Will Facism ever come back? Watch

TheNote
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Well? do you think facism will ever come back to europe?

I think it certainly would be interesting to see the economic ideas and a modern take on their social ideas be brought into political discussion?

I certainly find their ideas behind cultural unity and taking a true middle ground view on economics to be interesting, and I often wonder if their economic policies would even work outside of a war based society.
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AngryRedhead
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(Original post by TheNote)
Well? do you think facism will ever come back to europe?

I think it certainly would be interesting to see the economic ideas and a modern take on their social ideas be brought into political discussion?

I certainly find their ideas behind cultural unity and taking a true middle ground view on economics to be interesting, and I often wonder if their economic policies would even work outside of a war based society.
We already have it; think about it; no guns allowed, no marijuana, only left wing liberal views are celebrated, all other views are ridiculed as being of 'dinosaurs' thus hindering free speech.

The UK is already a police state and it will only get worse
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Aj12
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Given that it is ultra nationalistic and Palingenetic I really struggle to see how it could emerge again. Bar some sort of earth shattering event that completely crippled Europe. Although the one thing it had going for it was the adaptability to local conditions.

(Original post by AngryRedhead)
We already have it; think about it; no guns allowed, no marijuana, only left wing liberal views are celebrated, all other views are ridiculed as being of 'dinosaurs' thus hindering free speech.

The UK is already a police state and it will only get worse
That's not fascism
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AngryRedhead
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(Original post by Aj12)
Given that it is ultra nationalistic and Palingenetic I really struggle to see how it could emerge again. Bar some sort of earth shattering event that completely crippled Europe. Although the one thing it had going for it was the adaptability to local conditions.



That's not fascism
It ain't freedom either.
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illegaltobepoor
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(Original post by TheNote)
Well? do you think facism will ever come back to europe?

I think it certainly would be interesting to see the economic ideas and a modern take on their social ideas be brought into political discussion?

I certainly find their ideas behind cultural unity and taking a true middle ground view on economics to be interesting, and I often wonder if their economic policies would even work outside of a war based society.
Fascism is coming back in Europe and its mainly National Socialism / White Nationalism.

Storm Front is the main international forum. Their views comprise of the following:

1. They want White Supremacy in White Homelands.
2. They want to deport all non-Whites even if they where born in White Homelands.
3. They want to preserve the purity of their race by either killing all disabled people or stopping them from having children.
4. They believe the Jews to be the cause of all Evil in the world. They also want them deported.
5. They are anti-Globalist.
6. Majority of White Nationalists tend to be Pagans while a minority of them say they are Christians.
7. They literally idolize Adolf Hitler as the key to their economic prosperity,
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Bupdeeboowah
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Not on the Honourable gentleman Jeremy Corbyn MP's watch.
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Aj12
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(Original post by AngryRedhead)
It ain't freedom either.
That has nothing to do with this thread.
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TheNote
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(Original post by illegaltobepoor)
Fascism is coming back in Europe and its mainly National Socialism / White Nationalism.

Storm Front is the main international forum. Their views comprise of the following:

1. They want White Supremacy in White Homelands.
2. They want to deport all non-Whites even if they where born in White Homelands.
3. They want to preserve the purity of their race by either killing all disabled people or stopping them from having children.
4. They believe the Jews to be the cause of all Evil in the world. They also want them deported.
5. They are anti-Globalist.
6. Majority of White Nationalists tend to be Pagans while a minority of them say they are Christians.
7. They literally idolize Adolf Hitler as the key to their economic prosperity,
Quite annoying the facism has been masked with the idea of extreme racism. Admitadly Hitler was the most famous facist, but I feel as if nastional socialism doesnt even mean facism anymore, but only extreme right wing nationalist views regarding race.



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illegaltobepoor
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(Original post by TheNote)
Quite annoying the facism has been masked with the idea of extreme racism. Admitadly Hitler was the most famous facist, but I feel as if nastional socialism doesnt even mean facism anymore, but only extreme right wing nationalist views regarding race.



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Go and spend some time on Stormfront and put keywords like Autism, Aspergers and Eugenics into the forum search. They talk about euthanasia and eugenics etc.

And as for National Socialism your find it mentioned constantly.
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Simes
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Let's start at the beginning. It is Fascism, not Facism. Facism is what Jim Carrey does.

'Fascist' has lost most of its meaning since the mid 1940s and is now just used as a term of abuse, but it did have a meaning. It was one of the very many theories and experiments in political development that occurred from the mid-1800s which have now mostly been forgotten.

It grew from the 'total war' experience of the Great War where an entire country is mobilised toward a common goal with no distinction between civilian or military. By applying that same focus and control that existed in that war to a country in peacetime should, so says fascist theory, enable that country to be super-efficient and overcome those around it and so provide unity

The person who is probably the best source for a definition is the man who wrote extensively about it in the American press for years and actually applied it in practice: Benito Mussolini.

