The Student Room Group

Ticket touts - scum or entrepreneurs

Having missed the boat last week and subsequently buying a pair of Bon Jovi tickets on ebay this afternoon, I don't know what to think of touts. In the end I actually got them for a really good price (£10 above face value).

Now, do touts provide a service for those who are unable to land tickets?

Or is it because of touts bulk-buying that there are shortages anyway?

What do you think?

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Reply 1
If touts exist it's a sign that either
a) There should be more tickets
b) The price should be higher

As it is, ticket prices for such events are set artificially low so that enjoyment of an artist or band is not restricted to the wealthy, something I agree with. This does unfortunately create a potential for profit to be made by touts.

The shortage would exist with or without the tout, the tout merely changes the criteria by which the tickets are allocated. That is, rather than tickets being allocated on a first come, first served basis, they are allocated by willingness(and ability) to pay.
Reply 2
Touts are neither. They're just guys selling stuff.

As for regulating/banning them, I think for really big festivals and events, like World Cup's, Glastonbury, the Olympics, etc., that's fair enough. Otherwise, why not - at least it gives you opportunity to go to a gig you see advertised the day it's on, which often isn't the case (why the Guardian puts, say, the Killers in their 'on this week' listing, I don't know - unless you knew about it six months in advance, you weren't going to get in).
They are a cancer, and take away the chance of proper fans to see there band/football team/comedy show etc. I have felt it first hand, when thousands of tickets for the FA Cup final fell into the hands of the 'FA Family' in otherwords Touts and meant i missed out.

That said, they still prove a useful source for people who miss out on tickets and would do anything to watch them.

In an ideal world, there would be no touts as supply would outstrip demand. But thats never going to be the case, and ill never lambast a tout as i may need to use him one day.
Reply 4
Ticket touting is fair enough in my opinion.

Equally is organisers limiting ticket sales, giving them on a person specific basis or whatever else to prevent it. Sometimes it can be in their financial interests to do so.

No private individual should be annoyed by ticket touts - they're just taking an opportunity and quite rightly being rewarded from it. You don't have any right to a football/concert ticket or whatever is being offered any more than they do. If you want to be annoyed at somebody, be annoyed at the issuer for they have clearly not got the regard for your custom to try and stop this.
Reply 5
Jaxson
They are a cancer, and take away the chance of proper fans to see there band/football team/comedy show etc. I have felt it first hand, when thousands of tickets for the FA Cup final fell into the hands of the 'FA Family' in otherwords Touts and meant i missed out.

That said, they still prove a useful source for people who miss out on tickets and would do anything to watch them.

In an ideal world, there would be no touts as supply would outstrip demand. But thats never going to be the case, and ill never lambast a tout as i may need to use him one day.


Someone willing to pay thousands for a ticket is not a real fan?

I would imagine very often they are - they're just a richer fan.

I dont think poverty is a necessary part of being a "fan"
Reply 6
ticket touts are abusing the ticket system, the artists want people buying tickets for their gig to be genuine fans that will simply be buying the ticket for themselves and freinds and go to the gig.

Ticket touts are just profiteering, making it hard for genuine (but poor) people to get tickets and making it easier for rich (but less devoted) people to get them.

I would think the artists would prefer their tickets made it to the die-hard fans rather than rich "buy it and see it on the day" types. It makes no difference to them financially.

I'm sure some sort of system could be introduced to reduce the scale of ticket touting.
Reply 7
Zebedee
making it hard for genuine (but poor) people to get tickets and making it easier for rich (but less devoted) people to get them.



How exactly do you know that "rich" people are less devoted?
Reply 8
Zebedee
ticket touts are abusing the ticket system, the artists want people buying tickets for their gig to be genuine fans that will simply be buying the ticket for themselves and freinds and go to the gig.

Ticket touts are just profiteering, making it hard for genuine (but poor) people to get tickets and making it easier for rich (but less devoted) people to get them.

I would think the artists would prefer their tickets made it to the die-hard fans rather than rich "buy it and see it on the day" types. It makes no difference to them financially.

I'm sure some sort of system could be introduced to reduce the scale of ticket touting.


Well, yes, you'd have to make everybody registering and submitting a picture for a gig or Football match.

Personally, I think having big events protected in the way that Glastonbury was this year is a good idea, but it's both a hassle and pointless to do it for smaller events. Not to mention, I personally quite like having the option of being able to go down to the venue and get a ticket on the night (admittedly for a slightly inflated price)...
Reply 9
There's also an element of risk involved with touting. Often touts buy tickets and can't shift them, and settle for a price below the tickets' face value.

Is this good for 'genuine' fans?
Reply 10
Lawz-
How exactly do you know that "rich" people are less devoted?


thats not what i said, i said that ticket touting enables less devoted fans to get tickets. (less devoted because they did not buy them months in advance). Because the ticket touts inflate the price then this means the rich are the ones that can afford these tickets.

An analogy for this would be if 1000 people were queining for signatures, if a person got a job lot of 100 then they could go sell them to rich people and then the rich people would not have to wait.

