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Had a few to drink but this is a serious disussion, have the tories won? watch

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    I don't fully understand the system and I am not sobour (nor drunk) I know the Tories have gained more seats than Labour so does this mean the tories have won the local election?

    How much of an indicator was this election for the real general election results next year?
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    A week is a long time in politics, so who knows how people will feel about the Labour party if they hold a general election next year or who will even be leading them into the general election.
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    They have to hold a general election don't they? Otherwise people will be pissed off and never vote for them again. I do think Blair should resign and hopefully these results will end the arrogance of the labour party at the moment.
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    (Original post by amazingtrade)
    They have to hold a general election don't they? Otherwise people will be pissed off and never vote for them again. I do think Blair should resign and hopefully these results will end the arrogance of the labour party at the moment.
    yeh it has to be doe within a 5 year period of the last one, but labour get to choose when.

    lou xxx
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    Labour still believe they're safe to win the third term next year. I'm not so sure. Either they call a general election soon or they wait for public opinion to turn in their favour again and go ahead in mid-2005 as planned.
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    (Original post by amazingtrade)
    They have to hold a general election don't they? Otherwise people will be pissed off and never vote for them again.
    Erm... more to do with law than anything else.
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    You don't "win the local election". They're called local for a reason - there isn't a single election to win or lose, there are elections locally. The fact the Tories have gained more seats than Labour means, basically, that in the local councils, the Tories have gained more seats than Labour. So the Tories, right, now have more seats in local councils than Labour, meaning Labour has fewer local council seats than the Tories. Comprende?
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    (Original post by ThePants999)
    You don't "win the local election". They're called local for a reason - there isn't a single election to win or lose, there are elections locally. The fact the Tories have gained more seats than Labour means, basically, that in the local councils, the Tories have gained more seats than Labour. So the Tories, right, now have more seats in local councils than Labour, meaning Labour has fewer local council seats than the Tories. Comprende?
    Yeah but if this was a general election would the tories have won? thats what I was asking, I just worded it badly.
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    (Original post by amazingtrade)
    Yeah but if this was a general election would the tories have won? thats what I was asking, I just worded it badly.
    Probably. Assuming this was a general election the LibDems would also form the Opposition. But in a general election turnout is usually better, campaigning more vigourous, and the government's earlier expansionary economic policy would have kicked in.
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    (Original post by ZJuwelH)
    Probably. Assuming this was a general election the LibDems would also form the Opposition. But in a general election turnout is usually better, campaining more vigourous, and the government's earlier expansionary economic policy would have kicked in.
    and remember council elections are different areas- for examply my council area is sefton, we end up with no party having a majority in local elections- that's because we have bootle a typical labour area and southport a typicl tory are, but those in the same council and you'll get a fairly even spread.

    but actually we have crap tories round here at the mo and the southport seat has been lib dem the last 2 elections (altho not the same person)

    lou xxx
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    (Original post by ThePants999)
    If it was a general election, people would have voted differently, as it moves from local to general issues.
    So do you think it would still be near impossible for the tories to win next year? I guess labour have a year to do more spin doctoring. I am not sure who I want to win anyway, labour annoy with their attitude but some of the tories policies I don't agree with, however labour dosn't seem much different these days. Lib dem are too weak to probably be taken seriously no matter how much they are improving.
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    (Original post by lou p lou)
    and remember council elections are different areas- for examply my council area is sefton, we end up with no party having a majority in local elections- that's because we have bootle a typical labour area and southport a typicl tory are, but those in the same council and you'll get a fairly even spread.

    but actually we have crap tories round here at the mo and the southport seat has been lib dem the last 2 elections (altho not the same person)

    lou xxx
    I haven't the foggiest who my councillor is anyway so I daren't vote in council elections

    I'd keep Labour in at present, they're sound for macroeconomic performance, and while our economy is in good times so are we. If Labour slipped up economically they'd lose probably their biggest asset.
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    In Manchester it will always be labour due to the fact that 31/34 wards are innercity. Its the boroughs surounding that are posher and have much more torie supporters. I live in one of the 3 none innercity areas and thats still got a labour strong hold despite them being a lot of tories here.

    It dosn't surprise me that Trafford is torie now becuase its a posh borough in general, Stockport is extremely mixed having some of the top ten richest areas in the county (Cheadle) , as well as some of the bottom ones.

    I am probably slightly more torie because of my upbringing, I was bought up in a very convserative environment (nearly every member of my family owns a business of some sort even if its just a shop)
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    (Original post by amazingtrade)
    In Manchester it will always be labour due to the fact that 31/34 wards are innercity. Its the boroughs surounding that are posher and have much more torie supporters. I live in one of the 3 none innercity areas and thats still got a labour strong hold despite them being a lot of tories here.

    It dosn't surprise me that Trafford is torie now becuase its a posh borough in general, Stockport is extremely mixed having some of the top ten richest areas in the county (Cheadle) , as well as some of the bottom ones.

    I am probably slightly more torie because of my upbringing, I was bought up in a very convserative environment (nearly every member of my family owns a business of some sort even if its just a shop)
    Shouldn't make too much of a difference now that Labour is now Thatcherite, with the odd leftie here and there to maintain the left-wing vote.
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    (Original post by ZJuwelH)
    Shouldn't make too much of a difference now that Labour is now Thatcherite, with the odd leftie here and there to maintain the left-wing vote.
    Yeah but I guess the working class can never really forget the poll tax (though this effected the middle class probably more) and they seem to blame thacteritism on them being poor during that time, they forget the amount of new businesses it created and all the strikes of the late 70's ended.

    I guess I am pro business but I am against fat catism and people making furtunes from shares.
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    (Original post by amazingtrade)
    I guess I am pro business but I am against fat catism and people making furtunes from shares.
    What's wrong with playing the stock market? It's just an alternate form of gambling.
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    (Original post by G4ry)
    What's wrong with playing the stock market? It's just an alternate form of gambling.
    Yes but companies end up being run for profit for the share holders and not for a business, the railway problems a classic example of this.

    I am guess I am saying I am against privatisation. I have no problems wiht people buying shares in a small LTD company or what ever, its jsut when companies see the share holders as more important that long term gains it gets stupid.
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    I don't think you quite understand shares and asset pricing. For one thing, shareholder interests and long-term thinking are not mutually exclusive.

    But anyway, companies exist for their shareholders - the shareholders completely own the company and the managers run the company only by the grace of, and on behalf of, the shareholders. The only difference between a small LTD and a big PLC is scale.

    Imagine your bank told you that it was halving the rate of interest paid on your account because it needed to spend your money to make other people happy. How would you feel about that? And if you wouldn't be happy with that, why do you object to shareholders' investments bringing returns to the shareholders?
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    I heard that Labour lost pretty badly in local elections across the UK but I don't care because London still belongs to Labour! Ken Livingstone deserves a second term.
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    Does it really make a difference though?
 
 
 
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