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    (Original post by Unistudent77)
    I don't believe all wildlife is equal to us. However, most importantly i believe my aim in life is to make myself and others happy. I like milk, so i'm drinking it. I have more sympathy re slaughter... But again, as long as efforts are made (a constant battle but i think in recent decades thinks have improved) to make this experience as quick as possible then so be it.
    I do agree that animals aren't equal to us, I don't believe in animal rights and though didn't identify as vegan for quite some time because of how different my views are from most vegans so typical non-representative disclaimer.

    I also agree in happiness as an ultimate goal. To me moral good=causing happiness. Moral bad= causing harm. I think the difference is probably I prioritise not causing harm over causing happiness and you sound vice versa

    You said 'to any extent', that's proposterous!
    I can't see where I said 'to any extent' so no idea what you are talking about

    Yes, perceptions are skewed. Skewed away from the fact that 60% of UK males over 20 are overweight.
    'Normal', 'society' is all BS and underwhelming.
    Facebook is full of fads or people being narcisstic af cos they did one workout. As well as this, our society (unfortunately) is very, very image focussed. We are self-obsessed (as a society, you may not be but 'we', as a collective, are).

    Thus, being big and ripped would boost one's image. Respect etc. As well as (in my view is the best way) having that without telling the world. I know that if i went to the beach over summer people would (in the future) would be like 'wtf'. I wouldn't boost about it, i wouldn't need to.
    I guess it is there both ways. Like people in my office seem to not be aware they have guts they'd do well to loose because the perception of what counts as fat is skewed. But equally, there's a very unhealthy culture amongst young guys in gyms who think they are horribly fat at 15% and tiny when they look big to normal people.

    I think ultimately, looks are far too fragile to place much value on for self-esteem etc. Whilst they are not mutually exclusive by any means, far too often what happens is looks/getting big is valued above health and fitness

    Most importantly, it is about progression. For me, it is good for my mental health. I could gain muscle at 3lbs a year i reckon i'd be happy (when the gains slow anyway) as it isn't about vanity, it's just about progression and feeling positive about one's self. If i stalled (when i'm not near my max) then i wouldn't be happy.
    I think you are in the minority then of guys who train with a looks focus, most have an ideal they want to achieve and everything short of that is **** so progress doesn't matter, just achieving the goal. But often that goal keeps moving so they never really achieve it.

    Basically, there's a lot of stuff going in young guys heads around lifting that is not good for mental health but focusing on progression is more healthy IMO. But for me there's more interesting things to progress in but now I just enjoy the process rather than specifically caring about the outcome
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    (Original post by BKS;[url="tel:62395895")
    62395895[/url]]I do agree that animals aren't equal to us, I don't believe in animal rights and though didn't identify as vegan for quite some time because of how different my views are from most vegans so typical non-representative disclaimer.

    I also agree in happiness as an ultimate goal. To me moral good=causing happiness. Moral bad= causing harm. I think the difference is probably I prioritise not causing harm over causing happiness and you sound vice versa
    Right ok... I expected to be slated for what i'd said so i do find your reply to be unexpected - in a good way

    I agree 100% about your last part. I think that nails it tbh.

    I can't see where I said 'to any extent' so no idea what you are talking about
    I have since edited my post, my mistake. You said 'regardless of extent' or something v similar. So i was basically saying where do you draw the line etc but it's fine.


    I guess it is there both ways. Like people in my office seem to not be aware they have guts they'd do well to loose because the perception of what counts as fat is skewed. But equally, there's a very unhealthy culture amongst young guys in gyms who think they are horribly fat at 15% and tiny when they look big to normal people.
    Agree. I don't get how people 'don't notice'... It perplexes me. Like some people geuninely don't seem to notice.
    Others moan and moan but do nothing about it (the worst kind of people). I suppose that's true. I blame social media. My newsfeed is filled with 'trainers' offering classes, promising '8 week transformations' etc. As wel as that you have the tatted up guy who is good looking and on juice with his top off. Shredded tf. Advertising a protein supplement and some of my friends 'like' the person in question.
    It's a huge industry now. Even girls (nothing wrong with this) have 'liked' go nutrition and myprotein etc etc. Just goes to show how huge the gym movement is.... The pressure to look good is huge. Frankly, i do have the desire/drive to keep at it so i intend on not letting go. Although, as i said 'looks' won't keep you going to the gym for 95% of people. Sure, a motivator ie people comment the night before and you hit the gym with renewed vigour. Fine. But when it's pouring, snowy, you feel a bit meh, cba, busy etc you need other drivers imo. Those are the drug like effects post gym. The self-praise you give yourself, progression, self-reflection you can get, vision - the bigger picture, what your goals are etc, music can get you in that zone, I could go on....
    I'm not saying i don't ever want to quit mid-set or before a set but normally i can get in the right frame of mind/power through and that is certainly not through 'looks'.
    Some days i really like lifting, others it's just what i do.

