Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Tories now with a 14pt lead in the polls... Watch

Announcements
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Reue)
    I'm dumb as...?
    You tell me
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Hydeman)
    Or perhaps they're supporting the lesser (or least, if you want to consider more than two parties) of two (/many) evils?
    And you're talking about the Tories? They're the lesser of two (however many) evils, are you on something?

    Are we talking about the lesser of two evils in respect of the corporate machine? If so then yeah the Tories are absolute dolls/complete bae. But yeah... No such thing as compassion for bricks and mortar or even air so yeah you got a bit confused no?
    • Community Assistant
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    The thing is that unlike the Nazi party, Muslim brotherhood etc the Tories have been consistently elected since their inception nearly two centuries ago, and before then the predecessor parties were consistently elected for centuries. Even if we just focus on the last century with largely universal suffrage the consistent electoral success, particularly being the party of government for the last century would imply that they are the preferred party if the populace, even with until recently an inherent electoral bias against them. [Insert same conclusion as before here]

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    True.
    I don't think we can dismiss the influence of money though, which the tories have always had a lot more of. That's not some lefty looney save the world idea, just an observation.

    No question the tories are the 'natural party of government' though.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by skeptical_john)
    For people who have a stake in the country (homeowners/aspirational people etc) the tories are far better than EdM or Corbyn. For those on the fringes yes labour are better but it does not matter if you are out of gov't
    Yeah you're absolutely right the Tories want to help/go out of their way to help people that don't need help where as Labour are actually acknowledging that they don't and therefore resources should go to those who do... Yeah does seem right and proper.
    Offline

    18
    (Original post by Little Popcorns)
    And you're talking about the Tories? They're the lesser of two (however many) evils, are you on something?

    Are we talking about the lesser of two evils in respect of the corporate machine? If so then yeah the Tories are absolute dolls/complete bae. But yeah... No such thing has compassion for bricks and mortar or even air so yeah you got a bit confuse no?
    I'm not talking about my opinion -- I'm trying to explain the results of an opinion poll, so there's no need to get so personal. I've simply postulated a more credible alternative to your extremely insightful assertion that 'they're all masochists and sadists, innit.'
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Hydeman)
    I'm not talking about my opinion -- I'm trying to explain the results of an opinion poll, so there's no need to get so personal. I've simply postulated a more credible alternative to your extremely insightful assertion that 'they're all masochists and sadists, innit.'
    Yeah but you're a Tory.

    Innit. Yo.

    Dat is a question.

    '?'
    Offline

    18
    (Original post by Little Popcorns)
    Yeah but you're a Tory.
    Incorrect. I'm neither a member nor a voter of the Conservative Party.

    It speaks volumes of your ability to think when you imply that the validity of what I've said is determined by whether I'm a Tory or not. :rolleyes:
    • TSR Support Team
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    It's probably higher given how the polls always overestimate Labour support and underestimate the Conservatives. The British people made it very clear at the last election that they don't want socialism, so Labour elect Corbyn and his merry bunch of lunatics who aren't a credible opponent. It's effectively a free pass to Cameron and his cabinet to do as they please.

    Tories will win comfortably in 2020, and probably the election after that.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Hydeman)
    Incorrect. I'm neither a member nor a voter of the Conservative Party.

    It speaks volumes of your ability to think when you imply that the validity of what I've said is determined by whether I'm a Tory or not.
    Yeah I agree it does because it would have been very relevant to any bias or lack of in what you were saying.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Hydeman)
    I'm neither a member nor a voter of the Conservative Party.
    Who're you for then?
    Offline

    18
    (Original post by Little Popcorns)
    Yeah I agree it does because it would have been very relevant to any bias or lack of in what you were saying.
    Still doesn't affect the validity of any political statement I make, especially in the way that you seem to think (i.e. any statement made about the Conservative Party is dismissable with a simple 'yeah, but you're a Tory').

    (Original post by Little Popcorns)
    Who're you for then?
    In British politics? Nobody, at present. That doesn't mean that I can't speak about British politics.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    I kind of think David shot himself in the foot by listening to me and reversing his decision on tax credits.

    That being said Labour, CUT off their foot when they elected corbyn. And no amount of good will or rhetoric will change the fact that if milliband, with his softly left wing approach, was too left wing for the electorate, in the last election, what chance does an old left winger stand? None i'm afraid.

    But I'm still voting labour.
    • Community Assistant
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by sr90)
    It's probably higher given how the polls always overestimate Labour support and underestimate the Conservatives. The British people made it very clear at the last election that they don't want socialism, so Labour elect Corbyn and his merry bunch of lunatics who aren't a credible opponent. It's effectively a free pass to Cameron and his cabinet to do as they please.

    Tories will win comfortably in 2020, and probably the election after that.
    The alarming thing is that even with the Tories only having a small majority Labour still did so badly that they require 99 seats for a majority of 1 (the 3rd largest seat swing since 1945). Consider that if the Tories do even better in 2020 then Labour require a performance comparable to Blair/Attlee to attain a majority.

    It's very possible that if the Tories get their act together in terms of softening the image that they could govern for 25 years before finally being defeated. Even a recession may not be enough to give Labour 90+ seats.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Hydeman)
    Still doesn't affect the validity of any political statement I make, especially in the way that you seem to think (i.e. any statement made about the Conservative Party is dismissable with a simple 'yeah, but you're a Tory'.



