Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Kanye West is rumoured to be making a David Bowie tribute album - let's stop this! Watch

Announcements
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by lustawny)
    Sorry for upsetting the proverbial TSR apple cart. I'll let all of you go back to watching Keeping up with the Kardashians, since you clearly have no idea what truly talented music is.
    Listen to just a bit of "dreams" by the game ...it was produced by kanye west and if you dont like it then fair play but im sure you will
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by difeo)
    Longevity yeah, obviously there's no comparison, and likely never will be as you don't get rap albums from people in their 70s. And for that reason you could put Bowie over Kanye, but it was the "several leagues apart" that I disagreed with more. It just doesn't seem fair to say someone can't be put above (or even close to) Bowie until they've had that sort of longevity, no matter how good they've been.
    Quality over quantity, and a full 50% of Kanye's albums are considered among the best in his genre, with all the others also very highly rated. See here, even his worst album has got 9/10s and 5 stars. You can't say the same for Bowie, in fact several of his albums are considered quite bad (Never Let Me Down, Tonight, Hours and more).

    Not that the charts are a brilliant way of recognising the best music, but 13 weeks at the top in 50 years is pretty terrible. Kanye got 10 weeks from one song.

    Wrt Snoop and Dre, I completely disagree. Snoop is a better rapper, but not even close as an artist. Dre is a (marginally) better producer, but not much of a rapper himself, writes none of his own lyrics etc.
    I don't think Dre is a marginally better producer, he outstrips any competition by miles. He produced for and basically made famous, N.W.A, Snoop Dogg, Eminem, 50 cent, the Game and kendrick lamar. All these artists best selling albums were produced by Dre, not to mention his own chronic which basically introduced a whole new genre into hip hop...kanye dont come close
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    Whats the problem???
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by 76584)
    I don't think Dre is a marginally better producer, he outstrips any competition by miles. He produced for and basically made famous, N.W.A, Snoop Dogg, Eminem, 50 cent, the Game and kendrick lamar. All these artists best selling albums were produced by Dre, not to mention his own chronic which basically introduced a whole new genre into hip hop...kanye dont come close
    Yeah you're right tbh, I guess I was just in the mindset of bigging Kanye up lol. Kanye is probably top 5 but Dre's production track record is really impressive
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by James Milibanter)
    The difference is that Kanye emerged into a genre that was already big, Hip Hop, whilst with Bowie even today it's difficult to put him into one Genre, it's overly simplistic to call him rock and it means nothing to call him pop. With Bowie each single, each album was unchartered territory, as soon as someone could put him into one category he'd emerge as something completely different. Infusing elements from all over the musical spectrum, his creativity (I believe) is unmatched. As for his influence, it knows no bounds. It's understandable that not every one of his albums or singles will be a success because each album was a new venture for him, and the world as a whole as listeners.

    Re. Hip Hop though, I'm actually a big listener, and though it may be cliched it's cliched for a reason, Eminem holds the top spot. With Bowie it's different because with each album came uncharted territory, from classic rock, to dance, to electronica, to whatever you want to call it, there's not one brush that you can paint him with, but that's just not the case with Kanye. Kanye is a product of several years of Hiphop, whereas Bowie paved the way himself. It's because of this that they're several leagues apart.

    For the record, I do quite like Kanye, Yeezus was a brilliant album, one of the best produced albums I've ever heard in fact, but I don't think it'll hold up for 50 years. I don't think in 50 years time people will still be singing "stronger" (probably his best known song) yet "Space Oddity" has held up. Kanye is brilliant, but despite that, he's not special.

    It's not even elitism, it's just matter of fact. Kanye hasn't even influenced Hip Hop to the extent that Bowie influenced music as a whole.
    How can Eminem hold the top spot? Based on two (albeit brilliant) albums? You talk about Bowie and his longevity but go on to cite Eminem as the greatest in hip-hop despite the fact he has drastically declined from about 2004? That, along with implying Kanye hasn't really influenced hip-hop leads me to believe you aren't much of a fan of the genre. Hell, some of the most popular hip-hop artists right now, like Drake are doing something Kanye did 8 years ago.
    • Political Ambassador
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IamJacksContempt)
    How can Eminem hold the top spot? Based on two (albeit brilliant) albums? You talk about Bowie and his longevity but go on to cite Eminem as the greatest in hip-hop despite the fact he has drastically declined from about 2004? That, along with implying Kanye hasn't really influenced hip-hop leads me to believe you aren't much of a fan of the genre. Hell, some of the most popular hip-hop artists right now, like Drake are doing something Kanye did 8 years ago.
    And Kanye had done only what several others had done before him.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by James Milibanter)
    And Kanye had done only what several others had done before him.
    Really? Who, in hip-hop was doing something similar before Kanye?
    • Political Ambassador
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IamJacksContempt)
    Really? Who, in hip-hop was doing something similar before Kanye?
    Kanye broke through in the early 2000s, there were plenty around before him, inc. Dre who blows him out the water in several ways.
    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    Black On Both Sides >>> any Eminem album.

    zKlownivy.98difeo
    Confirm.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by James Milibanter)
    Kanye broke through in the early 2000s, there were plenty around before him, inc. Dre who blows him out the water in several ways.
    I don't think you understood my question. Most hip-hop artists before Kanye (and especially Dre) were preoccupied with gangsta rap. Kanye played a big part in changing that.