    I think ultimately, looks are far too fragile to place much value on for self-esteem etc. Whilst they are not mutually exclusive by any means, far too often what happens is looks/getting big is valued above health and fitness
    Agree wholeheartedly but that's easier said than done. I do everything in my power to improve myself and then once i've done that i just go with it.

    Depends how you define 'healthy' and 'fit'? I mean if you lift (certainly body builder types) would surely on average be more likely to eat a bit of fruit and veg occasionally, more than joe bloggs? I do chuck some cardio in, play football etc so.... I'd say that's enough tbh (for me anyway)

    I think you are in the minority then of guys who train with a looks focus, most have an ideal they want to achieve and everything short of that is **** so progress doesn't matter, just achieving the goal. But often that goal keeps moving so they never really achieve it.

    Basically, there's a lot of stuff going in young guys heads around lifting that is not good for mental health but focusing on progression is more healthy IMO. But for me there's more interesting things to progress in but now I just enjoy the process rather than specifically caring about the outcome
    Probably true sadly.
    I've looked into steroids/genetic max a fair bit so i know what is achievable body wise, what i'm loosely aiming for (shorter term goals as well as 5-10
    years down the road)...

    I think some guys have no clue. Or become impatient. Or have a serious mental health problem. Or all three.

    Idk. It's hard sometimes but you just have to work on 'you'. I don't seek validation, or attention. Just maybe some respect.
    Although, it doesn't help that in recent months girls i've been with all comment on the muscle (which is minimal but better than average Joe), as that makes you judge your attractiveness on muscle as opposed to how you are as a person.
    Meh, it's a dog eat dog world out there. I asked a friend of mine if he was planning on going to Ibiza in the bear future. He said 'nah, all the big guys go there. Don't think i'd like it'

    My gut instinct is to get big if i thought that. Either you shy away or you join them. I choose the latter (in moderation - mentally)
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    Been so incredibly stressed at work. Everything's fallen apart.

    Comfort eating again. Anyway, it's not last year levels and I cooked most days. It's just I have had chocolate bars galore. At least I went back to the gym this week and today was fairly balanced diet-wise. I'll do a food shop tomorrow and bought sandwich filler today so won't need to go to the shop at break.
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    Got thrown onto someones foot during training which has caused a bruise on my lower back :dry:
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    (Original post by Kvothe the arcane)
    Been so incredibly stressed at work. Everything's fallen apart.

    Comfort eating again. Anyway, it's not last year levels and I cooked most days. It's just I have had chocolate bars galore. At least I went back to the gym this week and today was fairly balanced diet-wise. I'll do a food shop tomorrow and bought sandwich filler today so won't need to go to the shop at break.
    Not being funny but if you can't resist eating lots of chocolate then you're seriously weak willed. That or you don't even want to lose weight and better yourself. Man up. If you don't buy it, you can't choose to eat it. (Generally).

    Stress at work is just another excuse, and not a good one at that. Chocolate won't help your work.
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    My posts in this thread are getting a silly length :lol:
    (Original post by Unistudent77)
    It's a huge industry now.
    I don't think it can all be put down to that. How many of us here know better than that? It's not like we're a collection of geniuses to work it out. Most of us are probably somewhat more educated but still, not rocket science. People are lazy and want the easy fix, the industry takes advantage of that but they didn't create it

    Depends how you define 'healthy' and 'fit'? I mean if you lift (certainly body builder types) would surely on average be more likely to eat a bit of fruit and veg occasionally, more than joe bloggs? I do chuck some cardio in, play football etc so.... I'd say that's enough tbh (for me anyway)
    We all pick up injuries and a lot of guys deal with the stupidly. Most have terrible micronutrition on a typical bro diet, they seem to get that you should eat some veg but not that having broccoli twice a day and nothing else doesn't really count. Flexibility and mobility, I'd be interesting to go round a gym and see how many guys can touch their toes.

    Meh, it's a dog eat dog world out there. I asked a friend of mine if he was planning on going to Ibiza in the bear future. He said 'nah, all the big guys go there. Don't think i'd like it'

    My gut instinct is to get big if i thought that. Either you shy away or you join them. I choose the latter (in moderation - mentally)
    I really don't understand why you'd give a **** how big some guys who happen to be there are. Why would shy away or join them be the only options?

