Is it islamaphobic to be anti-ISIS? Watch

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AlwaysWatching
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#21
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#21
(Original post by Ahmed766)
hating ISIS does not make you Islamaphobic as I would be an Islamophobic Muslim by that definition.
Technically it does, since ISIS follows a branch of politicised Islam. You might not be associated with that branch of lslam as a Muslim, but it is still a form of Islamic ideology. If you hate politicised Islam, or wahhabism Islam, then you are Islamophobic by definition, like it or not.
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AlwaysWatching
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#22
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#22
(Original post by getfunky!)
:ditto: :



I believe the NUS made the right choice - a majority abstained or voted against the motion. They shouldn't have to agree that ISIL is terrible, that much is obvious, but they shouldn't have to agree with support for 'kurdish forces'.
The NUS is now in a tricky situation since now has "solidarity" with an institution that has been committing war crimes. Not as bad as ISIS obviously, but still war crimes. Also, they have essentially took the position that because to condemn ISIS is Islamophobic, then ISIS is effectively representative of Islam. Because to condemn ISIS would be to condemn Muslims and Islam.
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MatureStudent36
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#23
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(Original post by keromedic)
I would say no. And the posts of the sane muslims in the other thread in this subforum would suggest a sensible, obvious answer to the title's question is also no.

What then of this? Do we agree that it's ridiculous?
Not at all. Most Muslims are anti ISIS.

It's like saying that all people, including Christians are anti Christian if they do not subscribe to Christian fundamentalist doctrine.

Fringe groupings will often use labels and wedge politics to further their cause. I was labelled anti Scottish for not subscribing to the SNPs myopic outlook for Scotland in last years referendum.

It's a case of identity politics gone mad.
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BaconandSauce
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#24
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#24
(Original post by MatureStudent36)
It's a case of identity politics gone mad.
This
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driftawaay
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#25
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#25
(Original post by sw651)
Hating something doesn't mean you have phobia of it, I do not like lettuce, doesn't mean I have a phobia of it.

Anti-Semitism and Anti-Zionism are different things that are not the same in any way??
Islamophopbia doesn't actually mean you have a phobia of Islam or Muslims. It doesn't mean you are going to run away if you see someone wearing a hijab or get a panic attack if you see a picture of a Quran on Google images.
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JeremyOU
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#26
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(Original post by lucaf)
As stupid as that is, I do question why on earth a student organisation needs to take any kind of position on middle eastern extremists. It has nothing to do with the organizations purpose, why is that something they need an official statement on? Does every union need to make a statement officially condemning IS?
I should say so. it shows their position against extremists, and is always a good way of discussing the issue.
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SaucissonSecCy
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#27
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#27
I hate that word. It's pahtologising being against ideas and principles. That isn't a phobia. Would you call being opposed to the execution of gay people, and apostates a 'phobia'?

Just stfu tbh.
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KimKallstrom
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#28
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To be honest if the NUS are against something, the chances are that thing is right. I'd wear NUS condemnation as a badge of honour.
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Evening
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#29
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According to the far left.

But anyone with common sense can see that it is not 'islamophobic' to be against ISIS.
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lucaf
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#30
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#30
(Original post by JeremyOU)
I should say so. it shows their position against extremists, and is always a good way of discussing the issue.
But the issue is so irrelevant to them that there is no need for them to be discussing it. Who on earth cares about the official NUS stance on a militant group half the word away? Should we criticise the National Union of Teachers for never publically condemning ISIS, or the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons, or the Bakers, Food and Allied Workers Union? It is ridiculous to expect every organised body to have an official opinion on every single unrelated issue.
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woIfie
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#31
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#31
(Original post by sw651)
Anti-Semitism and Anti-Zionism are different things that are not the same in any way??
I wouldn't say they're "not the same in any way".

By being an "anti-Zionist" you are saying you want the state of Israel to end, which essentially means you want bad things to happen to six millions Jews. It's a form of constructive anti-semitism.

Also, given most "anti-Zionists" are obsessed with the world's only Jewish state and pretty much ignore other human rights abuses, it certainly does raise questions.

However, obviously criticising the actions of the Israeli government is not in any way anti-semitic.
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The Champion.m4a
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#32
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#32
Yes if you're scared of them.
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sw651
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#33
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#33
(Original post by Little Toy Gun)
Yes if you're scared of them.