The poor have no choice, either they compete with the touts for tickets or they don't go. Which isn't very fair.
Reply 11
Good point I suppose.
Reply 12
I don't quite see why 'devotion' should be the prime factor in decidind how 'worthy' you are to get a gig ticket...
Reply 13
Its not quite the same as selling to the highest bidder. Ticket touts are like hoarders.

If the water stopped flowing in your taps tomorrow the best solution for everyone would be for people to buy what they needed and no more for the lowest possible price.

I would be annoyed if in the small time before i realised the taps diddn't work and the time i went to buy water that all the water had been bought by a few individuals who could not use anywhere near that much themselves. They then would have a monopoly to sell the water back to me at pretty much any price.

So i guess what i am really objecting to here is the creation of a monopoly. Ticket touts by so many tickets that the number of suppliers is vastly smaller than the number of buyers so the economic power is concentrated in the hands of these few people who are then able to excessively profit through their stranglehold on supply.

I object to this because i think that generally people should only consume what they need themselves. Buying vast amounts in order to rip people off is exploitation.
Reply 14
Zebedee
thats not what i said, i said that ticket touting enables less devoted fans to get tickets. (less devoted because they did not buy them months in advance). Because the ticket touts inflate the price then this means the rich are the ones that can afford these tickets.

An analogy for this would be if 1000 people were queining for signatures, if a person got a job lot of 100 then they could go sell them to rich people and then the rich people would not have to wait.

The poor have no choice, either they compete with the touts for tickets or they don't go. Which isn't very fair.

You could apply the same 'devoted fan' logic to whether they had access to the tickets in the first place. By issuing tickets solely on the internet you discriminate against those devoted fans who don't have access to it or who are unable to be available for the few minutes they're on sale at some God forsaken hour of the night. By ring-fencing tickets for certain special interest groups you discriminate against non-members who might be more 'devoted'.

Either way, someone's determined enough to pay above headline. Let them. (Whether that's because they missed out first time and are really devoted or just because they're rich, it doesn't matter.)
Reply 15
As I say, I think a happy medium is the right way forward. On events where there is really serious interest - such as Glastonbury and so on, where you get hundreds of thousands of people wanting to buy tickets, then they should be protected by means of registration schemes, etc.

But on smaller events, why bother?
Reply 16
well, it does matter. Because i would imagine the bands would rather the genuine fans have the tickets. All bands want to treat their hardcore fans well, the hardcore fans are the ones that spread the word, listen to the music the most, go to gigs, buy the merchandise etc.

The thing is the band does not benefit from ticket touting, because the ticket tout is the middle man. The inflated price does not to go the band but is profit for the ticket tout.

So, ticket touting gives no advantage to the band because:

a) It means less hardcore fans can go
b) It doesn't give them any extra money, infact possibly less because a genuine fan is probably more likely to see them many times.

For the genuine fan ticket touting means they are forced to get up at an un-godly hour in order to compete with a few bulk-buyers.

So neither of the two "important" IMO groups benefit from this, the only beneficiaries are the touts and the lesser fans, who are usually richer as they can afford the inflated price.

Also touting creates a monopoly, which is surely allways bad for the free-market.

for smaller events alastair i agree that the hassle makes it inpractical
Reply 17
My final thought before I go out (to a club I don't have to get a ticket tout for because I work there :p:) is that even without ticket touting, most really popular gigs would still sell out within a few hours of going on sale...
Reply 18
well, true. But that doesn't excuse ticket touting or answer the question in the thread.

I like my hoarding analogy, it technically legal but its exploitative and is not equal across society - i.e not everyone has a fair chance to do it. So the rich get richer, the poor get poorer.

Have a good night.:smile:
Reply 19
Zebedee
well, it does matter. Because i would imagine the bands would rather the genuine fans have the tickets. All bands want to treat their hardcore fans well, the hardcore fans are the ones that spread the word, listen to the music the most, go to gigs, buy the merchandise etc.

The thing is the band does not benefit from ticket touting, because the ticket tout is the middle man. The inflated price does not to go the band but is profit for the ticket tout.

So, ticket touting gives no advantage to the band because:

a) It means less hardcore fans can go
b) It doesn't give them any extra money, infact possibly less because a genuine fan is probably more likely to see them many times.

For the genuine fan ticket touting means they are forced to get up at an un-godly hour in order to compete with a few bulk-buyers.

So neither of the two "important" IMO groups benefit from this, the only beneficiaries are the touts and the lesser fans, who are usually richer as they can afford the inflated price.

Also touting creates a monopoly, which is surely allways bad for the free-market.

for smaller events alastair i agree that the hassle makes it inpractical

The bands just want a decent atmosphere for a good gig. Evidently touts don't harm that too much or there would be more Glastonbury-esk restrictions.

They could always ring-fence tickets for members of their official fan club if they're really going to be anal about it.

Anyway, I still don't see how 'willing to pay more' = 'less devoted'. Or even 'usually equals'. How can the 'rich and curious' possibly outnumber the 'determined and willing to save'?