    (Original post by Slowbro93)
    Got thrown onto someones foot during training which has caused a bruise on my lower back :dry:
    I have bruises on my forearm and shoulder from training with a guy one below black belt who kept missing the pad :facepalm:

    (Original post by Kvothe the arcane)
    Been so incredibly stressed at work. Everything's fallen apart.

    Comfort eating again. Anyway, it's not last year levels and I cooked most days. It's just I have had chocolate bars galore. At least I went back to the gym this week and today was fairly balanced diet-wise. I'll do a food shop tomorrow and bought sandwich filler today so won't need to go to the shop at break.
    It sounds more like you are making progress in dealing with stress better which really isn't everything falling apart
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    (Original post by ProteinKing)
    Not being funny but if you can't resist eating lots of chocolate then you're seriously weak willed. That or you don't even want to lose weight and better yourself. Man up. If you don't buy it, you can't choose to eat it. (Generally).

    Stress at work is just another excuse, and not a good one at that. Chocolate won't help your work.

    I've had some days where I've not slept. There's been a lot to do and I have study and other commitments too. It's not an excuse which is why I'm making changes. If I were merely making excuses for my behaviour, do you think I'd mention it and then make the decision to stop? There have been occasions where I bought the stuff, but in the majority of occasions it was offered to me. Yes, I'm weak willed. This is why I'm obese. If I had no motivation problems, then I'd probably have a six pack. Please don't take my reply as offence. None is taken but I'm not sure if you thought you're being helpful?

    (Original post by BKS)
    It sounds more like you are making progress in dealing with stress better which really isn't everything falling apart
    True. I'm hovering around the starting weight for the competition. I know I won't win it but hoping I can continue to make some progress.

    (despite my weight gain, my pants are fitting smaller and I have to buy another belt so perhaps I need to start doing tape measurements if I can be bothered. Also, while I'm beginning to notice the weight of my exercises, warmup sets with bar or mid-heavy bar are beginning to feel light as anything so I am feeling stronger so there is progress. I'm also able to jog down the stairs and to the bus stop without panting which is another small accomplishment)
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    (Original post by BKS;[url="tel:62403935")
    62403935[/url]]My posts in this thread are getting a silly length :lol:
    i'm the worst for rambling. Succinct and me just do not go

    I don't think it can all be put down to that. How many of us here know better than that? It's not like we're a collection of geniuses to work it out. Most of us are probably somewhat more educated but still, not rocket science. People are lazy and want the easy fix, the industry takes advantage of that but they didn't create it
    Well i'm not sure exactly what my point was when talking about the 'industry'. I think i more meant if you look on social media etc etc it's everywhere. '1kg of whey protein for £x' are the usual ads. That add by 'protein world' that is on tv. It is targetting our age group hard. All my friends have ventured into a gym before, most pick it up and leave it but still... Some regularly train and a few guys i know have used steroids. So the concept of the gym being part of society is very much being pushed right now.

    Yeah, it's all about effort imo. All the information is online, the progress will come if you train consistently which most people don't. They quit. Or start-stop, start-stop.

    We all pick up injuries and a lot of guys deal with the stupidly. Most have terrible micronutrition on a typical bro diet, they seem to get that you should eat some veg but not that having broccoli twice a day and nothing else doesn't really count. Flexibility and mobility, I'd be interesting to go round a gym and see how many guys can touch their toes.
    True but the average person doesn't eat well either. If i average 4 a day i'd be surprised. Typically i manage 3 i think, lots of fish and meat, plenty carbs, i avoid fizzy drinks as far as possible and drink an unhealthy quantity of milk. Good enough for me... Maybe once i get a job and have some coin i'll eat a bit better but i'd say i eat a lot better than my flatmates (not that this is some kind of achievement haha)

    Well i used to barely be able to go beyond my ankles (yes, that inflexible!) before lifting and can now (quite excrutiating to do so) touch my toes. My friends can put a full palm on the floor but whatever. Why does touching your toes matter?
    I mean, for me i'd use football as a decent meter. A fair few of the guys i play with are fatter and taller than me so i don't always win but shoulder to shoulder i can hold my own against a much bigger guy.
    I'm naturally slow but i'm in shape that enables me to be mediocre.
    Most crucially, as the game goes on i keep running. I play with and against boys who play junior level (they get paid for playing) so we're talking a decent level. One guy played against the team who is playing Celtic very soon. I'm mediocre af at football but i run and run and run and get stuck in and i get by.
    So i would define that as 'healthy', flexibility is another factor too. All of it adds together to create a picture... No?

