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Any muslims here also stopped believing in God? Watch

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    (Original post by mariachi)
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    I never said you 'feel lonely' but if you do I can't do anything about it. Soz.
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    (Original post by Leukocyte)
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    Not a high horse at all, a perfectly reasonable assumption for someone who obviously has no access to the conversations between you and the CT to make. But again, this is waffle and irrelevant to the topic at hand.

    Oh wait, yo still haven't answered my question?
    What question? The only one of importance you asked was

    Yes it is, you need evidence to say it's God's words (?)
    You're saying that you need evidence to say it's God's word. You're saying it's God's word, so where is the evidence?

    And why would you expect me to answer this question, I'm not saying it's God's word! :facepalm:
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    (Original post by Leukocyte)
    I never said you 'feel lonely' but if you do I can't do anything about it. Soz.
    why can't you believe that people will doubt that the Quran is God's word ? what proof do you have ?

    (hopefully, you wont start boring us with the "scientific miracles", embryology, water separation, numerology etc etc)
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Not a high horse at all, a perfectly reasonable assumption for someone who obviously has no access to the conversations between you and the CT to make. But again, this is waffle and irrelevant to the topic at hand.

    What question? The only one of importance you asked was

    You're saying that you need evidence to say it's God's word. You're saying it's God's word, so where is the evidence?

    And why would you expect me to answer this question, I'm not saying it's God's word! :facepalm:
    Then maybe you should stop chattering about my account and get to the point with this so called discussion bc clearly you're the one waffling about me.

    Meh. That's the answer you'd get from a non-Muslim Sheikh.
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    Plantagenet, I'm impressed that you have the patience to deal with these people.
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    (Original post by Leukocyte)
    Sorry I ain't mariachi to waffle.
    I commend your intention to avoid the waffling so many of us unfortunately seem to indulge in

    therefore, you will be able to satisfy our curiosity and come forth with your proof that the Quran is God's word. Go ahead : we're all ears
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    There are a few. I know peoples. If ya wanna PM
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Really, do you have the original Qur'an in your possession?
    They are all exact replicas. The 'original/s' I speak of can be found at the University of Birmingham and in some museum in Uzbekistan. The Birmingham one was written shortly after the prophet died and historians do believe that the writer was alive during the time of the prophet and may even have knew him. The Uzbek one was copied during the reign of Uthman, who was one of the prophets companions which is the one used today. Hope it answers your question.
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    (Original post by Leukocyte)
    Then maybe you should stop chattering about my account and get to the point with this so called discussion bc clearly you're the one waffling about me.
    You started the waffle by your cry of "ignorant" which, by the way, you have failed to substantiate.

    Meh. That's the answer you'd get from a non-Muslim Sheikh.
    You seem to be confusing yourself here. What is the question you were referring to and if you wouldn't mind, how about addressing the questions I asked you which have been ignored:

    1) Where is your evidence the Qur'an is the word of God?

    2) Where is your evidence that angels exist?
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    (Original post by captainslow69)
    They are all exact replicas. The 'original/s' I speak of can be found at the University of Birmingham and in some museum in Uzbekistan. The Birmingham one was written shortly after the prophet died and historians do believe that the writer was alive during the time of the prophet and may even have knew him. The Uzbek one was copied during the reign of Uthman, who was one of the prophets companions which is the one used today. Hope it answers your question.
    Really, and how has it been proven that the ones in the University of Birmingham are the originals?
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    about 80% of humanity does not believe that the Quran is God's words, so actually we don't feel lonely

    personally, I have read the Quran (in English and in French) and have studied some Arabic, so as to understand at least some basic issues about the various Arabic readings (qira'at) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qira'at

    there are 14 slightly different texts (riwaya) of the Quran that Muslims consider as "authentic", 6 more considered as slightly less "authentic" and many more exist, but have been "rejected" : the differences usually are quite small and insignificant, but some do have importance (a singular for a plural, a masculine instead of a feminine, an active verb instead of passive etc etc)

    I have found absolutely no reason why we should believe that the Quran comes from God
    Ok so why is Islam the fastest growing religion
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    Given up on Islam...

