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Rhodes must fall campaign backfires. Watch

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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    The flip side of that is that money allows something stupid to happen as well.



    Having just read that article a statue of him was removed in South Africa. I think in that case it is fair enough. We were essentially conquerors then and it wasn't that long ago. We are unique in that we have not been occupied/colonized by a greater power in recent history. It's really easy telling people to just get on with the future from that position. Imagine if the Germans had erected some statues of their leaders when they occupied France and France had to keep them lol.



    Despite my awful grammar and spelling :five:

    Me too. Although I wouldn't really call it hard left. I dunno what it is but it is whatever the Guardian like to talk about. Spend more time banning statues than tacking class inequality and so on.I don;t necessarily think that is bad, I'm a bit indifferent to it. Plus I like freedom of speech so stop banning people from talking ffs. That whole post was just me being contrarian and playing devils advocate.
    FYI, the people saying Rhodes should stay in South Africa were also South Africans. So comparison with Germany-France doesn't really work.
    Also you really can't compare Germany's conquering of France with Britain's colonialisation of southern Africa.
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    (Original post by zimbo97)
    How was Churchill a ****? Yes he was a colonialist, but so was everyone else in Britain. He still supported India's right to be an independent country.

    And you say 'I guess' he played a role in fighting fascism, making it sound like he played some menial role, whereas in actuality he resisted pressure to make a deal with Hitler and consequently Britain for the first 3 years of the war was the only major power fighting the Nazis.
    No on your first point, exactly the opposite - he strongly opposed the Indian independence movement, he kept Gandhi in prison during WW2 and he spoke repeatedly against it during the years after the war.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    No on your first point, exactly the opposite - he strongly opposed the Indian independence movement, he kept Gandhi in prison during WW2 and he spoke repeatedly against it during the years after the war.
    I remember reading a speech he gave in 1945 essentially saying Indian independence should happen in the near future but not right away as to do so would be against the best interests of India, which would have to be prepared for independence (perhaps alluding to the messy splitting up of Pakistan and India).

    However I've looked it up a bit now and see that you're right, and that clearly he had deeply held beliefs about India being under the yoke of Britain for a very long time, which was an unpopular position even for the time.
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    (Original post by zimbo97)
    I remember reading a speech he gave in 1945 essentially saying Indian independence should happen in the near future but not right away as to do so would be against the best interests of India, which would have to be prepared for independence (perhaps alluding to the messy splitting up of Pakistan and India).

    However I've looked it up a bit now and see that you're right, and that clearly he had deeply held beliefs about India being under the yoke of Britain for a very long time, which was an unpopular position even for the time.
    You're also right about that speech, I've just been searching for it online and can't immediately locate it. I think he got somewhat conciliatory about it once it was completely clear that it was going to happen and there was nothing he could do - that was under the Attlee government.
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    Robert Mugabe has caused far more problems than Mr Rhodes... i don't hear the uproar about him ?
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    (Original post by the bear)
    Robert Mugabe has caused far more problems than Mr Rhodes... i don't hear the uproar about him ?
    How does a privileged south African load himself with the trauma of his ancestors that suffered under !Mugabe without having said ancestors?

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    (Original post by the bear)
    Robert Mugabe has caused far more problems than Mr Rhodes... i don't hear the uproar about him ?
    But he is taking back Africa from the evil white man.

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    (Original post by DiddyDec)
    But he is taking back Africa from the evil white man.

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    And giving it to his friends and relatives.
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    (Original post by Good bloke)
    And giving it to his friends and relatives.
    The main thing is he is giving it back to the black people... Although it is a very select bunch.

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    (Original post by the bear)
    Robert Mugabe has caused far more problems than Mr Rhodes... i don't hear the uproar about him ?
    But there has been uproar none-the-less.

    See the section on honours and revocations. The Edinburgh one caused a lot of fuss.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert...nd_revocations
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    (Original post by DiddyDec)
    . Although it is a very select bunch.
    He's turning Zimbabwe into a banana republic, then?
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    But there has been uproar none-the-less.

    See the section on honours and revocations. The Edinburgh one caused a lot of fuss.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert...nd_revocations
    thank you for that. the Twitterati seem far less upset about this appalling tyrant than about Mr Rhodes.
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    (Original post by Good bloke)
    He's turning Zimbabwe into a banana republic, then?
    Prior to Mugabe becoming President it was a Banana republic.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canaan_Banana
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    (Original post by the bear)
    thank you for that. the Twitterati seem far less upset about this appalling tyrant than about Mr Rhodes.
    They can't be outraged because he is black. Fact.

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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    Prior to Mugabe becoming President it was a Banana republic.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canaan_Banana
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    (Original post by DiddyDec)
    They can't be outraged because he is black. Fact.

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    ofc
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    (Original post by DiddyDec)
    They can't be outraged because he is black. Fact.

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    But has he described the white farmers as a bunch or a swarm?
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    (Original post by Good bloke)
    But has he described the white farmers as a bunch or a swarm?
    He doesn't need to when he can have them killed.

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    (Original post by DiddyDec)
    He doesn't need to when he can have them killed.

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    That genuinely does dehumanise them, even more than calling them a bunch.
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    (Original post by Good bloke)
    That genuinely does dehumanise them, even more than calling them a bunch.
    Not really, they are still human. Just dead human.

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