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Social Class of London Students

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Reply 20
Browneyedboi
May i ask what course your doing? Plenty of students from the arts to the sciences take on jobs and a 101 things and are still succesful, unless your doing medicine I think it is possible to work. I think students SHOULD work, if they have the opportunity to do so.

Language and Culture is the course. The profs seemed to say there wasn't time for jobs, one said you should be doing 50 hours study a week, i don't know if that's realistic but i certainly don't think i could fit in a job if i had to spend that long doing uni work.
Reply 21
I've not seen out and out snobbery at all in London universities, although I once was abused and nearly attacked by a drunken idiot on a London night bus for having a Northern accent (apparently he said that Northerners were all inferior to Londoners and thus should all ******* off home!).

However, I think the real point is whether working class students are still able to study at London universities, or whether financial reality or Government policy has forced them out. I would say that the top 20 unis have always been middle-class bastions due to their reputation and the high A-Level scores required, and this ultimately causes problems for people from working class backgrounds getting into areas such as finance, IB, Magic Circle Law etc.
Reply 22
coolershaka
However, I think the real point is whether working class students are still able to study at London universities, or whether financial reality or Government policy has forced them out. I would say that the top 20 unis have always been middle-class bastions due to their reputation and the high A-Level scores required, and this ultimately causes problems for people from working class backgrounds getting into areas such as finance, IB, Magic Circle Law etc.

I'd agree with that. But really, the amount of money "working class" people can get is ridiculous, there's so much from grants and burseries and ucl has some policy where they match 50p to every pound of government grant you're getting, i don't see how people who are eligible for these grants/burseries can't survive at uni, it's the "middle-class" people who aren't eligible for any grants etc who will probably struggle. I hate the government's presumption that if you have an income of over 37k (or whatever it is), you don't need any financial support at uni and "daddy" will pay for it all.
Sorry that turned into a bit of a rant!
Reply 23
AdamTJ
What is wrong with THOSE sorts of people.

People get so het up about being pre-judged on this issue, that they deny themselves the opportunity of going to some great universities.

You will meet "rahs" wherever you go in the country. London is no exception.

I have not met a single one at Southampton. Mostly because they stand out a mile so I can avoid them.

One I did kind of meet (I knew who she was and saw her on the bus) phoned for a taxi at 4pm in the afternoon (so daylight) to take her the 15 minute walk to the train station when she was going home for the weekend (So no huge bags to carry). WTF is up with that?
Reply 24
Haha i just can't believe you're talking about "raas" like they're another species! Or the fact that you say, "one i kind of did meet", and "those people". I'd agree with Adamtj and i'd have to say that this attitude doesn't come from the "raas", it comes from people like you who make the presumption that "raas" don't want to socialise with "normal" people and think they're superior, which is not the case at all!
Reply 25
emstar
I'd agree with that. But really, the amount of money "working class" people can get is ridiculous, there's so much from grants and burseries and ucl has some policy where they match 50p to every pound of government grant you're getting, i don't see how people who are eligible for these grants/burseries can't survive at uni, it's the "middle-class" people who aren't eligible for any grants etc who will probably struggle. I hate the government's presumption that if you have an income of over 37k (or whatever it is), you don't need any financial support at uni and "daddy" will pay for it all.
Sorry that turned into a bit of a rant!


I do agree that working class students can get a great deal of help such as bursuries, remission from tuition fees, full loans etc. If I hadn't had these benefits myself then I almost certainly could not have gone to uni.

However, i do agree with some level of means testing of fees loans etc. There are many older working class people who feel that funding uni just for someone with a degree to come in and become higher up in the company than them without experience is just wrong. Also, many people from poorer backgrounds feel upset with funding students with taxes so that new 25 year old yuppie graduates could come in and force them out of the area due to house prices.
Reply 26
Talya
I have not met a single one at Southampton. Mostly because they stand out a mile so I can avoid them.

One I did kind of meet (I knew who she was and saw her on the bus) phoned for a taxi at 4pm in the afternoon (so daylight) to take her the 15 minute walk to the train station when she was going home for the weekend (So no huge bags to carry). WTF is up with that?


I'm sorry, you're as bad as the very people you claim to despise. You're prejudiced towards them before you've even spoken they've even you.

Believe me, I wish people pronounced the h's at the beginning of words and didn't feel the need to get roaringly drunk on snakebites and then conduct themselves in a yobbish and/or violent manner.

These things are the same as her getting the taxi. It is a cultural thing. Her doing that is hurting no one or nothing, apart from her bank account. In fact, the yobbishness is actually worse, because it does cause problems with other people.

