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Who hates the EU? watch

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    And don't want to be in it?

    Join me comrades.
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    (Original post by SaucissonSecCy)
    And don't want to be in it?

    Join me comrades.
    Good for free trade and that is about it other then that we have an open door for immigrants from the EU. The majority will vote to stay in though after a lot of scare mongering.
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    (Original post by ZZTop1)
    Good for free trade and that is about it other then that we have an open door for immigrants from the EU. The majority will vote to stay in though after a lot of scare mongering.
    A protectionist bloc is not good for free trade.
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    I hate the EU beyond measure. I sincerely hope one day I see the EU project collapse and watch the likes of Germany suffer the consequences for imposing their will on us
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    (Original post by ZZTop1)
    Good for free trade and that is about it other then that we have an open door for immigrants from the EU. The majority will vote to stay in though after a lot of scare mongering.
    Will you proudly sing the EU national anthem when it becomes our official one then?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jo_-KoBiBG0

    And What a surprise, it was written by a GERMAN composer, with GERMAN lyrics.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthem_of_Europe

    People like you are a disgrace, you actually spit on the graves of the war dead who fought against Nazi Germany. They died for nothing. Germany got what they want after all because of people like you.
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    Will you proudly sing the EU national anthem when it becomes our official one then?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jo_-KoBiBG0

    And What a surprise, it was written by a GERMAN composer, with GERMAN lyrics.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthem_of_Europe

    People like you are a disgrace, you actually spit on the graves of the war dead who fought against Nazi Germany. They died for nothing. Germany got what they want after all because of people like you.
    Who said anything about mecwanting to tay in looking at the pros and cons im voting out.nobody said anything about singing and frankly i do not have to answer your questions as i a not in trail.
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    (Original post by SaucissonSecCy)
    And don't want to be in it?

    Join me comrades.
    About a third of voters


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    I wouldn't say I hate the EU, I just think it has outlived its usefulness. I feel like it no longer serves the interests of Europe in general, and that it has become an instrument that the Germans are using to force their ideals on everyone.

    The idea of free trade and reduced travel restrictions was a good one when everything was going well, but now that Germany is dominating things, imposing too many rules and restrictions, and pressuring EU nations to take in refugees against their national interest, I don't really like the direction it's going.

    Ideally, you can convince other nations to leave the EU as well, and join another organisation that will allow them to continue the favourable and profitable relationship, but without all the unreasonable regulations and violations of sovereignty. I'm picturing a union of European states to the west of Germany that might distrust their power, if you get what I'm hinting at here.

    The thing is, I don't know how much time you have to leave before Germany decides to make the EU less voluntary... in the sense of saying that you can't leave. I would honestly say that Europe as a whole really doesn't make much sense as a nation-state. Common languages and cultures usually unite a people, not geographic location. Several failed states have incorporated warring tribes under a single government, resulting in constant turmoil.

    Another thing to remember is that the UK has a fairly large GDP on its own, unlike many other EU nations. Your leaving would help break the whole thing apart and make it less profitable. The other members probably count on you to restrain German power, and I suspect that if you set an example, others would follow.

    I'm not saying it would be easy, or that it wouldn't hurt to lose all the economic advantages in the short-term, but I think in the long-run, it will benefit you to leave. They have a saying in my country. "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety". In my (admittedly irrelevant) American opinion, staying in the EU would be giving up essential liberty for the sake of temporary economic security. Worse, you would be entrusting your security to a state that really doesn't have your best interests at heart or share the same ideals.

    I would ask that you think, critically, about how much the EU has done for Britain. Whether you're really so much better off that you can't even contemplate getting by without them.

    You accepted that the Canadians, the Irish, and the Australians have a right to self-determination. Well, think about how the EU is affecting your self-determination. The common currency they're pushing, the increasingly centralised government. Do you want to be the UK, or do you just want to be another unremarkable European country with less and less control over your own internal affairs?

    Again, this isn't really my country, but so far I haven't really liked the loss of British identity and sovereignty that has come with EU membership. In my mind, the economic benefits aren't worth what you've had to sacrifice to get them, even if they are real.

