The Student Room Group

Nice guy - bad guy...

I am what you would call a 'nice guy'. If a female mate (especially if I fancy them) asks me to do something for them I would do it. I would listen to their problems, and would think twice before saying something - incase I offend them. I guess I acted in this manner because I thought to myself that if I act nice, then maybe they will like me........I was wrong.

What just ended up happening was that with a lot fo these girls I am mates with, I just end up becoming an agony uncle - listening to strings of their problems from one boy to another and how they "wish that nice guys exist".

Lately, however I have stopped caring at all. I just cannot be bothered with how I am percieved, may it be positive or negative. For example, if a female mate tells me to do something and I cannot be bothered with doing it, I will say to them exactly that (just as I would do with a male mate). I am also finding that lately I have become a lot more cruder with my comments, as before I would be very reluctant to make a cocky joke incase I caused offense. I am less sensitive now, and cannot be bothered in listening to x relationship problem and if I have an opinion on something I would just say it. I feel like a right a dick deep down inside, but I just felt that before I was just being pushed around and seen as a softie.

Of course I am still affectionate i.e. I will give hugs etc and give advice when neeeded.

Is my behaviour right or wrong?

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Reply 1

You're obviously fed up of being a bit of an emotional doormat... It's neither right nor wrong, just frustration I think.

Reply 2

You just need to be yourself completely. There's no point in being someone you're not, or changing how you behave, in order to try and get someone to like you.
It's pointless being all 'nice' all the time if that isn't who you are, because you're kidding yourself, as well as the other person; but at the same time, there's also no point in trying to 'not care' if that's not you either.
What you need to do is to stop thinking about how other people see you, and start thinking about how you see yourself; that way you'll be the true you, and the person that ends up liking you will be better suited to you than whichever person you were adapting for. :smile:

Reply 3

Anonymous
I am what you would call a 'nice guy'. If a female mate (especially if I fancy them) asks me to do something for them I would do it. I would listen to their problems, and would think twice before saying something - incase I offend them. I guess I acted in this manner because I thought to myself that if I act nice, then maybe they will like me........I was wrong.

What just ended up happening was that with a lot fo these girls I am mates with, I just end up becoming an agony uncle - listening to strings of their problems from one boy to another and how they "wish that nice guys exist".

Lately, however I have stopped caring at all. I just cannot be bothered with how I am percieved, may it be positive or negative. For example, if a female mate tells me to do something and I cannot be bothered with doing it, I will say to them exactly that (just as I would do with a male mate). I am also finding that lately I have become a lot more cruder with my comments, as before I would be very reluctant to make a cocky joke incase I caused offense. I am less sensitive now, and cannot be bothered in listening to x relationship problem and if I have an opinion on something I would just say it. I feel like a right a dick deep down inside, but I just felt that before I was just being pushed around and seen as a softie.

Of course I am still affectionate i.e. I will give hugs etc and give advice when neeeded.

Is my behaviour right or wrong?

As you said, you are just acting the typical bloke. You act immaturely when these girls are asking you for help and although you do give them advice, some of it is laced with humour, as if you are not taking them seriously. Whilst some people would think that was ok, I personally think that you are being very unkind to these girls. They have come to trust you as someone who can help them through their problems and now you are effectively telling them that you don't care. If you don't care about their problems, just tell them that all of the time and not bother with the advice giving since if you give advice to some girls and not others you will cause a rift between you and them to form.
The girls you do help and give advice to will see you not giving advice to these other girls and conclude that you must like them more than those other girls. You will end up alienating the girls who you 'can't be bothered with' and may end up pushing away the other girls as well.

Reply 4

Visiting_Babylon
You're obviously fed up of being a bit of an emotional doormat... It's neither right nor wrong, just frustration I think.


Yeah I suppose your right, very very frustrated at the moment. Plus it doesn't really help that I have had quite bad experiences in the past. One girl I met, I felt got put off me after she found out how 'nice' I was. Another girl I know that was interested in me, keeps in contact whenever she feels like it. For example, I would e-mail/text her or whatever, she would contact me after months on end telling me some sad chapter in her life. I would reply - no reply back :s-smilie: (like wtf?)

Reply 5

It's just your way of dealing with issues you have. It'll probably pass in time or it's just your personality changing. Personality is an environmental trait, so it seems likely.

I've been in this position before, I got fed up with being the 'nice guy' and I actually had a short spell of just being, for lack of a better word - an *******. I eventually discovered that my friends liked me for who I am, not what I am. When I became the '*******' I soon found myself being distanced from people I was once close to.

It was only a phase though, I'm back to who I really am. If people can't accept me for being the 'nice guy' or want to have relationships with me; that's their loss, not mine. I'm a happier person because I don't want to be anyone else. You don't always get what you want in this life.

