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A difficult decision ( Medicine) Really need help watch

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    Hi guys, new to TSR, but nonetheless been following it for a while.

    Need some advice desparately from anyone who can help me ( medics, graduate medics would probably know most about this ) but anyone who can shed some light would be highly appreciated.

    2014 : Offer for Medicine ( missed by narrow margin)
    2015 : No offers ( low UKCAT ( but above national average)
    2016 : Take up my place to do Biomed OR apply again for undergraduate ( mainly because I know that I did get into Medicine and thus not applying stupidly without any introspection)
    Current UKCAT 677.5 SJT Band 1

    I am limited to the following schools due to my grades : SGUL, QMUL, Plymouth , Exeter , BSMS, Imperial ( both BMAT) , Newcastle , Durham , Keele, Lancaster.

    Obviously my UKCAT isn't amazing and I did BMAT in 2014 ( didn't do great) but I can take it this year as I have time to prepare.

    ANY advice would honestly be really appreciated. Please help me out and I thank anyone who posts in advance
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    What did you do since your 2014 rejections? Presumably you took a gap year from the summer of 2014 to now but what did you get up to?
    Have you received feedback about why your application was rejected; namely in 2015? Did you get to the interview stage for 2015 at the 4 unis or?
    You have a deferred place for Biomed presumably for 2016 if you already have the offer?
    And have you got AAB with extenuating circumstances (is that why your options are limited)?

    That should help everybody a bit with some details
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    (Original post by Lionheartat20)
    What did you do since your 2014 rejections? Presumably you took a gap year from the summer of 2014 to now but what did you get up to?
    Have you received feedback about why your application was rejected; namely in 2015? Did you get to the interview stage for 2015 at the 4 unis or?
    You have a deferred place for Biomed presumably for 2016 if you already have the offer?
    And have you got AAB with extenuating circumstances (is that why your options are limited)?

    That should help everybody a bit with some details
    So yes you are correct, took a gap year from Summer of 2014- got some hospital experience and additional voluntary work and then I resat my Chemistry A level and got that up to an A. So I obviously needed time to study for that.

    Yes i received feedback, two of the unis it was the UKCAT and Liverpool said PS was good but not obvs not good enough compared to other applicants. I got 0 interviews.

    I have a place for Biomed this year. It starts in a week hence the need for help.

    I have A* maths, A Biology , A ( language) , A ( Chemistry ) ( initially a B - no extenuating circumstances) THAT'S why my options are limited.

    Hope this helps everyone and thank you

    Oh and the Medical school I received my offer from in 2014 wouldn't even consider me for an application this year
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    Can anyone else help lol?
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    (Original post by donotstopme95)
    Can anyone else help lol?
    Personally I wouldnt waste 3 years of my life doing a degree I dont want to do for a slim chance to do medicine which is even harder to get into than under graduate and have the debt of the first degree, while losing the option to get a student loan if you do in fact get into medicine after you graduate. It is a difficult situation as you have shown you are competent enough, I think you should apply once more and if it doesnt go your way take a hard look if medicine is the right career for you. And if you are working then its not like this year will be wasted as you can save money for whatever you want to do in the future. Good luck with your choice.
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    (Original post by Rishy)
    Personally I wouldnt waste 3 years of my life doing a degree I dont want to do for a slim chance to do medicine which is even harder to get into than under graduate and have the debt of the first degree, while losing the option to get a student loan if you do in fact get into medicine after you graduate. It is a difficult situation as you have shown you are competent enough, I think you should apply once more and if it doesnt go your way take a hard look if medicine is the right career for you. And if you are working then its not like this year will be wasted as you can save money for whatever you want to do in the future. Good luck with your choice.