    In British politics? Nobody, at present. That doesn't mean that I can't speak about British politics.
    we've established that I mistook you for a Tory when you are not. As have we established that what I said in response would have been relevant if you were in fact a Tory. Saying 'they're the lesser of two evils' is clearly debatable. And I would have entered that discussion if you had said you were a Tory. But you said in fact you were suggesting a possible reason for the pretty huge poll lead as a supposed 'impartial' therefore there was no reason for me to debate the 'they're the lesser of two evils' because you haven't even made your own mind up about that yet. Or have you?

    Come on don't be silly I'm not suggesting you should take a side or shut up I just thought you were a Tory from some of your posts I've seen over a period of time.
    • Community Assistant
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by sr90)
    It's probably higher given how the polls always overestimate Labour support and underestimate the Conservatives. The British people made it very clear at the last election that they don't want socialism, so Labour elect Corbyn and his merry bunch of lunatics who aren't a credible opponent. It's effectively a free pass to Cameron and his cabinet to do as they please.

    Tories will win comfortably in 2020, and probably the election after that.
    I'm amazed you think Labour were socialists at the last election.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    If the polls stay like this for another couple of years then Labour will replace Corbyn but the current polls are great for Cameron and why he really needs to capitalise on this now with the EU referendum. If the government was on the rack then it would be much more likely that an angry public would want to go against what Cameron was recommending but with a large lead it's a good time to go to the polls and recommend an "In" vote, especially as UKIP haven't been able to take advantage of the migrant crisis to eat in to the Tory polling figures.

    If it wasn't for the importance of the EU referendum then Cameron would probably prefer to spend the mid-term period trailing behind Corbyn in the polls so Labour would keep him in post till 2020 and then the Tories could do a full on assault on him like they did Miliband.

    The risk factor for the Tories is that Labour will jettison Corbyn in 2018 and then in will come a new leader like Keir Starmer/Dan Jarvis etc who will be more popular and they will get a bounce in the polls and some momentum, if the economy goes on a downturn or there's trouble in the banking sector etc at that time then that will make the 2020 election much more difficult than they might currently think.

    Another interesting point is that the Lib Dems are still stuck where they were, when they had hoped that Labour moving to the left would mean Labour leached voters to the Lib Dems but they are still single figures. They need to be pushing back to 15% to become relevant again.
    • Political Ambassador
    Online

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Bornblue)
    True.
    I don't think we can dismiss the influence of money though, which the tories have always had a lot more of. That's not some lefty looney save the world idea, just an observation.

    No question the tories are the 'natural party of government' though.
    The thing about money though is that I remember during the election you and other lefties saying how the Tories were outspending labour 3:1 and ****, then last month when the figures were actually published it was only about 10% more, I actually really want to see just how massive the Tory war chest is ATM and how much bigger it will be in 5 years.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    18
    (Original post by Little Popcorns)
    As have we established that what I said in response would have been relevant if you were in fact a Tory.
    Er, no we haven't. I specifically disputed this in my previous post: the validity of what I say has nothing to do with my party affiliation; it is open to attack and scrutiny on the basis of its content, but it's not open to a 'yeah, but you're a Tory' type dismissal.

    Saying 'they're the lesser of too evils' is clearly debatable. And I would have entered that discussion if you had said you were a Tory. But you said in fact you were suggesting a possible reason for the pretty huge poll lead as a supposed 'impartial' therefore there was no reason for me to debate the 'they're the lesser of two evils' because you haven't even made your own mind up about that yet. Or have you?
    I don't support a British political party at present, but that doesn't mean I haven't made my mind up about this particular poll... I've clearly said that I think that a 'lesser of two evils' mindset is a more probable cause for the Tories' lead than masochism and sadism on the part of the electorate.

    Labour under Corbyn is doing pretty badly in the polls in terms of having the public's trust on major issues. Given the reality of the two-party system, it's perfectly possible for people who don't feel strongly either way to support the Tories at the present time because they're seen to be more competent than Labour -- nothing to do with this 'they're all masochists' guff.

    Come on don't be silly I'm not suggesting you should take a side or shut up I just thought you were a Tory from some of your posts I've seen over a period of time.
    It's alright to make an assumption of that kind privately, but dismissing an argument that I've made on the basis of such an assumption is to risk looking like a fool.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Little Popcorns)
    You tell me
    Perhaps it's not a case of all tory supporters being 'dumb' but instead you being unable or unwilling to appreciate their reasoning?

    Far more likely that the issue lies with yourself rather than a large segment of the population traditionally associated with the better educated and wealthy.
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by sr90)
    It's probably higher given how the polls always overestimate Labour support and underestimate the Conservatives. The British people made it very clear at the last election that they don't want socialism, so Labour elect Corbyn and his merry bunch of lunatics who aren't a credible opponent. It's effectively a free pass to Cameron and his cabinet to do as they please.

    Tories will win comfortably in 2020, and probably the election after that.
    Even as a Conservative, I disagree with this.
 
 
 
Reply
Submit reply
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

Updated: February 18, 2016
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Should Spain allow Catalonia to declare independence?
    Useful resources

    Groups associated with this forum:

    View associated groups
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.