What would you rather have? Your wants or your resolve?

Just be warned - if you're going to go down the '*******' route, you will probably find you begin to have friends victimise you. You'll find yourself unhappy because you're being false. The grass is not always greener.

I've said this before and I'll say it again - All women are mental. I know how frustrating it is when they complain about wanting a 'nice guy' and you feel like screaming "I'm right here!"

The truth is women don't know what they want and they seem to expect blokes to work it out for them. You just need to learn how to not get stuck in the 'friend zone'. Try dating girls who you've just met in future and never compromise with just being friends.

Reply 6

wiwarin_mir
As you said, you are just acting the typical bloke. You act immaturely when these girls are asking you for help and although you do give them advice, some of it is laced with humour, as if you are not taking them seriously. Whilst some people would think that was ok, I personally think that you are being very unkind to these girls. They have come to trust you as someone who can help them through their problems and now you are effectively telling them that you don't care. If you don't care about their problems, just tell them that all of the time and not bother with the advice giving since if you give advice to some girls and not others you will cause a rift between you and them to form.
The girls you do help and give advice to will see you not giving advice to these other girls and conclude that you must like them more than those other girls. You will end up alienating the girls who you 'can't be bothered with' and may end up pushing away the other girls as well.


I think what the OP's really getting at is that he's not getting any sympathy from his girl mates, or any indication that they're thankful for it. He's seems to be the kind of person who can lap up a lot of other people's problems and not say anything about it, but there comes a time when you just think, "what about ME? Does nobody care how I feel?" In my experience, girls don't fancy a guy who gives them advice, so why would they give a damn if they see that he's helping X or helping Y. Girls don't seem to understand 'nice' guys who genuinely (as the OP is) are trying to help them. Especially if they fancy someone - it's painful giving advice to X when they actually fancy Y, but the OP actually fancies X himself.

Reply 7

wiwarin_mir
As you said, you are just acting the typical bloke. You act immaturely when these girls are asking you for help and although you do give them advice, some of it is laced with humour, as if you are not taking them seriously. Whilst some people would think that was ok, I personally think that you are being very unkind to these girls. They have come to trust you as someone who can help them through their problems and now you are effectively telling them that you don't care. If you don't care about their problems, just tell them that all of the time and not bother with the advice giving since if you give advice to some girls and not others you will cause a rift between you and them to form.
The girls you do help and give advice to will see you not giving advice to these other girls and conclude that you must like them more than those other girls. You will end up alienating the girls who you 'can't be bothered with' and may end up pushing away the other girls as well.


That is what I am worried about. I don't want to alienate them. But at the same time I don't want to become their 'gay' best mate or an emotional toy for whenever they have problems. I do care, and give advice but don't sugarcoat it like I would have done.

Also, it is incredibly frustrating (sorry girls) when I hear girls say "why are there no nice guys???" to me - when they are talking to one.

Reply 8

Nix!
I've said this before and I'll say it again - All women are mental. I know how frustrating it is when they complain about wanting a 'nice guy' and you feel like screaming "I'm right here!"


Not all women are mental, some of us do appreciate the nice blokes, this usually occurs after being with the complete evil ratbags.

Reply 9

Nix!
It's just your way of dealing with issues you have. It'll probably pass in time or it's just your personality changing. Personality is an environmental trait, so it seems likely.

I've been in this position before, I got fed up with being the 'nice guy' and I actually had a short spell of just being, for lack of a better word - an *******. I eventually discovered that my friends liked me for who I am, not what I am. When I became the '*******' I soon found myself being distanced from people I was once close to.

It was only a phase though, I'm back to who I really am. If people can't accept me for being the 'nice guy' or want to have relationships with me; that's their loss, not mine. I'm a happier person because I don't want to be anyone else. You don't always get what you want in this life.

What would you rather have? Your wants or your resolve?

Just be warned - if you're going to go down the '*******' route, you will probably find you begin to have friends victimise you. You'll find yourself unhappy because you're being false. The grass is not always greener.

I've said this before and I'll say it again - All women are mental. I know how frustrating it is when they complain about wanting a 'nice guy' and you feel like screaming "I'm right here!"

The truth is women don't know what they want and they seem to expect blokes to work it out for them. You just need to learn how to not get stuck in the 'friend zone'. Try dating girls who you've just met in future and never compromise with just being friends.


