Doing honours in Mathematics at King's College of London Watch

springconstant
Badges: 5
Rep:
?
#1
Report Thread starter 3 years ago
#1
Hello people,

I'm currently a student in a Group of Eight University in Australia; majoring in Physics and Mathematics.
My current weighted average mark is 65%. GPA is approximately 5.2/7.0.
Beside my core units(or more familiarly, modules) the 4 other empty slots are filled with Economics units(instead of the easy language units)
By definition:
80% and above is a high distinction-7
(70-79)% is a distinction-6
(60-69)% is a credit-5
(50-59)% is a credit pass-4
Anything below 50% is a fail.

Realistically, on the assumption I maintain a GPA of 5.2/7.0, what are my chances of doing honours over at King's? (I'm assuming an honours is a prerequisite for entry into a MSc program in the UK)
0
reply
High Stakes
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#2
Report 3 years ago
#2
As in, you wish to transfer to KCL?
1
reply
springconstant
Badges: 5
Rep:
?
#3
Report Thread starter 3 years ago
#3
(Original post by High Stakes)
As in, you wish to transfer to KCL?
That would depends on your definition of what "transfer" is.

Undergraduate degree program is three years in Australia. Honours is a sort of graduate diploma which spans a year-and entry depends largely on grades.
Masters is followed after honours which culminate with Phd. At least that's the academic structure in Australia.
0
reply
High Stakes
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#4
Report 3 years ago
#4
(Original post by springconstant)
That would depends on your definition of what "transfer" is.

Undergraduate degree program is three years in Australia. Honours is a sort of graduate diploma which spans a year-and entry depends largely on grades.
Masters is followed after honours which culminate with Phd. At least that's the academic structure in Australia.
Oh i see, so just to clarify it's:

- Undergraduate Degree (3 years)
- Honours (1 year)
- Masters
- Phd

Correct?
0
reply
springconstant
Badges: 5
Rep:
?
#5
Report Thread starter 3 years ago
#5
(Original post by High Stakes)
Oh i see, so just to clarify it's:

- Undergraduate Degree (3 years)
- Honours (1 year)
- Masters
- Phd

Correct?
Bingo!

I wouldn't think the grading system between that in the UK and those in the AU would differ by a gulf.
What exactly are my chances?
0
reply
High Stakes
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#6
Report 3 years ago
#6
(Original post by springconstant)
Bingo!

I wouldn't think the grading system between that in the UK and those in the AU would differ by a gulf.
What exactly are my chances?
In the UK, you can progress onto a masters course directly from your undergraduate.

In some cases even, universities offer their undergraduate courses as a 4 year which is really just them sticking on the masters (fourth year).

I'd think you'd be able to apply for the Msc as well. But I'd recommend contacting the university? They have their email on the site (and one for the mathematics department!) so just ask them to hear it straight from them.
0
reply
springconstant
Badges: 5
Rep:
?
#7
Report Thread starter 3 years ago
#7
(Original post by High Stakes)
In the UK, you can progress onto a masters course directly from your undergraduate.

In some cases even, universities offer their undergraduate courses as a 4 year which is really just them sticking on the masters (fourth year).

I'd think you'd be able to apply for the Msc as well. But I'd recommend contacting the university? They have their email on the site (and one for the mathematics department!) so just ask them to hear it straight from them.
I have considered the possibility that perhaps, as like in Australia, progression into Msc is possible after undergraduate.
However, looking at Imperial College of London, it seems that entry into their Ms programs requires at least a second class honours-this itself implies that one would have to already be in an honours program(perhaps Imperials is far more prestigious?)

Besides, putting the issue of Msc aside, isn't honours considered to be a 'selective' program only for candidates who have achieved sufficiently good grades?
0
reply
High Stakes
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#8
Report 3 years ago
#8
(Original post by springconstant)
I have considered the possibility that perhaps, as like in Australia, progression into Msc is possible after undergraduate.
However, looking at Imperial College of London, it seems that entry into their Ms programs requires at least a second class honours-this itself implies that one would have to already be in an honours program(perhaps Imperials is far more prestigious?)