    As for Dre blowing him out of the water in several ways... hmmmm. Could argue that he's a marginally better producer. Is he a better rapper? Not really. Is he a better lyricist? No chance.

    What ways does he blow him out of the water?
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IamJacksContempt)
    How can Eminem hold the top spot? Based on two (albeit brilliant) albums? You talk about Bowie and his longevity but go on to cite Eminem as the greatest in hip-hop despite the fact he has drastically declined from about 2004? That, along with implying Kanye hasn't really influenced hip-hop leads me to believe you aren't much of a fan of the genre. Hell, some of the most popular hip-hop artists right now, like Drake are doing something Kanye did 8 years ago.
    Three, tbf. Agreed with the rest though
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    5
    (Original post by Wilfred Little)
    Do you actually like Hip-Hop or do you just like Ed Sheeran? What other stuff do you like?

    I know he did an EP with some rappers but I've not heard anything outside of that that could be described as Hip-Hop, can you post some examples?
    It's mainly just Ed Sheeran I like, but I've listened to artists like Eminem and Coolio and enjoyed some of their songs. I don't go out of my way to listen to hip hop music, though, because the majority of stuff from the hip hop genre doesn't appeal to me; it's usually a case of me stumbling across the odd song that strikes a chord with me.

    Yeah, his No. 5 Collaborations Project EP featured entirely music made with grime/hip hop artists, but I wouldn't try to claim for one second that he's a pure hip hop artist. I know that his musical influences are primarily rooted in the hip hop genre, and he's cited Eminem's Marshall Mathers LP and Slim Shady LP as the earliest sort of music that he really had a love for. He incorporates elements of hip hop into his music, I would say.

    In terms of his own music, aside from the No. 5 Collaborations Project EP, I would say this is his most hip hoppy song out of his entire catalogue:


    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IamJacksContempt)
    Really? Who, in hip-hop was doing something similar before Kanye?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J_Dilla

    Production wise, Kanye's stuff sounds very close to this guy.
    • Political Ambassador
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IamJacksContempt)
    I don't think you understood my question. Most hip-hop artists before Kanye (and especially Dre) were preoccupied with gangsta rap. Kanye played a big part in changing that.

    As for Dre blowing him out of the water in several ways... hmmmm. Could argue that he's a marginally better producer. Is he a better rapper? Not really. Is he a better lyricist? No chance.

    What ways does he blow him out of the water?
    Marginally?!

    Dre made musicians, Kanye made himself. Eminem inspired musicians, Kanye inspires himself.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by James Milibanter)
    Marginally?!

    Dre made musicians, Kanye made himself. Eminem inspired musicians, Kanye inspires himself.
    Who? Macklemore?!


    As for the rest... well that's just plain false.
    • Political Ambassador
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IamJacksContempt)
    Who? Macklemore?!


    As for the rest... well that's just plain false.
    Prof. Green
    Kendrick Lamar
    J cole
    Tyler the creator
    the list goes on

    As for the rest, if you look at several hip hop artists, their best albums have been produced by Dre, including Eminem
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IamJacksContempt)
    I don't think you understood my question. Most hip-hop artists before Kanye (and especially Dre) were preoccupied with gangsta rap. Kanye played a big part in changing that.

    As for Dre blowing him out of the water in several ways... hmmmm. Could argue that he's a marginally better producer. Is he a better rapper? Not really. Is he a better lyricist? No chance.

    What ways does he blow him out of the water?
    I've already posted this but ill just copy and paste it again
    I don't think Dre is a marginally better producer, he outstrips any competition by miles. He produced for and basically made famous, N.W.A, Snoop Dogg, Eminem, 50 cent, the Game and kendrick lamar. All these artists best selling albums were produced by Dre, not to mention his own chronic which basically introduced a whole new genre into hip hop...kanye dont come close
    these are the reasons dre is much more than a "marginally better" producer than Kanye. Including albums hes made and produced, since the chronic he's been part of over 100million album sales which is just incredible
    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by lustawny)
    x
    Fair play. Yeah familiar with that video, forgot all about it but yeah I can hear it in the music.
    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by 76584)
    I've already posted this but ill just copy and paste it again
    I don't think Dre is a marginally better producer, he outstrips any competition by miles. He produced for and basically made famous, N.W.A, Snoop Dogg, Eminem, 50 cent, the Game and kendrick lamar. All these artists best selling albums were produced by Dre, not to mention his own chronic which basically introduced a whole new genre into hip hop...kanye dont come close
    these are the reasons dre is much more than a "marginally better" producer than Kanye. Including albums hes made and produced, since the chronic he's been part of over 100million album sales which is just incredible
    Bang on. Dre is my favourite producer, that G Funk stuff he did in the early 90s is ****ing mental. This is what Kanye himself had to say about The Chronic:

    Kanye West wrote on the album's production quality: "The Chronic is still the hip-hop equivalent to Stevie Wonder's Songs in the Key of Life. It's the benchmark you measure your album against if you're serious.
 
 
 
Reply
Submit reply
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

Updated: January 8, 2017
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Break up or unrequited love?
    Useful resources

    Articles:

    TSR wiki music section

    Quick link:

    Unanswered music threads

    Groups associated with this forum:

    View associated groups
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.