    I really don't understand why you'd give a **** how big some guys who happen to be there are. Why would shy away or join them be the only options?
    Yeah, i agree. His words, not mine. Point is, if i felt like him i would lift as opposed to avoid going.

    I just think it would be really cool to achieve something noteworthy. Something significant. If i'm putting all this effort in, i want something out of it.
    I suppose that's where we differ as you view 'lifting' as a hobby, you really enjoy it as a sport. Whereas, it's more lifestyle/part of my routine, for me. It isn't my sport.
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    (Original post by Slowbro93)
    Eaten another tub of ice cream again :erm:
    I did the same today :/ not particularly great - but at least it was instead of two meals and over a few hours! I was very ill yesterday and have been at my desk revising all day today, and the ease of access to ice cream was too much!


    (Original post by Kvothe the arcane)
    Been so incredibly stressed at work. Everything's fallen apart.

    Comfort eating again. Anyway, it's not last year levels and I cooked most days. It's just I have had chocolate bars galore. At least I went back to the gym this week and today was fairly balanced diet-wise. I'll do a food shop tomorrow and bought sandwich filler today so won't need to go to the shop at break.
    I just wanted to say - solidarity :jumphug:

    I understand how difficult it can be to focus on eating healthily and working out when you're under a lot of stress. Particularly if you struggle with weight and are having to break bad habits. I've struggled with my weight for years, and although I admit I probably am quite weak-willed, I think a lot of people misjudge how difficult it can be to start losing weight when you're so set in your habits. Plus there's the added issues some people face of exercising in front of others. I'm very aware of how bad I look when I exercise because of how unfit I am, and this puts me off a lot because of embarrassment.

    But I'm sending you lots of support we can all do this if we keep persevering and don't give up in the face of set-backs!
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    (Original post by futureisbright;[url="tel:62408521")
    62408521[/url]]
    I understand how difficult it can be to focus on eating healthily and working out when you're under a lot of stress. Particularly if you struggle with weight and are having to break bad habits. I've struggled with my weight for years, and although I admit I probably am quite weak-willed, I think a lot of people misjudge how difficult it can be to start losing weight when you're so set in your habits. Plus there's the added issues some people face of exercising in front of others. I'm very aware of how bad I look when I exercise because of how unfit I am, and this puts me off a lot because of embarrassment.

    But I'm sending you lots of support we can all do this if we keep persevering and don't give up in the face of set-backs!
    This is the issue. When you get in a rut and it seems like you have a mountain to climb it's pretty tough.
    You just have to really go for it for a few weeks and after a month of weightloss you could allow yourself one day a week with a takeaway (but don't go ott) and keep it going that way. I think people go from eating what they want, to eating a ridiculously tough diet which inevitably leads to failure. This is all 'my opinion', i accept that i've not had to lose significant weight before so might be totally wrong but my view is if you can keep it managable and consistent (ups and downs will happen) then you will make good progress without failing
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    Still ill... Although better. Not gym good though, i'm still broken.
    Hoping i can be back on it by Wednesday with renewed vigour. Very annoying but hardly that bad. Not happy
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    (Original post by Unistudent77)
    True but the average person doesn't eat well either. If i average 4 a day i'd be surprised. Typically i manage 3 i think, lots of fish and meat, plenty carbs, i avoid fizzy drinks as far as possible and drink an unhealthy quantity of milk. Good enough for me... Maybe once i get a job and have some coin i'll eat a bit better but i'd say i eat a lot better than my flatmates (not that this is some kind of achievement haha)
    Yeah, average is so **** it's not a worthwhile comparison I think 5 a day should be considered a minimum, in other countries they aim for higher. I just find it funny that you get guys caring so much about their macros with no regard at all for micro

    Well i used to barely be able to go beyond my ankles (yes, that inflexible!) before lifting and can now (quite excrutiating to do so) touch my toes. My friends can put a full palm on the floor but whatever. Why does touching your toes matter?
    Ankles isn't even than bad, I see people barely past their knees fairly often- not even exaggerating.

    Not touching your toes specifically really but a basic level of flexibility in general. Being able to do things like touch your toes is basic functionality, we just loose it from sitting on our arses all day. If you don't have proper mobility then you're more likely to get injured. Looking after your mobility throughout your life will do you a lot of favours when you're old too

    But yeah, part of a wider picture but most guys in gyms don't get that, they care about more muscle and nothing more
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    (Original post by BKS;[url="tel:62414543")
    62414543[/url]]Yeah, average is so **** it's not a worthwhile comparison I think 5 a day should be considered a minimum, in other countries they aim for higher. I just find it funny that you get guys caring so much about their macros with no regard at all for micro
    Fair enough, i get what you're saying...
    I don't take myself that seriously. Well, it's kind of a contradiction. I do try hard 95% of the time, hit protein target, calories and try and get a veg and fruit in, no fizzy drinks, some
    Cardio as well as religiously hit the gym etc etc but i'll happily go for a night out and get very drunk and/or have 'cheat' meals here and there. But yeah, some people's views of a good diet is warped, when you start classing ketchup as 1 of your 5 a day you know your struggling haha.