Besides, putting the issue of Msc aside, isn't honours considered to be a 'selective' program only for candidates who have achieved sufficiently good grades?
I'm sorry if I may confuse you - Imperial College London asks for a second class honours - Second class honours refers to the final grade that someone receives after completing an undergraduate course. There is no "selective program" as you put it - Everyone receives a grade:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britis...-class_honours
0
reply
springconstant
Badges: 5
Rep:
?
#9
Report Thread starter 3 years ago
#9
(Original post by High Stakes)
I'm sorry if I may confuse you - Imperial College London asks for a second class honours - Second class honours refers to the final grade that someone receives after completing an undergraduate course. There is no "selective program" as you put it - Everyone receives a grade:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britis...-class_honours
By 'selective program', I meant to imply that only academically inclined students who have been accepted into honours program.

Just to clear the air, what exactly is a honours program in the UK context? I'm under the impression that honours programs are non-existent in the UK.
What is the equivalent grade for a second class honours-(60-69)%?
0
reply
High Stakes
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#10
Report 3 years ago
#10
(Original post by springconstant)
By 'selective program', I meant to imply that only academically inclined students who have been accepted into honours program.

Just to clear the air, what exactly is a honours program in the UK context? I'm under the impression that honours programs are non-existent in the UK.
What is the equivalent grade for a second class honours-(60-69)%?
I researched the Australian system, and came across this from wikipedia:

"The consecutive Australian with Honours degree is usually a one- to two-year research program, after the completion of a Bachelor's degree in the same field. It can also be started as a concurrent program in the fourth year of a four-year bachelor's degree. It is generally considered a postgraduate year because a bachelor's degree can be completed without it.[6] Entry to an Honours degree generally requires proven abilities and a distinction (75% or greater) average in the relevant area or the final year units, and even then is quite competitive."

I see this is what you're referring to. But we don't have this in the UK. There are no honour programs here as far as I'm aware. Also between 60 - 69 % it would graded as an upper-second class degree (2:1).

Princepieman
0
reply
springconstant
Badges: 5
Rep:
?
#11
Report Thread starter 3 years ago
#11
(Original post by High Stakes)
I researched the Australian system, and came across this from wikipedia:

"The consecutive Australian with Honours degree is usually a one- to two-year research program, after the completion of a Bachelor's degree in the same field. It can also be started as a concurrent program in the fourth year of a four-year bachelor's degree. It is generally considered a postgraduate year because a bachelor's degree can be completed without it.[6] Entry to an Honours degree generally requires proven abilities and a distinction (75% or greater) average in the relevant area or the final year units, and even then is quite competitive."

I see this is what you're referring to. But we don't have this in the UK. Also between 60 - 69 % it would graded as an upper-second class degree (2:1).
That in bold is really what is meant by 'selective program'

Alright. Given my current grades being equivalent to an Upper-second class degree, how good is this in the UK and good enough for which Universities?
I will be dropping an email with the Universities soon but a bit on what I am dealing with would be ideal.
0
reply
High Stakes
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#12
Report 3 years ago
#12
(Original post by springconstant)
That in bold is really what is meant by 'selective program'

Alright. Given my current grades being equivalent to an Upper-second class degree, how good is this in the UK and good enough for which Universities?
I will be dropping an email with the Universities soon but a bit on what I am dealing with would be idea.
Upper second class degree is considered very good for most university courses and employers - Although some very competitive courses (Cambridge and Oxford) will sometimes demand a first class degree (>80%).
0
reply
springconstant
Badges: 5
Rep:
?
#13
Report Thread starter 3 years ago
#13
(Original post by High Stakes)
Upper second class degree is considered very good for most university courses and employers - Although some very competitive courses (Cambridge and Oxford) will sometimes demand a first class degree (>80%).
Thanks a lot mate! Imperial is good enough for me. Will be working hard!
0
reply
Princepieman
Badges: 21
Rep:
?
#14
Report 3 years ago
#14
(Original post by High Stakes)
I researched the Australian system, and came across this from wikipedia:

"The consecutive Australian with Honours degree is usually a one- to two-year research program, after the completion of a Bachelor's degree in the same field. It can also be started as a concurrent program in the fourth year of a four-year bachelor's degree. It is generally considered a postgraduate year because a bachelor's degree can be completed without it.[6] Entry to an Honours degree generally requires proven abilities and a distinction (75% or greater) average in the relevant area or the final year units, and even then is quite competitive."

