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ResidentEvil
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#1
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Check my attached image file, what would u label A as specifically?

Also, ya know in Respiration, when hydrogen is removed from various compounds and then carried by NAD as reduced NAD, is the hydrogen removed as H+ ion in respiration?

Because I know that the hydrogen then splits into H+ ion and electrons at the oxidative phosphorylation stage, but im not sure if the hydrogens are initially removed (from glycolsis/krebs cycle) as hydrogen H+ ion.
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jag_jatt
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(Original post by ResidentEvil)
Check my attached image file, what would u label A as specifically?

Also, ya know in Respiration, when hydrogen is removed from various compounds and then carried by NAD as reduced NAD, is the hydrogen removed as H+ ion in respiration?

Because I know that the hydrogen then splits into H+ ion and electrons at the oxidative phosphorylation stage, but im not sure if the hydrogens are initially removed (from glycolsis/krebs cycle) as hydrogen H+ ion.
i would say double membrane or envelope membrane

i believe its just carried as hydrogen cuz NAD is a hydrogen carrier molecule
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alio
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(Original post by ResidentEvil)
Check my attached image file, what would u label A as specifically?

Also, ya know in Respiration, when hydrogen is removed from various compounds and then carried by NAD as reduced NAD, is the hydrogen removed as H+ ion in respiration?

Because I know that the hydrogen then splits into H+ ion and electrons at the oxidative phosphorylation stage, but im not sure if the hydrogens are initially removed (from glycolsis/krebs cycle) as hydrogen H+ ion.
is ure exam next wednesday? just askin
ive got some notes and it if u want
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crana
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I think it's just removed as H atoms, otherwise they wouldn't be able to dissociate into H+ and e- later on. Where would all the extra electrons come from!

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zazy
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(Original post by ResidentEvil)
Check my attached image file, what would u label A as specifically?

Also, ya know in Respiration, when hydrogen is removed from various compounds and then carried by NAD as reduced NAD, is the hydrogen removed as H+ ion in respiration?

Because I know that the hydrogen then splits into H+ ion and electrons at the oxidative phosphorylation stage, but im not sure if the hydrogens are initially removed (from glycolsis/krebs cycle) as hydrogen H+ ion.
Wouldn't it be know as the Thylakoid membrane where the cytochromes are and btw the carriers are NADP
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cipapfatso
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(Original post by zazy)
Wouldn't it be know as the Thylakoid membrane where the cytochromes are and btw the carriers are NADP
Thylakoids are inside the chloroplast bathed in the stroma.
That would be the envelope I would answer that as:
envelope membrane (inner and outer membranes)
But then I do it just to cover myself.
NAD carries hydrogen as H not H+

Remember NAD in respiration in animals, and NADP in respiration and photosynthesis in plants. Don't get penalised for such an easy correction

So glad i did this module in January Now to remember it all for the synoptic paper
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ResidentEvil
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cheers all. Yeah its called Membrane Envelope and i think double membrane is acceptable too.

my exam aint on wednesday - NO CHANCE! ill get like a D or something.

I am STILL uncertain about all your opinions on it being a hydrogen atom. Consider how NAD is reduced:

oxidised NAD(+) + H(+) + 2e(-) = reduced NAD
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cipapfatso
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(Original post by ResidentEvil)
cheers all. Yeah its called Membrane Envelope and i think double membrane is acceptable too.

my exam aint on wednesday - NO CHANCE! ill get like a D or something.

I am STILL uncertain about all your opinions on it being a hydrogen atom. Consider how NAD is reduced:

oxidised NAD(+) + H(+) + 2e(-) = reduced NAD
It is carried as the atom. Why else do you think that once reduced NAD (or NADP in plants) arrives at the inner membranes of the mitochondrion, hydrogen released is "split into its constituent ions" that is a phrase from the actual OCR book. It is impossible to split a hydrogen ion further so it must be carried as the uncharged atom.
Besides this is a biology exam if they wanted precise knowledge on the form of transportation and mechanisms of how it is split they would say so.
Good luck.
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ResidentEvil
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but the chemical equation from oxidised NAD to reduced NAD completely confirms the fact that it is carried as H+ ion! WHY DO U THINK NAD IS REDUCED? reduction is the GAIN of electrons. By that equation the NAD has gained electrons effectively reducing NAD.

Hydrogen is split into its consitutent ions, but could it have been combined on NAD?
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cipapfatso
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(Original post by ResidentEvil)
but the chemical equation from oxidised NAD to reduced NAD completely confirms the fact that it is carried as H+ ion! WHY DO U THINK NAD IS REDUCED? reduction is the GAIN of electrons. By that equation the NAD has gained electrons effectively reducing NAD.

Hydrogen is split into its consitutent ions, but could it have been combined on NAD?
Please think before you write. When something gains hydrogen, it gains electrons too hence reduction. It's obvious you won't believe me so go look in Biology 2 page 9 under oxidative phosphorylation.

"...here hydrogens are removed from the two hydrogen carriers and each is split into its constituent ion and electron".

Proof then that NAD and FAD carry hydrogen as H atoms and not ions.
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ResidentEvil
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#11
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hey the problem is SOLVED NOW.

Ive just looked up a thick Biology Textbook and they confirm it IS a hydrogen ion that is released.

To be really honest with ya, the Biology 2 OCR book is not that well written and revised. That's why OCR always stress u have to research "other" notes.
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