    Ankles isn't even than bad, I see people barely past their knees fairly often- not even exaggerating.

    Not touching your toes specifically really but a basic level of flexibility in general. Being able to do things like touch your toes is basic functionality, we just loose it from sitting on our arses all day. If you don't have proper mobility then you're more likely to get injured. Looking after your mobility throughout your life will do you a lot of favours when you're old too

    But yeah, part of a wider picture but most guys in gyms don't get that, they care about more muscle and nothing more
    Wtf. Are these people really overweight, who can't get below knees? That's a joke.

    Well i used to be inflexible af but i have improved. Stretching before and after the gym has helped i think. Squatting has too.

    Well most guys are 100% on appearance. Which i do get but i would like the all round package. No real point being 180lbs lean if you can't jog 100 yards.... Not saying i'm Mo Farah but i do like to retain some fitness levels even if they are secondary to lifting.
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    (Original post by Unistudent77)
    Wtf. Are these people really overweight, who can't get below knees? That's a joke.
    Some are a bit squishy round the edges but not proper fat but some a skinny too. I'd say most of the people we have start training at my club start around mid-shin if they've not been active since they were kids (which is probably the majority). And we're a uni club so we're mostly talking 18-21 years old

    People don't move much so they loose the ability really quick though they will all get to their toes within a few months if they even put in a little effort.
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    I'm back.


    Will post some update pics this week. Will also try and get some PB vids up, most likely bench or deadlift.
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    (Original post by BKS;[url="tel:62419345")
    62419345[/url]]Some are a bit squishy round the edges but not proper fat but some a skinny too. I'd say most of the people we have start training at my club start around mid-shin if they've not been active since they were kids (which is probably the majority). And we're a uni club so we're mostly talking 18-21 years old

    People don't move much so they loose the ability really quick though they will all get to their toes within a few months if they even put in a little effort.
    That's quite ridiculous tbh and sad.
    It must be frustrating to teach these people (not all).... The more you know the easier it is to get annoyed with beginners/people who think they know what they are talking about imo, certainly with the horses i can't deal with most 'local' level people. Be that attitide, repeated mistakes etc. Some have way more money than us and yet waste it all. Certainly amongst my non-lifting friends (but who are sporty) talk some absolute **** in relation to training, nutrition etc etc. I just try my best to ignore it or very calmly question them on why they think that but i usually let it go as i don't want an argument or to be 'that guy'.
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    (Original post by Unistudent77)
    That's quite ridiculous tbh and sad.
    It must be frustrating to teach these people (not all).... The more you know the easier it is to get annoyed with beginners/people who think they know what they are talking about imo, certainly with the horses i can't deal with most 'local' level people. Be that attitide, repeated mistakes etc. Some have way more money than us and yet waste it all. Certainly amongst my non-lifting friends (but who are sporty) talk some absolute **** in relation to training, nutrition etc etc. I just try my best to ignore it or very calmly question them on why they think that but i usually let it go as i don't want an argument or to be 'that guy'.
    I think martial arts are pretty unique in putting people in their place (ignoring McDojo issues). You come in and wear a white belt, it literally signifies that you know **** all.

    I'm quite entitled to offer a white belt unsolicited advice and they are being stupid if they don't listen. Equally I am aware it'd be well out of line to give a black belt advice though if they are someone I know then I can make a polite suggestion.

    People who can't deal with that don't tend to last long in any martial art so you usually (and should) end up with an environment that is a nice break from that BS
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    Any regular runners? I was out on a run today and all of a sudden I felt a pulling pain in my ankle which forced me to stop. It's subsided after walking for a few minutes but then started again when I started running. I'm putting it down to poor technique. Any ideas?
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    (Original post by LadySmythe)
    Any regular runners? I was out on a run today and all of a sudden I felt a pulling pain in my ankle which forced me to stop. It's subsided after walking for a few minutes but then started again when I started running. I'm putting it down to poor technique. Any ideas?

    If you don't already, try foam rolling before/after exercise. When I get problems with my calves I tend to get problems with ankles and feet as well. Tried foam rolling few weeks back and all my pain has gone
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    Fair few miles done last week, including climbing a mountain with college! Mile run completed this afternoon
 
 
 
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