    Thank you for your reply. I think I would plan on applying for undergraduate programmes as a graduate , which of course I know I would have to finance myself. So if I have the money then it's worth taking this option so I don't waste any time in effect?
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    (Original post by donotstopme95)
    Thank you for your reply. I think I would plan on applying for undergraduate programmes as a graduate , which of course I know I would have to finance myself. So if I have the money then it's worth taking this option so I don't waste any time in effect?
    Whilst the graduate entry programme is harder, you also get another 3 years to improve upon yourself. You already have some experience, you can get more. You have already took the UKCAT once, and so now you will know that it's your weak spot and can work on improving that. My question is which university did you pick to do biomedical science? Some universities give incentives to people wanting to do medicine. Newcastle offers for a few of the best people in biomed to transfer to medicine after the first year. Warwick says it guarantees an interview to the top 20 in their class for Graduate entry medicine. It's something to think about, as if your university offers something like this it will mean that you going into graduate entry medicine will be easier.
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    (Original post by CantonHero)
    Whilst the graduate entry programme is harder, you also get another 3 years to improve upon yourself. You already have some experience, you can get more. You have already took the UKCAT once, and so now you will know that it's your weak spot and can work on improving that. My question is which university did you pick to do biomedical science? Some universities give incentives to people wanting to do medicine. Newcastle offers for a few of the best people in biomed to transfer to medicine after the first year. Warwick says it guarantees an interview to the top 20 in their class for Graduate entry medicine. It's something to think about, as if your university offers something like this it will mean that you going into graduate entry medicine will be easier.
    Thanks for your reply, no the university I'm going to doesn't offer that. A good point you raised and I shall consider that.
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    Apply this year again, no point doing Biomed (if you're gonna spend 3 years from now, may as well spend this year improving your application. Seems like your most important thing is your BMAT, get that good and you should be fine.
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    (Original post by Depleted)
    Apply this year again, no point doing Biomed (if you're gonna spend 3 years from now, may as well spend this year improving your application. Seems like your most important thing is your BMAT, get that good and you should be fine.
    But then if I don't get in this year, I'll still have to take Biomed next year because of my experience, qualifications etc..?
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    (Original post by donotstopme95)
    But then if I don't get in this year, I'll still have to take Biomed next year because of my experience, qualifications etc..?
    I suggest holding onto the 2016 offer for Biomedical Sciences whilst reapplying strategically (links below). If you get an offer from a medical school, just ask your university to release you and go there. If not, well, then you have the option of doing Biomedical Sciences and going through graduate entry or trying again (although I don't know if you'd be up for that).

    Here's the thing - funding for graduate entry is somewhat shaky and may be scrapped in the next few years so you might find yourself in the third year of your Biomedical Sciences degree realising that you can't actually afford graduate entry medicine. So you really should think of graduate entry as a last resort; the time, money and competition just aren't worth it unless every other option has been exhausted.

    I also think it's somewhat naive to think that you can pay upfront for a medical degree, even if you do spend the intervening years working full-time. Most graduate entry courses are four years long (some are five years long e.g. Imperial), so that's £36 000 in tuition fees at the current rate. George Osborne has announced in his budget that tuition fees are set to rise with inflation from 2017 onward so unless inflation is near-zero, the tuition will likely be more than £36 000.

    Assuming that you are made an offer by a university that isn't local to you, you'll probably need to add to that figure the costs of rent, bills, food and other expenses over the four years. I don't want to scare you but the number is likely to be higher than £50 000, even on a tight budget. The NHS might fund the last year of your degree (the usual rule is that the NHS pays your tuition from fifth year onward but you wouldn't be doing a fifth year) but I'm not sure about that.

    Here are some links on the resit policies of various medical schools and how to apply strategically (I understand you're limited in choice but even among those universities you can be a little bit more strategic):

    http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/wiki...your_Strengths
    http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/wiki...Resit_Policies

    Good luck.
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    (Original post by Hydeman)
    I suggest holding onto the 2016 offer for Biomedical Sciences whilst reapplying strategically (links below). If you get an offer from a medical school, just ask your university to release you and go there. If not, well, then you have the option of doing Biomedical Sciences and going through graduate entry or trying again (although I don't know if you'd be up for that).

