointing out that the possibility is plausible.
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    I don't think we can avoid the possibility that some races may be inherently more intelligent than others, it must be addressed. It is not insulting other races, it is simply looking at the genetics and seeing if this is the case.
 
 
 
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