Yes, exactly. Well it gets even worse when girls say "Ohh your such a good looking guy, I am sure there is someone out there for you" (oh ffs man!) :biggrin: . One of my female mates is incredble to listen to, she said to me once "You know what x you are the complete package. You are nice, good looking and intelligent" , I just thought (so why am I single???? Fantastic!) :s-smilie:

I think my personality is changing a bit, I mean your right with the whole turning into a bastard thing - it could be seriously bad for the reasons you have stated. But the thing is, and this is what I am currently disliking about myself, I am becoming quite self-centred lately. I am very stylish now, working out and bulking up and carrying a personality like this :frown: I wish I could just be a nice guy, but I honestly feel as though no girl appreciates it/rather they are attracted to the cocky/arrogant types.

Reply 10

Anonymous
That is what I am worried about. I don't want to alienate them. But at the same time I don't want to become their 'gay' best mate or an emotional toy for whenever they have problems. I do care, and give advice but don't sugarcoat it like I would have done.

Also, it is incredibly frustrating (sorry girls) when I hear girls say "why are there no nice guys???" to me - when they are talking to one.

Don't worry about how they will see you. They will know that if they have a problem, they can depend on you to listen to them and offer good advice without laughing at them or making a joke out of the situation.

If any of the girls in your close friendship group wanted to have a relationship with you, they wouldn't just stand around saying how they wished they could find a nice guy, because they would have found one in you. Remember that some people value a friendship so much that they won't do things that could result in the friendship ending. Remember that when people first start going out with each other, they will not have a complete picture of what the other person is like and so there can be instances where a friend is not a good partner. If you go out with a friend and then end up breaking up, the original friendship could be ruined. That is what some people are scared about if they are attracted to people within their friendship circle, especially close friends.

Some girls like a guy who is nice and caring and emotional and can act in a mature manner when faced with problems. Don't try and force trying to find a girl, let it happen naturally, even if you don't find one straight away.

Reply 11

Anonymous
Yes, exactly. Well it gets even worse when girls say "Ohh your such a good looking guy, I am sure there is someone out there for you" (oh ffs man!) :biggrin: . One of my female mates is incredble to listen to, she said to me once "You know what x you are the complete package. You are nice, good looking and intelligent" , I just thought (so why am I single???? Fantastic!) :s-smilie:



From personal experience, this is the kind of thing I'd say if I was trying to hint at the guy to make a move, cuz I'd be too shy to myself.
Then again, I've also said this to a good friend when he was feeling upset about being single.
Maybe the girls want you to make the move though?

Reply 12

Visiting_Babylon
Not all women are mental, some of us do appreciate the nice blokes, this usually occurs after being with the complete evil ratbags.

Case in point then, you are blind. You don't know what you want. Stop trying to defend something which is beyond refute.

You [females] say you want 'nice guys' but you go off with the arrogant lads who treat you like dirt. Authentic 'nice guys' who grow up, take on board that girls want 'nice guys' and develop accordingly. They are then shunned, lonely, hurt and finally confused because they've been neglected for the polar representation of what women claim they want. Women then use said 'nice guys' for recovering from their self-infliction. No doubt accusing all men of being bastards.

Women need to learn some very important lessons and educate themselves on how to expand past their myopic vision.

Reply 13

cpj1987
From personal experience, this is the kind of thing I'd say if I was trying to hint at the guy to make a move, cuz I'd be too shy to myself.
Then again, I've also said this to a good friend when he was feeling upset about being single.
Maybe the girls want you to make the move though?


I am not attracted to her, but I asked her anyway "Do you see me in that way?", she was like "no"

She has even gone to all my male mates when I am on a night out, "Oh isn't x such a good looking guy?", my good mate has even asked her when she has kept on saying this "So why don't you kiss him if he is so good-looking?". She was like "Oh, but I just see him as a mate" - seriously if that is not confusing I don't know what is.

If she wasn't serious, then I percieve it as pity- I don't need that. As pity is based on falseness, and just makes me feel worse.

I know there is an element of truth in the attractiveness part becuase a lot of people have complimented me - most notably with the word 'handsome'. My male mates keep telling me that I just lack confidence and need to grab a pair of bulls. Thus the current personality change. To give you an idea of how shy I am, I have been asked by a girl to kiss her (this has not happened to any of my mates, I got her to kiss my cheek cos I didn't felt right to take advantage of her drunk)

Reply 14

Anonymous #1 - You need to discover a balance. You need to be arrogant enough to hurt people to get what you want/need but also remain the nice guy and stay true to yourself.

I agree with what cpj1987 said though, it seems as if she liked you but was too shy to perhaps admit to it. Or, she was just mental and obviously just slightly foolish for not realising how saying such a thing could affect you.

One thing I have learned from all this though Anon #1, is that you need to be more foreward and confident with what you want. Don't ever rely on girls coming to you, because despite what they say - they never will, even in this day and age. Girls seem to want a man who goes out and gets things for himself.

This is a lesson I wish I learned when I was 17 because I would've been much happier for it.