    Here's the thing - funding for graduate entry is somewhat shaky and may be scrapped in the next few years so you might find yourself in the third year of your Biomedical Sciences degree realising that you can't actually afford graduate entry medicine. So you really should think of graduate entry as a last resort; the time, money and competition just aren't worth it unless every other option has been exhausted.

    I also think it's somewhat naive to think that you can pay upfront for a medical degree, even if you do spend the intervening years working full-time. Most graduate entry courses are four years long (some are five years long e.g. Imperial), so that's £36 000 in tuition fees at the current rate. George Osborne has announced in his budget that tuition fees are set to rise with inflation from 2017 onward so unless inflation is near-zero, the tuition will likely be more than £36 000.

    Assuming that you are made an offer by a university that isn't local to you, you'll probably need to add to that figure the costs of rent, bills, food and other expenses over the four years. I don't want to scare you but the number is likely to be higher than £50 000, even on a tight budget. The NHS might fund the last year of your degree (the usual rule is that the NHS pays your tuition from fifth year onward but you wouldn't be doing a fifth year) but I'm not sure about that.

    Here are some links on the resit policies of various medical schools and how to apply strategically (I understand you're limited in choice but even among those universities you can be a little bit more strategic):

    http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/wiki...your_Strengths
    http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/wiki...Resit_Policies

    Good luck.
    Hi , you helped me a lot. Thanks ! You said I won't be doing a fifth year. Why can't I apply for undergrad med as a graduate - you mean because the fees will be too high?
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    (Original post by donotstopme95)
    Hi , you helped me a lot. Thanks ! You said I won't be doing a fifth year. Why can't I apply for undergrad med as a graduate - you mean because the fees will be too high?
    Oh, right, I forgot about that! You can apply to the regular courses as well, sure, but that just means even higher fees because that adds a year onto the course - so it's £36 000 for four years at the current level of tuition fees but £45 000 for five years. I just think that those kinds of figures are outside most people's budgets. Universities might have different policies on that though. I recommend contacting the ones you're interested in directly.

    Also, I'm sorry to be pedantic but medicine courses are always undergraduate. :lol: People wrongly go around calling it 'postgrad medicine'; it's not.
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    (Original post by Hydeman)
    Oh, right, I forgot about that! You can apply to the regular courses as well, sure, but that just means even higher fees because that adds a year onto the course - so it's £36 000 for four years at the current level of tuition fees but £45 000 for five years. I just think that those kinds of figures are outside most people's budgets. Universities might have different policies on that though. I recommend contacting the ones you're interested in directly.

    Also, I'm sorry to be pedantic but medicine courses are always undergraduate. :lol: People wrongly go around calling it 'postgrad medicine'; it's not.
    There are plenty of medicine courses for post-graduates or "graduates". Not all medicine courses are undergraduate. BM4 courses are specifically designed for graduates, hence are only 4 years instead of 5. It's not completely the same syllabus because they cut a whole year out

    Back to the OP, it makes a huge difference as to whether you study as a graduate or undergraduate if you were to apply with a Biomedical degree - depending on whether you have to self-finance the tuition fees / Student Loans Company won't lend. I'm not going to definitively say either way here in case I muddle it up but a quick search will tell you how financing for your 2nd degree works depending if you were to apply for BM4 or BM5

    Back to the above quoted person, the 5th year is paid for by the NHS so you only pay £36,000 tuition fees. And receive a bursary as well.
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    (Original post by Hydeman)
    Oh, right, I forgot about that! You can apply to the regular courses as well, sure, but that just means even higher fees because that adds a year onto the course - so it's £36 000 for four years at the current level of tuition fees but £45 000 for five years. I just think that those kinds of figures are outside most people's budgets. Universities might have different policies on that though. I recommend contacting the ones you're interested in directly.

    Also, I'm sorry to be pedantic but medicine courses are always undergraduate. :lol: People wrongly go around calling it 'postgrad medicine'; it's not.
    Okay you raised a good point about contacting them directly.