Mussolini described Fascism not as a political stance but as a means to an end. It is not necessarily right wing, nor left wing, but can even be centrist.

Nationalism is an essential concept for fascism as it is all state-based philosophy. It relies on a heritage and an assumed ancestry, but this does not necessarily mean racism founded on just one race. While it could be based on the Viking tradition or the Normal tradition or the Roman tradition, it could also have been formed from, say the British Empire whereby nations of the Commonwealth unite or in China which is made of up a variety of races. It could have been an option for a newly independent India, that is, an India not divided by religion but united by their ancient traditions.

Anyway, Mussolini said it has three strands:
1. Unity - the state controls everything, everything is for the state.
2. Growth - the state must grow and conquer until everything is part of the state. Like the Borg. Or the Roman Empire.
3. No dissent. No opposition.

So it is a way of ensuring everyone pulls together and conquers all and no squabbling. Strong leadership, clear focus, no mucking about. Sound good? It sounded very attractive indeed in the 1930s.

The main problem with fascism is that it provides the leadership with absolute power and, as is always the case, absolute power corrupts absolutely. It is doomed to corruption from within and so cannot be sustained. Also, there is the problem of what to do with it once established; like the Roman empire, it needs continuous conquest to maintain its momentum.

It was often said "At least under Mussolini the trains ran on time". Those that lived through that time said "No they didn't. We just shot those who said they ran late."

(Original post by TheNote)
Well? Do you think fascism will ever come back to Europe?
Not under that name because it is just used as a term of abuse. But Dubya's War on Terror did start to smell a bit dodgy: the whole country being mobilised against 'others' and a mass invasion of a resource-filled nation.
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demx9
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(Original post by illegaltobepoor)
Fascism is coming back in Europe and its mainly National Socialism / White Nationalism.

Storm Front is the main international forum. Their views comprise of the following:

1. They want White Supremacy in White Homelands.
2. They want to deport all non-Whites even if they where born in White Homelands.
3. They want to preserve the purity of their race by either killing all disabled people or stopping them from having children.
4. They believe the Jews to be the cause of all Evil in the world. They also want them deported.
5. They are anti-Globalist.
6. Majority of White Nationalists tend to be Pagans while a minority of them say they are Christians.
7. They literally idolize Adolf Hitler as the key to their economic prosperity,
There is literally nothing wrong with NatSoc
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Rakas21
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Of course it could. Greece and France have notable national socialist movements in the top 3 parties.
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Simes
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(Original post by demx9)
There is literally nothing wrong with NatSoc
You need to explain which form of National Socialism you are referring to.

1. I don't suppose you mean the various theories calling themselves 'national socialism' prior to the rise of the gang of thugs who called themselves the National Socialist German Workers Party.
2. I don't suppose you mean a philosophy as used by the Nazi party in Germany that was based on anti-whatever-is-convenient-at-the-time but was really just a paramilitary organisation Hell bent on taking control of the country using Communists and Jews as scapegoats.
3. Neo-nazism: anti-semitism + white supremacy + all chums ganging together to shout abuse as a crowd and generally be angry with the world. Neither nationalist nor socialist. Although it could be just as easily the Nation of Yahweh or Nuwaubian Nation which are black supremacy or any other form of supremacy such as extreme Zionism.
4. Something else that's only in your head.
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demx9
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(Original post by Simes)
You need to explain which form of National Socialist you are referring to.
A system that is:

- patriotic
- social conservative
- pro-homogeneous society
- left wing economically

Also bonus points for:
- eugenics
- Pagan & anti Christian
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middy 1943
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fascism??
A word from the past!! I rather fancy the words 'national front and english defence'. Mosely was defeated. the 'Daily worker' was banned. Propaganda reigns supreme wittling away the truth of todays politics! Scameron has succeeded for the moment to follow the scam of all parties dedicated to their hypochrisy of that all parties are different. i am 72 years old and still am waiting for a party that doesnt follow the same old crap and introduce something new. WHERE is there a party for the people?. Of course it doesnt exist, has not done so since Wilson.
scameron has stolen the ideas of offending opponents by stealing their ideas and therefore deleting the opposition.
What can happen and probably will in years to come with lower police forces and NHS problems is anarchy. Reductions in welfare. Starve the people and sooner or later we will be using madame guillotine. Maybe not today or tomorrow but certainly in the future with no housing left and your children jobless and homeless. NOT Fascism. It will be called CHAOSISM!!!
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Simes
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(Original post by demx9)
A system that is:

- patriotic
- social conservative
- pro-homogeneous society
- left wing economically

Also bonus points for:
- eugenics
- Pagan & anti Christian
So it should:
- promote national differences (normally usually only useful for a pro-militaristic stance as it tends to be anti-trade);
- maintain traditions (that's nice, we're crap at that, especially in England);
- make every one look the same. Do you want enforced interbreeding or enforced racial emigration / extermination? Or have you a proposal that has not been tried and tested?
- so a flatter social structure (that conforms nicely with traditional national socialism's anti-capitalist views - it's funny where the overlaps occur in politics, innit?)
- enforced or encouraged sterilisation or extermination (which will help with the pro-homogeneous society plan);
- mandatory belief system. Hmm. Some people won't like that. But the Greens will.

