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Corbyn refers to ISIS' "strong points" and alludes to giving up Falklands Watch

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    (Original post by EtherealNymph22)
    Lol yeah when you don't have a response just throw out a really pathetic jibe! I'm cool with that. That's better then all the rhetoric that I usually get.
    So you have you? Where? Because I have - in one of the most deprived boroughs in London - and evidence for him connecting with people was very scarce on the ground. And he has more support in London than the rest of the country - apparently in Yorkshire it's even worse. The whole of my partners family - lifelong labour voters - won't vote for him. My dad works for a trade union and is struggling to get behind the bloke! It was tough enough under Miliband but now...
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    (Original post by redferry)
    Yeah, I don't want to leave because I don't want the labour party to die and also I want to keep my internal voting rights (I'm a delegate for my constituency). Plus I want to engage with campaigning around the EU referendum.

    But for most they're either leaving or, as I am, taking more of a back seat until this blows over. Well step in on big decisions, for example if anyone tries to deselect our MP but mostly were leaving the newbies /returnees to get on with it.

    Unfortunateley in many constituencies they aren't stepping up to the mark, or in many cases are absent altogether.
    So what's your view on the Pat McFadden episode? How has it gone down with party members? I was under the impression he was well-regarded.
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    (Original post by redferry)
    So you have you? Where? Because I have - in one of the most deprived boroughs in London - and evidence for him connecting with people was very scarce on the ground. And he has more support in London than the rest of the country - apparently in Yorkshire it's even worse. The whole of my partners family - lifelong labour voters - won't vote for him. My dad works for a trade union and is struggling to get behind the bloke! It was tough enough under Miliband but now...
    I suggested you just take a read of the FB comments. That doesn't mean I don't talk to people and engage with them. In fact I've spoken to some Tory voters who, despite not agreeing with Corbyn's ideology and policies, like him as a person and think he is good for democracy.

    I never once said that people agree with his views on domestic and foreign policy. I'm not even saying I do. Im just saying I think he is a decent and genuine person and even if some of the things he does are treated like a joke by the media, he's a good and selfless person.
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    (Original post by redferry)
    Where are these progressives? Certainly not leafleting or out on the doorstep that's for sure. The only corbyn supporters we have coming to meeting are returning members from before Blair.

    You think you don't need us but the truth is most of these new members are putting in nothing but their three quid to support the labour party.

    Ain't noone ousting my MP.
    I pray your MP is ousted and as someone with close links to momentum, I would not be so sure your MP or any MP (that opposes Corbyn's agenda ofcourse) is safe.

    If you were a true Labour voter you would support Jeremy's beliefs and policies.

    Like it or not, the Labour Party is changing and while I respect the work you have done, we do not need or want your support if you are opposed to Corbyn.


    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    It would be great to get a lot of those terrible Labour MPs who fellow-travel with the Right out of office. A fair number were ditched by the electorate but there are still some left unfortunately.
    Majority of Labour MPs supported Jeremy on the Syria issue for example. We are slowly getting there. We just need to push the other Labour MPs out. There are movements in place to facilitate the process, do not worry.
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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    So what's your view on the Pat McFadden episode? How has it gone down with party members? I was under the impression he was well-regarded.
    Noone seems to really care tbh. Non corbyn supporters are so emotionally destroyed all they can do is sit back and laugh (it was the particular interview in question that finally broke me - my politics are fairly left wing so I was hoping, however unlikely, I'd be wrong and Jezza would do a good job. Somehow I mated to cling to that til last week. I think it was being out canvassing on the day that did it) and most corbyn supporters seem to have little idea who he is or what's even going on in the party.
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    (Original post by EtherealNymph22)
    I suggested you just take a read of the FB comments. That doesn't mean I don't talk to people and engage with them. In fact I've spoken to some Tory voters who, despite not agreeing with Corbyn's ideology and policies, like him as a person and think he is good for democracy.