Posted from TSR Mobile

Technically ISIS aren't Islamic though? If we talk about the Islamic faith, they reject extremist views
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KingBradly
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#34
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#34
(Original post by sw651)
Posted from TSR Mobile

Technically ISIS aren't Islamic though? If we talk about the Islamic faith, they reject extremist views
What?
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ivybridge
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#35
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#35
No.
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The Champion.m4a
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#36
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#36
(Original post by sw651)
Posted from TSR Mobile

Technically ISIS aren't Islamic though? If we talk about the Islamic faith, they reject extremist views
ISIS is Islamic. They don't have to follow every single thing in the Koran to be Islamic, and they sure as hell follow it much better than 'moderate' muslims.
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JeremyOU
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#37
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(Original post by lucaf)
But the issue is so irrelevant to them that there is no need for them to be discussing it. Who on earth cares about the official NUS stance on a militant group half the word away? Should we criticise the National Union of Teachers for never publically condemning ISIS, or the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons, or the Bakers, Food and Allied Workers Union? It is ridiculous to expect every organised body to have an official opinion on every single unrelated issue.
Oh really?
And how is that Isis group really half a world away, when our students here keep joining it?
I would say it is very relevant.
And you clearly don't watch all the news, there's lots of news story's about people plotting (in the uk) to join Isis and kill people, that's why MI5 and MI6 monitor everyone's email and phone calls. (Not that anyone thanks them for saving us from endless terror plots. No they just complain about their lack of privacy, as if it matters that highly trained analysts are looking at their stuff)
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jeremy1988
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#38
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Yes, and that's why I'm proud to be Islamophobic. People try to use it as an insult, but I take it as a compliment.

Since it's only defined as the fear of Islam as a political force, I can be Islamophobic and still get along fine with individual Muslims. I think it's even possible for Muslims to be Islamophobic. Personally, I would have chosen a better name to go with that definition, but if that's the definition we're going with, then sure.

I think if we carry it to its logical extreme, we could actually tell all the Muslim refugees that are running from ISIS that they're just being paranoid and Islamophobic for fleeing from ISIS and not trusting them.

Honestly, the political side of Islam is the part that scares me. I don't really care about the headscarves, or the refusal to eat bacon. If we just had a bunch of people covering their heads, praying while facing east, refusing to eat bacon, etc... it might not be a big deal. But they're not. They want to be a political force and impose their will on people, and there are enough of them that it might be possible for them to do so.

Bear in mind, I used to fear evangelical Christians for the same reason, trying to get evolution taken out of textbooks and stuff like that. But that's on the decline, while this is on the rise. That's why I'm concerned about it... although I know that some Muslims do become Atheists after being exposed to different ideas, so there might be some hope in that if immigration could be reduced or slowed down.

What I just don't understand is why it was okay to laugh at Christians when they claimed we were infringing on their religious rights by not allowing them to make legal judgments based on their religious beliefs, but we actually take Muslims seriously and consider their opinion valid when they do the same thing. How are we supposed to have a secular society if we make all these concessions to Muslims?
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lucaf
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#39
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(Original post by JeremyOU)
Oh really?
And how is that Isis group really half a world away, when our students here keep joining it?
I would say it is very relevant.
And you clearly don't watch all the news, there's lots of news story's about people plotting (in the uk) to join Isis and kill people, that's why MI5 and MI6 monitor everyone's email and phone calls. (Not that anyone thanks them for saving us from endless terror plots. No they just complain about their lack of privacy, as if it matters that highly trained analysts are looking at their stuff)
It doesn't matter that terrorist activity is still occurring in the UK, because that activity is completely unrelated to a student union. It is not relevant to education or student rights, why on earth should they have to make a statement? Them officially condemning ISIS would be like the RSPCA officially supporting gay marriage: a nice gesture, but so completely irrelevant to their remit that is is just asinine to actively expect it of them.
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JeremyOU
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#40
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#40
(Original post by lucaf)
It doesn't matter that terrorist activity is still occurring in the UK, because that activity is completely unrelated to a student union. It is not relevant to education or student rights, why on earth should they have to make a statement? Them officially condemning ISIS would be like the RSPCA officially supporting gay marriage: a nice gesture, but so completely irrelevant to their remit that is is just asinine to actively expect it of them.
Actually it would be like the RSPCA condemning rabies, completely unrelated, yeah.
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