Should young people be paid minimum wage?

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Poll: Should young people be paid minimum wage?
No - only 21 year olds + should be entitled to full minimum wage. (18)
10.23%
Yes - People age 18+ should be entitled to full minimum wage. (60)
34.09%
Yes - People age 16+ should be entitled to full minimum wage. (64)
36.36%
Yes - Everyone including children should be entitled to full minimum wage. (34)
19.32%
Treeroy
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#1
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We are expected to pay Adult prices for virtually every paid-for service in the country and yet we earn less. In some cases, we actually pay more to live - as we are not entitled to most benefits or credits.

Should under 21s be paid the same as over 21s?
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Pidge Gunderson
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No, as generally under-21s do not contribute nearly enough to the economy as over-21s. Also, typically under-21s work much less demanding jobs.
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Treeroy
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(Original post by Kyou)
No, as generally under-21s do not contribute nearly enough to the economy as over-21s. Also, typically under-21s work much less demanding jobs.
1) Of course they are not contributing as much if they are only earning £5/hour. They could contribute more if they were paid more! They pay the same tax as everyone else remember.
2) But over 21s can have those jobs too. At my work, 95% of my coworkers are over 21, and I am under 21. We are paid different amounts for the SAME WORK. It would be one thing to create specific jobs for under 21s but this is not the case. Can you please inform me of some jobs which under 21 year olds work in but over 21 year olds do not??
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sw651
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I think that minimum wages should be proportional to age, younger people do not work nearly as many hours, nor do they pay national insurance or taxes on average
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Good bloke
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(Original post by Treeroy)
Should under 21s be paid the same as over 21s?
They are guaranteed less pay as a means of helping them find work. Most employers, given the choice between a young person and someone a few years older will take on the older person (who has the rough edges rubbed off, greater expectation of reliability etc) if the cost is the same. They are more likely to take on the younger person if they can save money by doing so.
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Pidge Gunderson
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(Original post by Treeroy)
1) Of course they are not contributing as much if they are only earning £5/hour. They could contribute more if they were paid more! They pay the same tax as everyone else remember.
2) But over 21s can have those jobs too. At my work, 95% of my coworkers are over 21, and I am under 21. We are paid different amounts for the SAME WORK. It would be one thing to create specific jobs for under 21s but this is not the case. Can you please inform me of some jobs which under 21 year olds work in but over 21 year olds do not??
I'm talking in terms of the majority, not the minority. Age typically (not always) correlates with more experience and higher maturity, hence why wage increases with age. Also, the older they are the more likely they are to have more responsibilities in life, such as a house, family etc.

Again, I'm only speaking in terms of the majority of people.
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Treeroy
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(Original post by Kyou)
I'm talking in terms of the majority, not the minority. Age typically (not always) correlates with more experience and higher maturity, hence why wage increases with age. Also, the older they are the more likely they are to have more responsibilities in life, such as a house, family etc.Again, I'm only speaking in terms of the majority of people.
But the MINIMUM wage is not meant to be about the majority of people, it is meant to be the net for ALL people.

(Original post by sw651)
I think that minimum wages should be proportional to age, younger people do not work nearly as many hours, nor do they pay national insurance or taxes on average
So what if they don't work as many hours? It's still the same work.And again to go back to my own personal example of me. I work the most hours that I can physically do in my work. It's more than all but three other people who are the same hours as me and are over 21 so paid more.You have to be 16 to pay national insurance so i dunno where you're getting this idea that young peolpe dont pay NI from.
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sw651
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(Original post by Treeroy)
But the MINIMUM wage is not meant to be about the majority of people, it is meant to be the net for ALL people.

So what if they don't work as many hours? It's still the same work.And again to go back to my own personal example of me. I work the most hours that I can physically do in my work. It's more than all but three other people who are the same hours as me and are over 21 so paid more.You have to be 16 to pay national insurance so i dunno where you're getting this idea that young peolpe dont pay NI from.
They often don't pay NI because they don't do enough hours to earn enough to pay NI, they are paid more money because they also have far more outgoings than a 16/17 year old. They have to pay taxes, poll tax, car tax, bills as well as rents and mortgages, the are using it to LIVE not just as disposable income!
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ChaoticButterfly
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Of course they should be paid the same.
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TimmonaPortella
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People don't seem to realise that for under 21s, who generally have less experience, and will generally be looking for quite basic jobs, having the ability to offer their services at a lower price is an advantage.

(Original post by Good bloke)
They are guaranteed less pay as a means of helping them find work. Most employers, given the choice between a young person and someone a few years older will take on the older person (who has the rough edges rubbed off, greater expectation of reliability etc) if the cost is the same. They are more likely to take on the younger person if they can save money by doing so.
So, this, basically.
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sw651
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(Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
Of course they should be paid the same.
Pray expand on your point
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ChaoticButterfly
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(Original post by sw651)
Pray expand on your point
It's age discrimination.