    I never once said that people agree with his views on domestic and foreign policy. I'm not even saying I do. Im just saying I think he is a decent and genuine person and even if some of the things he does are treated like a joke by the media, he's a good and selfless person.
    Social media is an echo chamber not a representative sample. It is inevitably inherently biased. While we're at it, so are people that write to their MP. This 'evidence' is worth pretty much nothing because of said bias (unless it is to echo your own views back at you - it's very good for that)

    Of course Tory voters love him, their laughing their assess off at us!

    No what you're saying is he's connecting with normal people. I'm telling you he's alienating them (although my sample.is biased in favour of labour voters also as they're more likely to talk to you on the doorstep)
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    (Original post by Squirrel777)
    I pray your MP is ousted and as someone with close links to momentum, I would not be so sure your MP or any MP (that opposes Corbyn's agenda ofcourse) is safe.

    If you were a true Labour voter you would support Jeremy's beliefs and policies.

    Like it or not, the Labour Party is changing and while I respect the work you have done, we do not need or want your support if you are opposed to Corbyn
    That's like saying new members aren't true members because they only support the party for corbyn and not regardless of leadership. That isnt how politics work. It's more about choosing the party closest to your beliefs, which despite Jezzas best efforts remains the labour party. The labour party has always been a broad church and should remain as such. When the corbyn hype inevitably blows over we should seek to retain current members (if the party hasn't died).

    My MP is safe. She's in a very good position and is well liked by both sides of the party. Her constituency would never allow her to be deselected as even a number of corbynites like her. I could potentially see her as the next leader - she's very good.
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    (Original post by EtherealNymph22)
    You're so far into your own opinions that my efforts would literally be wasted on you.

    I will just say this- Irrelevant of his policies he is a decent human being. He connects with a lot of people in a way that the public school and Oxford educated Torys will never be able to do- read the comments on his Facebook page posts. They aren't from lefties going yes Jeremy finally. They are from normal people saying they used to hate politics and how politicians acted in their bubble of comfort and wealth and Corbyn had enlightened them and engaged them that politics can be about people.

    Regarding the typical Tory, especially the leadership- Their education might mean they have more rational policies, and they are more tactful, but it doesn't make them decent human beings in the same way that Corbyn is.
    What, and being a decent human being is a sufficient condition to be PM? Of course it isn't. Especially when one is associated with decidedly indecent politics and political characters.

    Jesus Christ

    I don't understand how you don't get that Jeremy Corbyn's Facebook page doesn't represent Britain. He is hideously unpopular and thanks to his enlightened leadership, the party he leads has enjoyed precisely zero poll leads.
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    (Original post by RegencyTwink)
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a6817181.html

    What planet does this man come from that he'd go on about ISIS "strong points"? What strong points does he and the Corbynites claim they have? Really, I'd like to know

    It's also entirely consistent with his history of sucking up to fascist dictators that he would side with the Argentine military fascist junta over British democracy.

    To the extent anybody can be called the native population of the Falklands, it is the people who live there now. There was no aborigine population, and Argentina (which became a nation-state after the Falklands was populated by British) has no serious claim to it.

    The Falkland Islanders voted something like 99% to 1% to stay associated with the UK, and yet Corbyn would override their self-determination and hand them over to a banana republic
    Corbyn is Labours worst enemy and the Tories best friend.

    Whist we should all unite behind labour to oppose the cruel benefit reforms and nasty cruel policies of Ian Duncan Smith, and the Tories support of the rich at the cost of the poor, disabled etc, labour fails to unite people and only attract ridicule when it comes to stupid moronic attitudes such as ISIS's strong points or Giving up the Falklands.

    Seriously labour get rid of Corbyn because while he is making labour an unelectable laughing stock, millions of disabled poor and vulnerable people are being left destitute by nasty IDS removing and sanctioning their benefits and that will go on beyond the 2020 election and get worse now as the Tories have no effective opposition to beat them!

    Labour is letting the most vulnerable in society down. Get rid of Corbyn and get a leader who can actually win elections liberating these people from the mercy of the cruel nasty IDS!