    In addition, I didn't actually mention " postgrad medicine " anywhere on my post?
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    (Original post by Lionheartat20)
    There are plenty of medicine courses for post-graduates or "graduates". Not all medicine courses are undergraduate. BM4 courses are specifically designed for graduates, hence are only 4 years instead of 5. It's not completely the same syllabus because they cut a whole year out

    Back to the OP, it makes a huge difference as to whether you study as a graduate or undergraduate if you were to apply with a Biomedical degree - depending on whether you have to self-finance the tuition fees / Student Loans Company won't lend. I'm not going to definitively say either way here in case I muddle it up but a quick search will tell you how financing for your 2nd degree works depending if you were to apply for BM4 or BM5

    Back to the above quoted person, the 5th year is paid for by the NHS so you only pay £36,000 tuition fees. And receive a bursary as well.
    Yes, them cutting a whole year out sounds rosy but I imaging the graduate programme is quite intense.

    Yes they did mention the 5th year in one of their posts so that's cleared. What do you mean by bursary, could you expand?
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    (Original post by donotstopme95)
    Yes, them cutting a whole year out sounds rosy but I imaging the graduate programme is quite intense.

    Yes they did mention the 5th year in one of their posts so that's cleared. What do you mean by bursary, could you expand?
    The NHS just pays for your 5th year of tuition fees, so you don't pay them.
    http://www.money4medstudents.org/nhs-bursaries
    They also provide some help towards living costs for your 5th year.

    The far bigger point I am making is:
    You can borrow £27,000 for a Biomedical science course. You can then borrow £36,000 for the BM4 course. But if you do the BM5 course after the Biomedical course , you have to pay £45,000 from your bank account (or your parents, I don't think you can have the NHS bursary in this scenario; see the above link). I can't remember if I have that the right way round, but that's the gist of it. It's a huge difference in financial commitment.
    That may not be right BUT it's a very important point and you need to research via Google/TSR that I have said it right as I am not certain but it certainly needs looking into.
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    (Original post by donotstopme95)
    Okay you raised a good point about contacting them directly.

    In addition, I didn't actually mention " postgrad medicine " anywhere on my post?
    You didn't. I just said that some people do. xD Because you referred to the five-year course as undergraduate in the sense that it's distinct from graduate entry, so I felt I should point it out, in the spirit of pedantry.
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    (Original post by Lionheartat20)
    There are plenty of medicine courses for post-graduates or "graduates". Not all medicine courses are undergraduate. BM4 courses are specifically designed for graduates, hence are only 4 years instead of 5. It's not completely the same syllabus because they cut a whole year out
    I know that. I meant the kind of medicine courses OP is talking about. Your primary medical qualification will always be received at the end of an undergraduate course, not a postgraduate one. Postgraduate medicine is what some qualified doctors do. So while it is for graduates, it's not a postgraduate degree. It's not much different from doing a Law degree and then switching and doing an Engineering degree. They're both undergraduate, regardless of the fact that you already hold another degree.
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    (Original post by Hydeman)
    I know that. I meant the kind of medicine courses OP is talking about. Your primary medical qualification will always be received at the end of an undergraduate course, not a postgraduate one. Postgraduate medicine is what some qualified doctors do. So while it is for graduates, it's not a postgraduate degree. It's not much different from doing a Law degree and then switching and doing an Engineering degree. They're both undergraduate, regardless of the fact that you already hold another degree.
    But the person that did the law degree, and is now doing an engineering degree, is on an undergraduate course.
    The person who did a biomedical degree, and is now doing a medicine degree, is on a graduate only course.
    I don't know, I think it's very pedantic as you admit
    More importantly, I agree with you that the OP should reapply for undergraduate medicine


    As for the OP, this is the useful link with regards to student finance. Read carefully as the decision will cost you tens of thousands of pounds difference in the short term.
    http://www.nhscareers.nhs.uk/explore...s-in-medicine/
 
 
 
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