I see this is what you're referring to. But we don't have this in the UK. There are no honour programs here as far as I'm aware. Also between 60 - 69 % it would graded as an upper-second class degree (2:1).

Princepieman
Well we do have them.. But we call them postgraduate diplomas. They effectively act as a bridge for those with unrelated degrees (or unsuitable degree classifications) to move on to a fully fledged Masters programme.

The Aussie system favours specialising through post-undergrad degrees; similar, in many ways, to the US system. So what these 'honours' programmes achieve is equivalent in a sense to someone pursuing an 'integrated Masters' as part of their undergraduate programme of study.
0
reply
springconstant
Badges: 5
Rep:
?
#15
Report Thread starter 3 years ago
#15
(Original post by Princepieman)
Well we do have them.. But we call them postgraduate diplomas. They effectively act as a bridge for those with unrelated degrees (or unsuitable degree classifications) to move on to a fully fledged Masters programme.

The Aussie system favours specialising through post-undergrad degrees; similar, in many ways, to the US system. So what these 'honours' programmes achieve is equivalent in a sense to someone pursuing an 'integrated Masters' as part of their undergraduate programme of study.
Hi

Does Highstake replies still holds water?
0
reply
Princepieman
Badges: 21
Rep:
?
#16
Report 3 years ago
#16
(Original post by springconstant)
Hi

Does Highstake replies still holds water?
Sort of, but he did get one or two things off. A first class degree is usually >70% for instance; it'd be equivalent to your Distinction.

Here's the course that KCL do: http://www.kcl.ac.uk/study/postgradu...-grad-dip.aspx
0
reply
springconstant
Badges: 5
Rep:
?
#17
Report Thread starter 3 years ago
#17
(Original post by Princepieman)
Sort of, but he did get one or two things off. A first class degree is usually >70% for instance; it'd be equivalent to your Distinction.

Here's the course that KCL do: http://www.kcl.ac.uk/study/postgradu...-grad-dip.aspx
So what exactly is the equivalent of 65%(in the AU system) in the UK system?
0
reply
threeportdrift
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#18
Report 3 years ago
#18
(Original post by springconstant)
Hello people,

I'm currently a student in a Group of Eight University in Australia; majoring in Physics and Mathematics.
My current weighted average mark is 65%. GPA is approximately 5.2/7.0.
Beside my core units(or more familiarly, modules) the 4 other empty slots are filled with Economics units(instead of the easy language units)
By definition:
80% and above is a high distinction-7
(70-79)% is a distinction-6
(60-69)% is a credit-5
(50-59)% is a credit pass-4
Anything below 50% is a fail.

Realistically, on the assumption I maintain a GPA of 5.2/7.0, what are my chances of doing honours over at King's? (I'm assuming an honours is a prerequisite for entry into a MSc program in the UK)
I don't think anyone has quite grasped your point. In English and Welsh Universities 'Honours' isn't an extra year, ie the final year, it's the level of the whole course.

Effectively the system you are operating on is the equivalent of final year Sixth form, 1st year undergrad and second year undergrad in the UK. So your grades are largely irrelevant, and there is not likely to be any possibility to transfer into the final, 3rd year.

I'm not aware of any UK universities that allow transfers in the 3rd year to achieve an Honours degree - that's not to say they aren't out there, but they are likely to be the more financially oriented than academic oriented Universities. You will have to ask each one you are interested in about your specific case.
0
reply
Princepieman
Badges: 21
Rep:
?
#19
Report 3 years ago
#19
(Original post by threeportdrift)
I don't think anyone has quite grasped your point. In English and Welsh Universities 'Honours' isn't an extra year, ie the final year, it's the level of the whole course.

Effectively the system you are operating on is the equivalent of final year Sixth form, 1st year undergrad and second year undergrad in the UK. So your grades are largely irrelevant, and there is not likely to be any possibility to transfer into the final, 3rd year.