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    (Original post by Ambitious1999)
    Corbyn is Labours worst enemy and the Tories best friend.

    Whist we should all unite behind labour to oppose the cruel benefit reforms and nasty cruel policies of Ian Duncan Smith, and the Tories support of the rich at the cost of the poor, disabled etc, labour fails to unite people and only attract ridicule when it comes to stupid moronic attitudes such as ISIS's strong points or Giving up the Falklands.

    Seriously labour get rid of Corbyn because while he is making labour an unelectable laughing stock, millions of disabled poor and vulnerable people are being left destitute by nasty IDS removing and sanctioning their benefits and that will go on beyond the 2020 election and get worse now as the Tories have no effective opposition to beat them!

    Labour is letting the most vulnerable in society down. Get rid of Corbyn and get a leader who can actually win elections liberating these people from the mercy of the cruel nasty IDS!
    The membership don't want it so he can't be gotten rid of unfortunateley. So it'll be Tories again next time. I apologise - we ****ed up big time
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    (Original post by redferry)
    That's like saying new members aren't true members because they only support the party for corbyn and not regardless of leadership. That isnt how politics work. It's more about choosing the party closest to your beliefs, which despite Jezzas best efforts remains the labour party. The labour party has always been a broad church and should remain as such. When the corbyn hype inevitably blows over we should seek to retain current members (if the party hasn't died).

    My MP is safe. She's in a very good position and is well liked by both sides of the party. Her constituency would never allow her to be deselected as even a number of corbynites like her. I could potentially see her as the next leader - she's very good.
    Fingers crossed momentum have her replaced. There are forces in motion you can not stop. Jeremy represents everything Labour was suppose to be. Stop trying to be cool and play the rebel, just stand behind him and give him your full support.
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    (Original post by ibzombie96)
    What, and being a decent human being is a sufficient condition to be PM? Of course it isn't. Especially when one is associated with decidedly indecent politics and political characters.

    Jesus Christ

    I don't understand how you don't get that Jeremy Corbyn's Facebook page doesn't represent Britain. He is hideously unpopular and thanks to his enlightened leadership, the party he leads has enjoyed precisely zero poll leads.
    It's a worryingly common belief - one of our members thought the number of people writing into their MP over Syria was a representative sample and should be crucial evidence in decision making
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    (Original post by Squirrel777)
    Fingers crossed momentum have her replaced. There are forces in motion you can not stop. Jeremy represents everything Labour was suppose to be. Stop trying to be cool and play the rebel, just stand behind him and give him your full support.
    They can't do that without actually coming to meetings... Which they don't do
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Forget it, they're nowhere - the old right wing rump are basically dead in the water.
    See this is it. You know you've gone insane when you're calling people like Liz Kendall etc by these terms like they're a detriment to be banished. This is why Labour are unelectable. This is why the Conservatives can do whatever they want at the moment because short of blowing up the country they'll get another majority thanks to crap like this.

    Do you genuinely think the sort of position of calling moderate people right wing has traction in this country? I'd like to know what drugs you're on because I'd like some please
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    (Original post by ibzombie96)
    What, and being a decent human being is a sufficient condition to be PM? Of course it isn't. Especially when one is associated with decidedly indecent politics and political characters.

    Jesus Christ

    I don't understand how you don't get that Jeremy Corbyn's Facebook page doesn't represent Britain. He is hideously unpopular and thanks to his enlightened leadership, the party he leads has enjoyed precisely zero poll leads.
    There's no need to attack me. Have I said that being a decent human being is necessary for being PM ? No. Have I said that I think he should be PM? No. My comment that he is decent began this and all I'm doing Is maintaining my opinion that he is a decent and genuine person and that his election as the leader of the opposition is good for democracy because more people are engaging with politics- people who previously didn't vote, and from all ends of the political spectrum. His policies- whether they are good or bad are being discussed albeit in the majority of cases unfavourably. I'm just saying that's a good thing and I'd be surprised if you disagreed with me. It's got to be good that when people are voting and considering political issues there are lots of options in the discourse. It creates discussion and it challenges. If the torys do indeed win more support as a result of Corbyn then that's not a bad thing. It's just people being able to think and make decisions. He will only be a threat and danger to Britain like the media and Tory leadership keep saying if the majority of the population want him in. And if you're so sure that will never happen then why do you get so annoyed about it?