You seem to have put some thought into your plans.

Have you a method of implementation in mind? Paramilitary groups, mobilising the Women's Institute, youth groups, a new Wiccan movement, converting the NHS?

The NHS might be a good starting point, by getting the Trusts to convert to your views to promote savings and efficiency. Getting doctors and nurses behind your cause will definitely help with the eugenics, which in turn gives you a convenient way of removing inconvenient opposition members. When junior doctors - surely one of the most aspirational middle-class groups of all - are threatening to strike, there must be scope for revolt.

You'll need to find a new word to replace 'eugenics' though. It has some negative associations. You need something that applies some spin to it, like pro-health.

Very environmentally conscious, a pagan belief system. And convenient, especially when the government's priests say Gaia or Pan has approved fracking so no public inquiry is needed. I like the idea of removing the desert religions as not being appropriate for a more fertile and temperate part of the world. You could really go with that angle.

I think you have the makings of a real winner there, combining state, religion, culture, economics, philosophy and a way of quietly eliminating objectors. But it does need a name.
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illegaltobepoor
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(Original post by demx9)
There is literally nothing wrong with NatSoc
Of course. There is nothing wrong with persecuting:

Jews, Disabled People, Trade Unionists, Communists etc.
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middy 1943
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i remember from nearly twenty years ago that in circa 2015 the national pension would be £140 per week maximum. They certainly got that dead on! Why dont people wake up and realise that policies for the future are made 20 years earlier. No matter which political party is in the civil servants do the real work and the PM uses that to pretend he is making the rules.
faschism is where they change the rules , stop the welfare and free hospitals spend millions on armies,, get solid gold bath-taps
and throw all university students in prison. doesnt your stupid topic of faschism make you think of North korea??
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middy 1943
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(Original post by Simes)
So it should:
- promote national differences (normally usually only useful for a pro-militaristic stance as it tends to be anti-trade);
- maintain traditions (that's nice, we're crap at that, especially in England);
- make every one look the same. Do you want enforced interbreeding or enforced racial emigration / extermination? Or have you a proposal that has not been tried and tested?
- so a flatter social structure (that conforms nicely with traditional national socialism's anti-capitalist views - it's funny where the overlaps occur in politics, innit?)
- enforced or encouraged sterilisation or extermination (which will help with the pro-homogeneous society plan);
- mandatory belief system. Hmm. Some people won't like that. But the Greens will.

You seem to have put some thought into your plans.

Have you a method of implementation in mind? Paramilitary groups, mobilising the Women's Institute, youth groups, a new Wiccan movement, converting the NHS?

The NHS might be a good starting point, by getting the Trusts to convert to your views to promote savings and efficiency. Getting doctors and nurses behind your cause will definitely help with the eugenics, which in turn gives you a convenient way of removing inconvenient opposition members. When junior doctors - surely one of the most aspirational middle-class groups of all - are threatening to strike, there must be scope for revolt.

You'll need to find a new word to replace 'eugenics' though. It has some negative associations. You need something that applies some spin to it, like pro-health.

Very environmentally conscious, a pagan belief system. And convenient, especially when the government's priests say Gaia or Pan has approved fracking so no public inquiry is needed. I like the idea of removing the desert religions as not being appropriate for a more fertile and temperate part of the world. You could really go with that angle.

I think you have the makings of a real winner there, combining state, religion, culture, economics, philosophy and a way of quietly eliminating objectors. But it does need a name.
the problem with your comment is that you have said everything but dont live in the real world!
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Simes
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(Original post by middy 1943)
faschism is where they change the rules, stop the welfare and free hospitals spend millions on armies, get solid gold bath-taps and throw all university students in prison. Doesn't your stupid topic of faschism make you think of North Korea?
It's 'fascism' not 'faschism'.

The stopping of welfare is neither here nor there for fascism. That's an economic and social decision. Ditto free hospitals.

Spending millions on armies - certainly. But not as much as the USA does.

Solid bath taps would provide no water.

University students typically got oppressed in France (police brutality), USA (shot dead by state troopers) and Cambodia (extermination) whereas according to the USA's Library of Congress "Before North Korea's socialist revolution, there were no universities in North Korea. Now there are more than 300 colleges and universities" so they're not being oppressed there. We, however, used to get grants and now have to pay to go.

(Original post by middy 1943)
the problem with your comment is that you have said everything but dont live in the real world!
Simes the alien. Posting from Narnia.
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