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Are benefits still too generous in the UK?

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Original post by nulli tertius
Hardly. Hayek and Friedman were in favour of guaranteed minimum incomes.


So am I when the economy calls for it which is going to be another two decades or more


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Original post by Bill_Gates
You need to live within your means Paul, our economy depends on it!


No it doesn't. Our economy depends on us buying an endless stream of crap :tongue:
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
No it doesn't. Our economy depends on us buying an endless stream of crap :tongue:


Agreed for the majority but not for the vital minority :wink:
Original post by Bill_Gates
Agreed for the majority but not for the vital minority :wink:


Take money off of you and give it to some feckless chavs. Voila, more crap is added to that stream.
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Take money off of you and give it to some feckless chavs. Voila, more crap is added to that stream.


Why would you do that? that's communism. Give me more support and more pleasant government policies and i will sell more!
Benefits like Job Seeker's Allowance (JSA) is too generous. When I used to go Job Centre I remember seeing people on JSA who were obviously not looking for work but they were still signing on fortnightly. Job Centre need to be more stringent on who receives JSA and find better ways to catch out people who are genuinely not looking for work or else it will be just a waste of the government's money. That money could go down to something else.
Original post by Raymat
Benefits like Job Seeker's Allowance (JSA) is too generous. When I used to go Job Centre I remember seeing people on JSA who were obviously not looking for work but they were still signing on fortnightly. Job Centre need to be more stringent on who receives JSA and find better ways to catch out people who are genuinely not looking for work or else it will be just a waste of the government's money. That money could go down to something else.


Ye, £50 a week is living the high life. What planet do you people live on?

Original post by Bill_Gates
Why would you do that? that's communism. Give me more support and more pleasant government policies and i will sell more!


Communism is good for captlaism.

Don't you mean buy more? You would sell more if chavs have more disposable income.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Ye, £50 a week is living the high life. What planet do you people live on?



Communism is good for captlaism.

Don't you mean buy more? You would sell more if chavs have more disposable income.


Tbh i think it's getting to the point where the west knows majority of the people don't have disposable income on the scale they use to. Now it's more about pushing up more "sustainable" debt.
Original post by Bill_Gates
Tbh i think it's getting to the point where the west knows majority of the people don't have disposable income on the scale they use to. Now it's more about pushing up more "sustainable" debt.


Which is why no one can buy your crap software as the debt bubble has burst.
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Which is why no one can buy your crap software as the debt bubble has burst.


It did in 2008 but it hasnt now. They have better risk evaluation in place but that's not to say it won't happen again. But the preferential tool to put it "right" will be QE. Sad really.

Household debt is above 2008 pre crisis and income is around pre crisis too. Not much has changed to the dynamics. A global slowdown could bring trouble to markets.
Original post by Bill_Gates
Are benefits still too generous in the UK?

List of benefits people are eligible to receive:
- Child benefit
- Tax credits
- JSA
- Housing benefits
etc etc


The benefits system under the Tories has been anything but generous. The worst is JSA or Jobseekers Allowance. At only a measly £71 a week claimants have to jump through hoops to avoid this being sanctioned for between 4 weeks to 3 years. This JSA money is a lifeline to pay for food and bills, not luxuries.

If that is sanctioned you get nothing its a 100% fixed sanction. Failing an appeal which can take many months there is no way to get the sanction lifted.

For example you got sanctioned for not applying for sufficient jobs one week, (you must apply for 7 jobs per week) it doesn't matter if you apply for 200 jobs the sanction remains! Its a really cruel system.

From day 1 they're on your back.

1hr long work focused interviews every 4 weeks from the onset.
After 3 months the requirement to take attend a full time CV course even if you've already done one, if not the requirement to do Mandatory work Activity (workfare)
That's 30 hrs per week for 4 weeks just to get your measly £71 a week benefit. No choice in what work you do or where you work!
Fail to do workfare and its a 6 month sanction!

Being on JSA is pure torture. Staff are rude, often address you by your surname without title Mr, Miss etc
Not a case of square pegs in square holes, round ones in round holes, more like ram all pegs through one hole!
Original post by Raymat
Benefits like Job Seeker's Allowance (JSA) is too generous. When I used to go Job Centre I remember seeing people on JSA who were obviously not looking for work but they were still signing on fortnightly. Job Centre need to be more stringent on who receives JSA and find better ways to catch out people who are genuinely not looking for work or else it will be just a waste of the government's money. That money could go down to something else.


Rubbish! But might have been the case many years ago.

Jobseekers have to jump through hoops these days from day 1 or face cruel sanctions, that's 100% loss of benefit for between 4 weeks and 3 years!

Sanctions are fixed. Once one is issued it can not be removed until it expires. So attending an interview that you missed will not get the sanction removed.

Jobcentre staff have targets for sanctions.
If the endless Tory garbage people see on channel 4 and 5 about benefits street etc that imply that every claimant is a work shy cheat living a life of luxury was true then answer me this:

Q: Why do Jobcentres need to have sanction targets? Surely if everyone is a cheat it would be really easy to sanction people and staff would reach their monthly quotas in hours.

A: In reality the majority of Jobseekers do want to work. They apply for far more than the minimum number of jobs and take advantage of all opportunities. But that's bad news for Jobcentre staff :frown: they have difficulty finding people to sanction.

Remember sanctions save money and sanction victims are removed from unemployment stastics. So Jobcentre staff need to sanction a certain number of people a week and so look for easy targets. Sadly these soft targets can often be people with learning difficulties, disabilities etc :frown:

People are being sanctioned for some very petty reasons:

Being a few mins late to Jobcentre means a 4 week fixed sanction. 3 months if you are late again!

You have to apply for 7 jobs a week but yet can be sanction if one week you applied for 50 jobs but only 6 jobs the following week.

And in addition to sanctions ALL jobseekers must take part in a full time CV course at 3 months even if they've done a course on their own back. And at any point Jobseekers can be ordered to do mandatory work activity. 4 weeks for 30 hrs a week with no choice of what work or where the work is done, that's just to keep the measly JSA money!

JSA is not a soft option!
(edited 8 years ago)
We should consider drug education in the national curriculum together with sex education, although drugs are the later stages of the problem, we need to concentrate on why drugs are taken, what are they replacing, what is lacking in the users? can they/some be taken recreationally if some, which (let us not forget alcohol cigarettes aspirin viagra PreP ect act are all drugs). Its easy to say it's a poverty problem but it isn't, it's easy to say it's a no aspiration problem but it isn't, it's easy to say it's a bordem problem but it isn't, it's prevalent in all walks of life from the homeless to the Government, from the destitute to the bankers, from the infamous to the famous. If we are to address the

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