    If you don't think getting by without the EU is possible, then just take a look at Norway. They're not EU members, but they're doing fairly well for themselves. Greece is an EU member, and their economy really hasn't benefited all that much from it. Clearly, the EU isn't everything and nations do get by without it.
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    I hate the EU beyond measure. I sincerely hope one day I see the EU project collapse and watch the likes of Germany suffer the consequences for imposing their will on us
    HAHAHA too funny dude. But I don't see that happening. I too want us to leave the EU. Too many immigrants
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    I'm for the EU for the protection & rights it gives to workers, disabled people and pensioners. I am not for David Cameron bargaining away rights & protection for him to cease a new deal. The only people this will benefit are the class of capital and big corporations. He is using the EU referendum as a means to increase inequality in the UK and make the rich better off.

    I look towards UKIPPER's and Labour and say we would much better out of the EU entirely if this is the case. We cannot trust the Conservatives.
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    (Original post by illegaltobepoor)
    I'm for the EU for the protection & rights it gives to workers, disabled people and pensioners. I am not for David Cameron bargaining away rights & protection for him to cease a new deal. The only people this will benefit are the class of capital and big corporations. He is using the EU referendum as a means to increase inequality in the UK and make the rich better off.

    I look towards UKIPPER's and Labour and say we would much better out of the EU entirely if this is the case. We cannot trust the Conservatives.
    Yea no rights existed before the eu and we are in capable of writing our own


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    (Original post by Gears265)
    I hate the EU beyond measure. I sincerely hope one day I see the EU project collapse and watch the likes of Germany suffer the consequences for imposing their will on us
    Are you angry that Angela merkel was asking people to take in more Syrian refugees and making other demands? She's the boss!
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    (Original post by queen-bee)
    Are you angry that Angela merkel was asking people to take in more Syrian refugees and making other demands? She's the boss!
    Does she have a big **** too?


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    (Original post by paul514)
    Does she have a big **** too?


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    Wouldn't know about that :mmm:
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    I'm suspicious of it.
    Too much too soon - got to be a bad idea.
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    (Original post by jeremy1988)
    I wouldn't say I hate the EU, I just think it has outlived its usefulness. I feel like it no longer serves the interests of Europe in general, and that it has become an instrument that the Germans are using to force their ideals on everyone.
    I think you are the second person I have seen stating this view. I am perplexed to know where it comes from. It certainly isn't something I have seen written in the popular press so either it is your perception or something else.

    Why do you perceive that the German's seem to have a stronger voice in Europe than anyone else? And given the tremendousness of WW2 why do you think the German's have an appetite for inflicting their will on others again?
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    (Original post by ByEeek)
    I think you are the second person I have seen stating this view. I am perplexed to know where it comes from. It certainly isn't something I have seen written in the popular press so either it is your perception or something else.

    Why do you perceive that the German's seem to have a stronger voice in Europe than anyone else? And given the tremendousness of WW2 why do you think the German's have an appetite for inflicting their will on others again?
    Actually, I only heard about this view fairly recently, but it makes sense to me.

    I thought the Germans had changed, honestly, until I saw what was happening with Greece. The Germans keep imposing these austerity measures, and currently control the purse strings in much of Europe due to their economic strength. They can use this economic strength to pressure other states that are in debt to them into voting the way they want. Also, I think they just like being in charge of the purse strings a little too much, after having been the ones that needed money and had to deal with other country's conditions for so long.

    To be honest, Angela Merkel in particular is the one I have an issue with. I'm sure not everyone in Germany agrees with her views. But the problem is that there are too many Germans who do, enough to get her elected. Given Germany's current economic power, leaders like her are dangerous.

    In my mind, it seems like they're so angry about being seen as Nazis and sort of resent the rest of Europe for beating them as well. They've been waiting for an opportunity to take the moral high ground so they can throw their weight around. Now they have one, and they are determined both to appear tolerant and to force that tolerance on everyone else.