If you are born that way, and imbued with that culture/way of life, you know no better. It is very easy to be friends with "rahs" if you make the effort and get to know them properly. I say the same thing about working class folk. If you look past the accent etc...there are some very nice people amongst the working class.

Really it is quite pathetic to be prejudiced against someone merely because of what circumstances they were born into.
Reply 27
AdamTJ

If you are born that way, and imbued with that culture/way of life, you know no better. It is very easy to be friends with "rahs" if you make the effort and get to know them properly. I say the same thing about working class folk. If you look past the accent etc...there are some very nice people amongst the working class.

Really it is quite pathetic to be prejudiced against someone merely because of what circumstances they were born into.

Oh please. The way I was bought up I could very easily have become a 'rah', but I CHOSE not to.
Talya
I have not met a single one at Southampton. Mostly because they stand out a mile so I can avoid them.

One I did kind of meet (I knew who she was and saw her on the bus) phoned for a taxi at 4pm in the afternoon (so daylight) to take her the 15 minute walk to the train station when she was going home for the weekend (So no huge bags to carry). WTF is up with that?


You have a stinky attitude :s-smilie:

People are different, so what. I doubt everyone in Southampton is a certain way. People in London definitely are not, there is so much diversity here. The fact that you avoid people based on what they look like or what you heard from eavesdropping on their phone conversations is very sad and in my view worse than carrying a Louis Vuitton bag to uni but being a nice and open-minded person.
Reply 29
Talya
Oh please. The way I was bought up I could very easily have become a 'rah', but I CHOSE not to.


What exactly does that mean? You deliberately shun your roots and pretend that you're poor. Isn't that a bit condescending to people who are actually in that position?
Reply 30
AdamTJ
What exactly does that mean? You deliberately shun your roots and pretend that you're poor. Isn't that a bit condescending to people who are actually in that position?

I do not pretend I'm poor or rich. I do not flaunt what I have, why would any normal person do that?
Reply 31
Talya
I do not pretend I'm poor or rich. I do not flaunt what I have, why would any normal person do that?


Haha- I have no idea, this seems like a bit of a pointless argument. I agree you shouldn't flaunt your wealth with expensive or ostentatious gestures.

I don't think grabbing a taxi is an ostentatious gesture though. It's just a lazy gesture.

All I'm saying is that you should act au naturale. You say you could be a "rah" if you wanted to, which suggests that you have shared background with people of this ilk. There is nothing wrong with taking advantage of one's wealth, provided it is done tastefully and isn't vulgar. Also, one shouldn't rub it in other people's faces.

Yet you seem to suggest you consciously shun this lifestyle. Which, seems phony, not to say self-deprecating.
emstar
Language and Culture is the course. The profs seemed to say there wasn't time for jobs, one said you should be doing 50 hours study a week, i don't know if that's realistic but i certainly don't think i could fit in a job if i had to spend that long doing uni work.


Bit extreme and means you need to do 6hrs plus per day ontop of tutor time, its better to work less hours and work effectively and do loads of other things, i work 2 jobs to support myself. Its not hard, there are people who do tonnes of time consuming things and get 2:1s/1sts. Entirely possible if your good.
Reply 33
Cambridge has a policy where it is forbidden to work during term time. At least the terms are only 8 weeks long though, and everyone who can flouts the rule.

Besides unis that place rules like thay deny students of the chance of valuable work experience as well as income, and students are more than capable of deciding their time for themselves.
Reply 34
coolershaka
I would suspect that it is more marked in the prestigious London colleges where 40% are from private schools etc. The student magazines of London and Oxford are the only magazines I have ever seen with a fashion section.

Also, I get the impression that London students don't party as hard as those in provincial unis.


Can you come up with a Marxist theory for this?
But at cambridge, wouldn't you think due to the workload would it even be possible to work pt, would there be any point?
No way, at least at Oxford I had friends who easily did a few hours a week in the college wine shop or JCR without sacrificing the quality of their academics. Oxbridge don't limit the number of hours you can spend rowing, so I don't think there's a good reason to prohibit work.

LSE technically bans students from working more than 15 hours per week during term time, although again, I have no idea how they'd enforce it. That makes more sense than just an outright "no work" rule.
Yeah every uni recommends 15hrs max, it is true you should aim for this, whilst you won't study all the time (apart from typical geeks) you have to socialize, etc. Will you have time just studying and working? doubt it... unless your time management skills are a bit rigid.
Wide mix, really. I'm lower-middle class, as (probably) are most of the people I know. But I know upper-middle class kids, I know working class kids. Don't know any aristocrats, but who knows, there might be a few around.
Talya
Oh please. The way I was bought up I could very easily have become a 'rah', but I CHOSE not to.


Your attitude stinks of rah all over.

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