    I know social media is an echo chamber but what strikes me is the amount of people saying they didn't previously vote and were hugely disengaged with politics. 60-65% turnout over the last couple of elections. Over a third of the electorate are not voting. That needs to change. Have you spoke to many people who didn't vote before to see what they think? People who vote and have ingrained political preference are obviously not going to change their entire world view because of Corbyn. And it seems like that's who most people refer to when they talk about people's opinion of Corbyn etc.
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    (Original post by redferry)
    They can't do that without actually coming to meetings... Which they don't do
    We have our own meetings believe it or not, ones which are representing the new Labour Party. Times are changing. Your brand of Labour will eventually be history, even you can not stop that.
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    (Original post by EtherealNymph22)
    Lol yeah when you don't have a response just throw out a really pathetic jibe! I'm cool with that. That's better then all the rhetoric that I usually get.
    Well the point about the doorstep is that you appear to have absolutely no concept of public opinion. What changes to the country do you propose to make in constant opposition? Do you not agree that getting to form a government is an important part of making positive changes?

    I'm afraid you need to be electable to be able to do that. If you think Corbyn, his policies and the rest of it would get elected in a UK general election then you're deluded beyond hope.

    The fact is, we have a minimum wage in this country (to give one example) because Blair got elected. You might not like him but somehow I doubt the Conservatives would have brought it in....not without pressure from an opposition deemed a threat. Labour right now are no threat to the conservatives what so ever.

    But then you'd have realised that if you'd been on the doorsteps.
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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    Well the point about the doorstep is that you appear to have absolutely no concept of public opinion. What changes to the country do you propose to make in constant opposition? Do you not agree that getting to form a government is an important part of making positive changes?

    I'm afraid you need to be electable to be able to do that. If you think Corbyn, his policies and the rest of it would get elected in a UK general election then you're deluded beyond hope.

    The fact is, we have a minimum wage in this country (to give one example) because Blair got elected. You might not like him but somehow I doubt the Conservatives would have brought it in....not without pressure from an opposition deemed a threat. Labour right now are no threat to the conservatives what so ever.

    But then you'd have realised that if you'd been on the doorsteps.
    More derisive sh*t. I'm not even being pro Corbyn in terms of him being literally PM.

    Please read my comment above where I explained what I meant and my position.

    I engage with a lot of people and primarily I am talking about the 35% of people who haven't voted in the last two elections, whereas I'm pretty sure your doorstep opinion gathering has been from politicised people who always vote and have ingrained opinions.

    I for one, didn't vote at the last election, nor the one before. I just didn't feel engaged with politics, I understood it on an academic level But didn't personally feel anything towards it. Since Corbyn I have become much more personally engaged in politics and I will certainly vote in the next election. I'm not saying whether I will vote Tory, Liberal, Labour- 4.5 years is far away.

    If Corbyn's election means even just one more person votes than before, irrelevant of whether it is for or against him, then that has to be a good thing.

    It shows how wrapped up you are when anything that could potentially be a positive of Corbyn's rise in British politics is mentioned you jump on the defensive and just attack.
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    (Original post by Squirrel777)
    Fingers crossed momentum have her replaced. There are forces in motion you can not stop. Jeremy represents everything Labour was suppose to be. Stop trying to be cool and play the rebel, just stand behind him and give him your full support.
    You really do sound as if you are in a cult. This sort of blind belief is one of the most dangerous forces in politics.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
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    (Original post by Squirrel777)
    Fingers crossed momentum have her replaced. There are forces in motion you can not stop. Jeremy represents everything Labour was suppose to be. Stop trying to be cool and play the rebel, just stand behind him and give him your full support.
    This is spine-shiveringly creepy
 
 
 
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