    Posted from TSR Mobile
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    (Original post by captainslow69)
    They are all exact replicas. The 'original/s' I speak of can be found at the University of Birmingham and in some museum in Uzbekistan. The Birmingham one was written shortly after the prophet died and historians do believe that the writer was alive during the time of the prophet and may even have knew him. The Uzbek one was copied during the reign of Uthman, who was one of the prophets companions which is the one used today. Hope it answers your question.
    After some quick googling this has proven to not be exactly true. The Birmingham manuscript is certainly old, and one of the oldest Islamic manuscripts by carbon dating, but this doesn't prove that it's the oldest nor the original Qur'an.

    Likewise with the manuscript in Uzbekistan.
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    (Original post by mas_)
    Ok so why is Islam the fastest growing religion
    Ignoring the fact that this is just due to birth rates and not actual religiosity (if I remember correctly secularism is growing faster than any religion), what is the point you're trying to make? That the speed at which a religion grows determines its truth?

    If that's the case then the truth of different religions changes over time!
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    A Muslim shocked that an atheist doesn't believe the Quran to be the word of God.

    I have seen it all now
    • #8
    #8

    (Original post by Anonymous)
    After studying Islam, it just seems like a version of Christianity and Judaism (though I don't find either of those better, atleast both Moses and Jesus could perform miracles), where as Islam was written by a man in a cave, what was Muhammeds miracles? In my honest opinion all Islam seems like to me is Arab imprelism, arab clothing, arab names, arab way of life is the way Islam is founded on, many people want to show themselves as real muslim so therefore turn to the Arab lifestyle, it is interchanged, I don't believe in Allah anymore either, I've come to the conclusion to be a good person with morals you just need to be born and bred with them, many of my friends were muslim who turned ex muslim, at first I tried to keep my distance from them but in the end they turned out to be better peolpe then my muslim friends.
    Iman is up and down. Sometimes I feel that too, sometimes I feel that God gives to me more than what I asked. But I really hate about the Arabism that starts to invade my country.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Ignoring the fact that this is just due to birth rates and not actual religiosity (if I remember correctly secularism is growing faster than any religion), what is the point you're trying to make? That the speed at which a religion grows determines its truth?

    If that's the case then the truth of different religions changes over time!
    Actually Islam is the fastest-growing religion due to the number of conversions each year... There must be a reason for people converting to Islam, rather than other religions.
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    (Original post by captainslow69)
    They are all exact replicas. The 'original/s' I speak of can be found at the University of Birmingham and in some museum in Uzbekistan. The Birmingham one was written shortly after the prophet died and historians do believe that the writer was alive during the time of the prophet and may even have knew him. The Uzbek one was copied during the reign of Uthman, who was one of the prophets companions which is the one used today. Hope it answers your question.
    the Birmingham "original" is in fact only a couple of pages ... the Tashkent (Uzbek, or Samarkand etc) Quran is about 40% of the entire text.

    Even if it is popularly known as "Uthman's Quran", there is absolutely no proof of its "Uthmanic" origin

    Islamic-awareness dates it to the 8th century http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Qur...samarqand.html

    ancient Qurans are not all identical : many variants are displayed
    • #9
    #9

    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Here are 12 documented textual variants of Surah 2 verse 106 in the Quran. Keep in mind this is one single verse.

    http://i.imgur.com/ipyK25X.png

    Even this Islamic site says slight errors and additions have occurred

    http://submission.org/verify_preserv...ing_Quran.html



    Circular reasoning. And you are yet to show me how you know it hasn't deviated from the original.
    Clueless.
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    Clueless.
    Insults and no refutation then.
 
 
 
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