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Should university be open to everyone? watch

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    I'm currently doing an essay on this, what do you all think of this idea?
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    Not sure I understand what you mean. Do you mean like, should EVERYONE get in even with no A-levels or any qualifications at all?
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    (Original post by Tash28)
    I'm currently doing an essay on this, what do you all think of this idea?
    No it shouldn't.

    University should be for the academically elite. For those who intend to go into a career where a degree is a necessity, and by that I largely, but not exclusively, mean any career based around STEM subjects.

    Our current culture of encouraging every single person to go to University achieves nothing. All it does is introduce a pointless barrier to entry for jobs which could be done by almost anybody regardless of whether or not they have a degree. Why does it matter whether your barista has only got a few GCSEs instead of a degree in Performing Arts? Does it make a difference if the man scanning your shopping in Sainsburys has a degree in English? We are rapidly moving towards living in a country where every job advert is going to include the requirement "has a degree" despite the fact that the vast majority of those jobs could be done by damn near any person in the country regardless of what level of education they have.

    Let me ask you this, which of these two scenarios do you think would be best for the country:

    1) Every child in the country is encouraged to go to University, is told that to make anything of themselves they have to have a degree, and so a very high percentage of young people are not entering the workforce until they are 21/22, are accumulating £30-40,000 of debt in the form of a loan that the government is losing money on in the majority of cases, and where low-skilled jobs are ignoring any applicants who don't have a degree.

    2) Students who want to pursue a career where a degree is genuinely useful, where that degree would give them knowledge and skills that would be extremely valuable within their chosen career path, are encourage to go to University. Everybody else either leaves school at 16 or 18 and goes straight into the workforce in a low-skilled job (by this I simply mean jobs that do not require a high level of intelligence or technical skills) or into an apprenticeship or some other form of on-job-training if they wish to pursue a technical career.

    I'll give you the answer. Number 2.

    Number 2 would get more people in work sooner, would see more people entering technical trades, would free up massive amounts of money that the government are currently wasting on student loans which could be used to provide a much higher standard of training for those who wish to pursue an apprenticeship or some other kind of training, and would end the culture of people going to University for "the experience" which is nothing but a waste of 3 years of their life and a lot of taxpayers money.
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    (Original post by driftawaay)
    Not sure I understand what you mean. Do you mean like, should EVERYONE get in even with no A-levels or any qualifications at all?
    That is my exact title "should university be open to everyone?", so it can be interpreted as either no qualifications needed or that it would be free. I have yet to decide which version I will write about.
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    (Original post by mackemforever)
    No it shouldn't.

    University should be for the academically elite. For those who intend to go into a career where a degree is a necessity, and by that I largely, but not exclusively, mean any career based around STEM subjects.

    Our current culture of encouraging every single person to go to University achieves nothing. All it does is introduce a pointless barrier to entry for jobs which could be done by almost anybody regardless of whether or not they have a degree. Why does it matter whether your barista has only got a few GCSEs instead of a degree in Performing Arts? Does it make a difference if the man scanning your shopping in Sainsburys has a degree in English? We are rapidly moving towards living in a country where every job advert is going to include the requirement "has a degree" despite the fact that the vast majority of those jobs could be done by damn near any person in the country regardless of what level of education they have.

    Let me ask you this, which of these two scenarios do you think would be best for the country:

    1) Every child in the country is encouraged to go to University, is told that to make anything of themselves they have to have a degree, and so a very high percentage of young people are not entering the workforce until they are 21/22, are accumulating £30-40,000 of debt in the form of a loan that the government is losing money on in the majority of cases, and where low-skilled jobs are ignoring any applicants who don't have a degree.

    2) Students who want to pursue a career where a degree is genuinely useful, where that degree would give them knowledge and skills that would be extremely valuable within their chosen career path, are encourage to go to University. Everybody else either leaves school at 16 or 18 and goes straight into the workforce in a low-skilled job (by this I simply mean jobs that do not require a high level of intelligence or technical skills) or into an apprenticeship or some other form of on-job-training if they wish to pursue a technical career.

    I'll give you the answer. Number 2.

    Number 2 would get more people in work sooner, would see more people entering technical trades, would free up massive amounts of money that the government are currently wasting on student loans which could be used to provide a much higher standard of training for those who wish to pursue an apprenticeship or some other kind of training, and would end the culture of people going to University for "the experience" which is nothing but a waste of 3 years of their life and a lot of taxpayers money.
    Do you have an example country with an education system like your option 2?
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    (Original post by mackemforever)
    No it shouldn't.