I'm not aware of any UK universities that allow transfers in the 3rd year to achieve an Honours degree - that's not to say they aren't out there, but they are likely to be the more financially oriented than academic oriented Universities. You will have to ask each one you are interested in about your specific case.
That's not true.. Honours is just another pseudonym for a postgrad diploma or an integrated masters programme.

Aussie degrees are fully fledged degrees, they don't need to 'transfer into third year' for them to be eligible for postgraduate education in the UK.

OP, I've just checked and you could actually go straight for a masters degree if you managed to push your grades into the distinction/high distinction realm.

Posted from TSR Mobile
0
reply
Copperknickers
Badges: 14
Rep:
?
#20
Report 3 years ago
#20
(Original post by Princepieman)
That's not true.. Honours is just another pseudonym for a postgrad diploma or an integrated masters programme.
That is not true, at least for English/Welsh universities. In England and Wales, the degree which you are normally awarded after a traditional 3 year degree is called a BA/BSc with Honours. It is however possible to graduate with an 'ordinary degree' at the end of the 3 years (i.e., without honours) which usually means you did the same classes as everyone else, but failed to achieve a high enough grade, or failed to complete a necessary module (for example in my degree, if you opted not to do a dissertation in your final year, or if you failed it).

But in real terms, you have to perform catastrophically in your exams to fail to achieve Honours, because you are automatically awarded Honours so long as you pass all of your modules and get at least a 2nd Class degree because many if not most Bachelor's degrees here include a compulsory research project for everyone. So Honours is not an elite programme, it's a formality. The end result is the same though: it qualifies you for postgraduate study (although to go to a good university for your Postgrad, you will need not just Honours but high grades as well).

So in other words, the differences between the English and Australian system are:

1. An English undergraduate degree takes 3 years, an Australian undergraduate degree takes 4 years.

2. The Honours programme in English universities is obligatory and not selective, so in real terms 90%+ of all undergrad degrees are Honours degrees. What qualifies you to move onto Postgraduate study is not whether you have Honours, it's whether you have both Honours AND a high enough grade (usually a 1st or high 2:1).

In Scotland things are slightly different, the undergraduate degree is 4 years long and the entire 4th year is considered an Honours year for everyone (technically it is selective because you can choose to leave after the 3rd year, but again, the requirements are so loose that most people will do 4 years and achieve Honours, unless they peform very badly in many of their assessments or decide that they don't need to complete the 4th year for some reason).

In Scotland your undergraduate degree is called a (Scottish) M.A., which is equivalent to an English Bachelor of Arts degree: an English Master of Arts is equivalent to a Scottish Master of Science (for some reason, undergraduate STEM degrees in Scotland are called B.Sc.'s, and postgrad STEM degrees are called M.Sc's, whereas arts/humanities undergrad degrees are called M.A.s, but postgrad arts/humanities degrees are called M.Sc.'s).
0
reply
X

Quick Reply

Attached files
Write a reply...
Reply
new posts
Back
to top
Latest
My Feed

See more of what you like on
The Student Room

You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

Personalise

University open days

  • Trinity Laban Conservatoire of Music and Dance
    Contemporary Dance Undergraduate
    Tue, 19 Nov '19
  • University of Surrey
    All subjects except Veterinary Medicine and Guildford School of Acting Undergraduate
    Wed, 20 Nov '19
  • The University of Law
    Solicitor Series: Discover Your Type of Law - LPC and GDL - Birmingham campus Postgraduate
    Wed, 20 Nov '19

Which party will you be voting for in the General Election?

Conservatives (143)
18.94%
Labour (322)
42.65%
Liberal Democrats (153)
20.26%
Green Party (41)
5.43%
Brexit Party (21)
2.78%
Independent Group for Change (Change UK) (2)
0.26%
SNP (9)
1.19%
Plaid Cymru (6)
0.79%
Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) (1)
0.13%
Sinn Fein (1)
0.13%
SDLP (0)
0%
Ulster Unionist (1)
0.13%
UKIP (7)
0.93%
Other (8)
1.06%
None (40)
5.3%

Watched Threads

View All