You can't pay an old person less in a manual job as they are old and fat. You shouldn't be able to pay someone less just because they are 16 for doing the same job.
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ChaoticButterfly
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(Original post by TimmonaPortella)
People don't seem to realise that for under 21s, who generally have less experience, and will generally be looking for quite basic jobs, having the ability to offer their services at a lower price is an advantage.



So, this, basically.
Non skilled jobs are not complicated. You learn them fast. If anything they often tend to be mindless physical work in which young people excel at because they are young and fit. It's a market that favors the employer so they can exploit young people. It's exploitation.
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Treeroy
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(Original post by sw651)
They often don't pay NI because they don't do enough hours to earn enough to pay NI, they are paid more money because they also have far more outgoings than a 16/17 year old. They have to pay taxes, poll tax, car tax, bills as well as rents and mortgages, the are using it to LIVE not just as disposable income!
And what about the thousands of young people like me who are NOT using it as disposable income. I struggle to pay my rent, I can't afford to pay for basic things like medicine from the doctor, hell the other week I had to stay home from work because I literally couldn't afford the transport to get there until payday.

Also I know plenty of middle aged adults who only have a job for disposable income and could easily live without a job! Should they not be entitled to minimum wage too?
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sw651
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(Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
It's age discrimination.

You can't pay an old person less in a manual job as they are not old and fat. You shouldn't be able to pay someone less just because they are 16 for doing the same job.

Also who says 'pray', you weirdo
16 year olds are often unreliable and do not do anywhere near the same hours. Also they do not have to live of that money.

And its called being well spoken.
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sw651
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(Original post by Treeroy)
And what about the thousands of young people like me who are NOT using it as disposable income. I struggle to pay my rent, I can't afford to pay for basic things like medicine from the doctor, hell the other week I had to stay home from work because I literally couldn't afford the transport to get there until payday.

Also I know plenty of middle aged adults who only have a job for disposable income and could easily live without a job! Should they not be entitled to minimum wage too?
First, How old are you? If money is that bad, then we have a welfare system in this country for a reason.

And no adult has a job for a disposable income, their income is just surplus to their outgoings
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TimmonaPortella
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(Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
Non skilled jobs are not complicated. You learn them fast. If anything they often tend to be mindless physical work in which young people excel at because they are young and fit.
Put yourselves in the shoes of an employer.

You have two possible candidates for a position on a counter in a clothing store (just as a random example). Candidate A is 18 years old, and fresh out of school; he has maybe worked for a while at weekends, but nothing more. Nor has he ever worked in this particular role before. Candidate B is 24 years old and has been in this type of work before. He doesn't need to be trained from scratch, and he has references and a history of full time employment that show he is reliable.

If and B are the same price, do you take the risk and go for A? Of course you don't. Even leaving aside the point about experience in that particular role, why would you? It's just more hassle and risk.
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Hasan_Ahmed
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Some 16 year olds are parents. They might have screwed up, but they don't need society decreasing their child's quality of life even more because of it.
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ChaoticButterfly
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(Original post by sw651)
16 year olds are often unreliable and do not do anywhere near the same hours. Also they do not have to live of that money.

And its called being well spoken.
Those ones get sacked. You can say the same about many older people as well. Sometimes young people can be so scared to stand up for themselves that they are more likely to allow themselves to be over worked, they don;t know their rights etc

Nice bit of discriminatory prejudice you got there.

Says who? They could have been kicked out of home for all you know. You can leave home at 16. But that is non of your concern. In my last job I was living at home. No rent, no utilities for me to pay no car, my only bill was food. Still doesn't mean my employer can pay me less than min wage. If you don;t pay people enough benefits bill will increase or you can do what the Tories do and vindictive push people into financial stress by taking the benefit given to them to supplement their inadequate pay.

They tend to not do the same hours as they are often in education... They work on top of studying. Why is that an excuse to pay them less? They need to be paid a fair amount even more then as they will have a limited income, especially if they come from a poorer family or a family that will not help them.

I honesty don;t know what planet people live in a lot of the time. Or why young people themselves are so willing to bend over in order to be screwed.
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Treeroy
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(Original post by sw651)
First, How old are you? If money is that bad, then we have a welfare system in this country for a reason.

And no adult has a job for a disposable income, their income is just surplus to their outgoings
Except that we DON'T have a welfare system available to young people because you are not entitled to 90% of benefits until you are 21 or older. The people who earn the least are the ones not entitled to benefits! It's nuts.


And yes as I said I know plenty of adults who have jobs for disposable income. Mostly Wives who have high-earning husbands who get a job as something to have some more money. Like I know a middle age couple, one of them earns well over £150K and the other one stays at home. Recently she decided to get a job to give her something to do and have some extra money. She doesn't need the money, the job is PURELY to get disposable income. Should she only get paid £5 an hour cause she doesn't really need it?! What a stupid argument.
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