    Germany may no longer be a military bully, but they are now an economic bully with a humanitarian agenda. They went so far in the opposite direction that they've gone off the cliff. They're now going to destroy Europe and themselves with kindness to outsiders, which is ironic because it's the opposite of what happened in WWII.

    Their problem is a tendency to go to extremes. Germans seem to have a poor understanding of moderation.

    Germany keeps imposing austerity, abusing their dominant economic position within the EU, and now they are forcing everyone to accept refugees. Once they do accept them, crime rates will increase, they'll need more money to care for them, and nations will need to turn to Germany for money, and possibly defence as well.

    More power will be devolved to the European Union to create an army and a police force, the nations will become more like states in the US, and since Germany controls the European Union... they will indirectly control the army by controlling the budgets of just about every EU member. All without them having any direct accountability and being able to claim it's collective choice. This is actually how the federal government maintains control here, forcing states to adopt certain policies in order to receive federal funds. If you think money doesn't lead to political control, you're wrong.

    I think they're trying to generate a crisis that will force the EU to function as a nation, and ultimately make them so interdependent that no state will be allowed to leave.

    I could very well be wrong and paranoid here. Perhaps it's just Merkel that's like this, and all the Germans will vote in someone with different politics next time around. She's been referred to as "Merkiavelli" before, and I honestly think she might just be an extremely unfit leader. I don't know enough about German culture or the people that live there to say whether Merkel is a reasonable reflection of the way people think in Germany. But if she is, then I can see all of that happening.
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    (Original post by jeremy1988)
    I thought the Germans had changed, honestly, until I saw what was happening with Greece. The Germans keep imposing these austerity measures, and currently control the purse strings in much of Europe due to their economic strength. They can use this economic strength to pressure other states that are in debt to them into voting the way they want. Also, I think they just like being in charge of the purse strings a little too much, after having been the ones that needed money and had to deal with other country's conditions for so long.
    But in picking up on this single issue you are tarring the whole of German foreign policy with the same brush. What was the alternative? To allow Greece to default? What country as a major world creditor in its right mind would allow that? The UK certainly wouldn't.

    I don't think it fair to draw such conclusions of Germany as a whole, especially when they are leading the debate on immigration for example. Whilst every other state in the EU is hoping it is the other's problem whilst burying their own heads in the sand, Germany are quite clear on their position. I don't think you can draw any firm conclusions from either policy. They are just two slices of a very complex pie.

    As for talk of EU armies or foreign policy. That certainly isn't going to happen whilst the UK is a member.
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    Nigel Farage.
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    (Original post by ByEeek)
    But in picking up on this single issue you are tarring the whole of German foreign policy with the same brush. What was the alternative? To allow Greece to default? What country as a major world creditor in its right mind would allow that? The UK certainly wouldn't.
    True, but I'm not the only one that sees Germany in this light. I've seen them described in terms far less kind than what I'm using here by a number of people who live in Europe. I'm getting the impression that this is a pattern here, and that it's happened to countries other than Greece. The austerity measures and German loans, that is.
    I don't think it fair to draw such conclusions of Germany as a whole, especially when they are leading the debate on immigration for example. Whilst every other state in the EU is hoping it is the other's problem whilst burying their own heads in the sand, Germany are quite clear on their position. I don't think you can draw any firm conclusions from either policy. They are just two slices of a very complex pie.
    Yes, but they're leading everyone the wrong way, toward just opening the floodgates and letting everyone in.

    If they were leading towards capping the total number of refugees that Europe would accept altogether at something like 1 million or 2 million, and then saying the EU is closed, that would be another thing altogether. But they're going to keep pushing quotas and open borders. They want to give until it hurts and then some, and frankly that sucks.

    If they really wanted to be practical, they would try to set a quota on the number of refugees the entire EU would accept. Not pushing each nation to take some percentage based on the total number coming in, and then expecting that situation continue as more show up indefinitely.
    As for talk of EU armies or foreign policy. That certainly isn't going to happen whilst the UK is a member.
    Well, I certainly wouldn't think so. You guys are too smart to allow that. I just worry that they'll force it on people without a real vote somehow, through all that economic control.
 
 
 
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