I'll leave you with this point for the time being: Although all women are mental, not all of them are blind. For most though, it takes some harsh lessons before they realise where to really look.

Reply 15

Nix!
Case in point then, you are blind. You don't know what you want. Stop trying to defend something which is beyond respute.

You [females] say you want 'nice guys' but you go off with the arrogant lads who treat you like dirt. Authentic 'nice guys' who grow up, take on board that girls want 'nice guys' and develop accordingly. They are then shunned, lonely, hurt and finally confused because they've been neglected for the polar representation of what women claim they want. Women then use said 'nice guys' for recovering from their self-infliction. No doubt accusing all men of being bastards.

Women need to learn some very important lessons and educate themselves on how to expand past their myopic vision.


How am I blind? I am far from it. I wouldn't cast myself under the generalisations and aspersions which you throw about casually. I wouldn't deem either sex as one thing nor another, in terms of their tendencies towards relationships.

The best stance to take is a subjective one; each and everyone's experiences are different. Mine mould the sort of person I am; thus, the sort of people I go for. Some younger girls with less experience of bad relationships can be drawn to arrogance; they correspond it to confidence. Similarly, I've known a lot of blokes who go for women who treat them like rubbish.

Reply 16

cpj1987
From personal experience, this is the kind of thing I'd say if I was trying to hint at the guy to make a move, cuz I'd be too shy to myself.
Well then you need a new strategy because guys, or most of us, see this as a bad sign.

Reply 17

Anonymous

I know there is an element of truth in the attractiveness part becuase a lot of people have complimented me - most notably with the word 'handsome'. My male mates keep telling me that I just lack confidence and need to grab a pair of bulls. Thus the current personality change. To give you an idea of how shy I am, I have been asked by a girl to kiss her (this has not happened to any of my mates, I got her to kiss my cheek cos I didn't felt right to take advantage of her drunk)


It sounds like you need to become more confident as a person. With any luck this should develop in time. Be confident that you know you're a good person, hold your head high and seriously, don't be afraid of jumping at opportunities when they arise. You can't always tip-toe around never hurting people, sometimes it's just part and parcel of life.

Don't get me wrong, I understand completely where you're coming from but just take it from someone who's 'wiser' on the subject :smile:

Either risk hurting someone, or simply offending them (something they'll soon forget anyway) or you're going to end up as the one suffering.

Reply 18

Nix!
Anonymous #1 - You need to discover a balance. You need to be arrogant enough to hurt people to get what you want/need but also remain the nice guy and stay true to yourself.

I agree with what cpj1987 said though, it seems as if she liked you but was too shy to perhaps admit to it. Or, she was just mental and obviously just slightly foolish for not realising how saying such a thing could affect you.

One thing I have learned from all this though Anon #1, is that you need to be more foreward and confident with what you want. Don't ever rely on girls coming to you, because despite what they say - they never will, even in this day and age. Girls seem to want a man who goes out and gets things for himself.

This is a lesson I wish I learned when I was 17 because I would've been much happier for it.

I'll leave you with this point for the time being: Although all women are mental, not all of them are blind. For most though, it takes some harsh lessons before they realise where to really look.


Thanks for your reply mate.

Yeah, I by no means expect girls to come to me, even though it has happened...and still somehow I manage to put them off.

Like every guy I have also asked girls out and been rejected. The balance is what I am trying to find. I have recently reading a couple of books "the game" as well as reading advice of this board and asking loads of guys for advice. In addition, from simple observation of a lot of guys in relationship I have hardly ever seen a genuine nice dude in one, a lot of them have the attitude that I discribe. Care free, I care about myself attitude, egotistical.....Seems as though girls are attracted to guys like that as they are very sure of themselves. Personally, from having loads of female mates, a lot of them do come across as somewhat insecure, so go for these type of guys as they seem secure. Whereas, a nice guy is just a dude that is just timid and easy to get (no challenge) I dunno!

My good friend, who is now in a relationship told me, "ohh yeah, x was so attracted to me because she thought that I was a player and so it was a challenge to get me."

My personality is just changing because as one person described earlier, I just dislike being treated like an emotional doormat.

Reply 19

Visiting_Babylon
How am I blind? I am far from it. I wouldn't cast myself under the generalisations and aspersions which you throw about casually. I wouldn't deem either sex as one thing nor another, in terms of their tendencies towards relationships.


Was my point seriously that easily lost on you?

Your defence is that 'you' (not sure if your point was a subjective one) had to learn to appreciate 'nice guys', and this was a lesson concluded once you'd been hurt by the antipodal, correct?

This to me suggests that before such lesson, you were 'blind' or at least myopic to who really were the genial males.

You may know how to 'appreciate' the 'nice guys' now, but it's too little too late for most as like Anonymous #1 - they've already suffered.