    University should be for the academically elite. For those who intend to go into a career where a degree is a necessity, and by that I largely, but not exclusively, mean any career based around STEM subjects.
    Thank you for your answer, I completely agree with you so I am struggling to see the other side of the argument which I must also write about. I also don't see why the government should fund every single student wanting to go to university when it is not necessary.
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    University is accessible to everyone (ie if you get good grades you can go to university, no matter who you are). Blame Labour for introducing the idea that 50% of people should go to university. Completely unnecessary political rhetoric which is now resulting in a glut of graduates with unrealistic expectations, no jobs and worthless degrees in mickey mouse subjects.
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    (Original post by Tash28)
    Thank you for your answer, I completely agree with you so I am struggling to see the other side of the argument which I must also write about. I also don't see why the government should fund every single student wanting to go to university when it is not necessary.
    Have a look at http://webarchive.nationalarchives.g...y/expand.shtml

    The paper evidences research to argue the case for expansion to current levels of around 50% participation.
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    (Original post by PQ)
    Have a look at http://webarchive.nationalarchives.g...y/expand.shtml

    The paper evidences research to argue the case for expansion to current levels of around 50% participation.
    Thank you, will take a look now!
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    OP - you might also want to look into http://www.oecd.org/edu/EAG-Interim-report.pdf

    Facts like: "Yet in all OECD countries, as shown in Chart 2.1, people with high qualifications have thehighest employment rates and in most countries, they also have the lowest risk of beingunemployed. At the same time, people with the lowest educational qualifications are atgreater risk of being unemployed or out of the labour market."
    And charts like
    Name:  emprates.JPG
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    Are the logic used by governments for investing in HE. Longterm welfare and income support for low paid workers is much more expensive than the subsidy on student loans.
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    Well, no, you should have the required grades otherwise you're wasting your time and you're wasting the university's time.
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    [QUOTE=mackemforever;60234841]No it shouldn't.

    University should be for the academically elite. For those who intend to go into a career where a degree is a necessity, and by that I largely, but not exclusively, mean any career based around STEM subjects. QUOTE]

    This is quite an interesting view since up until fairly recently University catered for the elites studying what we would now collectively call "liberal arts"; history, the classics, art history, philosophy, literature etc. If you take a look at what people were graduating from in the 60's and 70's -sure there were STEM subjects - but 80% of it was liberal arts.

    You're now saying that universities should do the job that polytechnics used to do.
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    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    Well, no, you should have the required grades otherwise you're wasting your time and you're wasting the university's time.
    That's not necessarily the case. If you look at mature students - may of them do very well at university but don't have the formal qualifications that a university would require of an 18 year old to gain admittance.
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    (Original post by Howard)
    That's not necessarily the case. If you look at mature students - may of them do very well at university but don't have the formal qualifications that a university would require of an 18 year old to gain admittance.
    They still have to have the required access qualifications.
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    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    They still have to have the required access qualifications.
    Some had none or very little. I did a BSc(Hons) in construction management - there were a few folks on that that were ex tradesmen that worked their way up to foreman and then site manager over many years of experience. They had nothing at all (well, maybe a City in Guilds in Carpentry!)

    There were others on a parallel course; BSc(Hons) in quantity surveying that had nothing more than a couple of O levels (they had 20 years experience as estimators and as quantity surveyors though)

    So they were really admitted on very little in the way of formal qualifications at all.

    But as I say - they tended to perform very well. What they lacked in raw academic skills they made up for in superior knowledge gained through real life experience.
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    As in free? well the NHS are paying for some health related courses so that's 'free' i guess
    i think if there was a high demand for people doing that course they should get some help financially for it

    but free? idk our economy isn't top notch rn so probably not

    i think you should have qualifications if you wanna go to uni! like wtf i don't wanna work my arse off to get A*s at A level and then be on the same course as someone who just filled in the application. Also competition would RIIIISSSEEE like a skyscraper and if i was a future generation student i would be so pissed lol
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    (Original post by Tash28)
    That is my exact title "should university be open to everyone?", so it can be interpreted as either no qualifications needed or that it would be free. I have yet to decide which version I will write about.
    I wrote almost this exact same essay for my LNAT a couple of years ago and I basically said EDUCATION should be open to everyone but not necessarily degrees. Degrees are academic mostly and academia is not always for everyone. But, everyone should have access to some form of education e.g. BTECs, NVQs so that young people who are not so academically minded can still better themselves, earn a trade or whatever and not be looked done on for it.
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    (Original post by cole-slaw)
    They still have to have the required access qualifications.
    I didn't. Straight onto a degree course with 5 GCSEs.

    I think there's a point when you have enough suitable work experience that they don't worry about access qualifications.
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    In France, everybody with the Baccalaureat can go in the university they want in the degree of their choice. University degrees are therefore worthless.

    Universities should be opened to smart people. The rest should be offered professional and technical courses.The German/Swiss/Austrian systems work more or less like that and they have the lowest (youth) unemployment rates.
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    (Original post by driftawaay)
    Not sure I understand what you mean. Do you mean like, should EVERYONE get in even with no A-levels or any qualifications at all?
    I just ask myself the same question. Your question to your essay is not really clear and thus irritating.
 
 
 
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