Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by m.dani)
    So I was wondering whether further maths at A level is really going to affect whether you will get into the more prestigious universities like Oxford?
    Everything I learned during A level further maths was essentially repeated (some parts dumbed down) during my 3 year engineering degree at UCL (2013-16). Massive boost as the maths module each year has been a piece of piss as I've already done it before.

    Always claimed Further Maths was too difficult at A level, seems even more difficult considering engineering graduates are mathematically on a par (or only slightly ahead) of further maths a level students.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    So what do you guys think of my A level options : Maths, Physics, Chemistry and Computer Science?
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    Seeing as further maths is a requirement, at least up to AS according to the website, for mathematics at Oxford and Cambridge (don't forget STEP and MAT), you're pretty much ineligible to apply for mathematics without it.

    As for medicine, it's definitely not needed.
    Offline

    10
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by m.dani)
    So what do you guys think of my A level options : Maths, Physics, Chemistry and Computer Science?
    If you want to do maths or medicine you might want to do biology (for med) or further maths (if you want to do maths). Your options would suggest to me that maths maybe isn't what you truly want to do, because most people who know at this stage that they want to do something mathematical at uni would probably want to do as much maths as they can, and given the option would most likely do further maths.
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by flyingpanda)
    For anything Mathematical at Uni, definitely.

    For Medicine, Unis don't see Maths and Further Maths as separate A Levels, so it's kinda useless. I'm no longer taking Further Maths because of this, as I find it to be a waste of time, when I can focus on my other subjects, like Chemistry and Biology, which are actually required. :woo:
    Spoiler:
    Show
    Note: I feel like what I've written can be slightly misleading; both Chemistry and Biology are not always compulsory, and you can sometimes take one without the other, but with different sciences in Uni entry requirements.

    But I feel like I need both to make a competitive application, and to not limit my options in terms of Unis I could apply to.
    Except Oxford are one of the unis that do accept it. In fact, taking further maths correlates with getting an offer better than any other a-level (probably not causative).
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by GreenOut)
    Everything I learned during A level further maths was essentially repeated (some parts dumbed down) during my 3 year engineering degree at UCL (2013-16). Massive boost as the maths module each year has been a piece of piss as I've already done it before.

    Always claimed Further Maths was too difficult at A level, seems even more difficult considering engineering graduates are mathematically on a par (or only slightly ahead) of further maths a level students.
    On the other hand, Chemistry students at Oxford are doing 2nd and 3rd order differential equations in the rates of reaction module, and matrices beyond anything I saw in further maths in the quantum mechanics modules as early as 2nd and 3rd week of 1st year. Economics had similar use of differential equations, and obviously physics and maths progressed at a much faster pace than either of those. I think the leaders of those courses, plus leaders of maths courses at any top uni, would significantly object to a dumbing down of further maths!
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nexttime)
    On the other hand, Chemistry students at Oxford are doing 2nd and 3rd order differential equations in the rates of reaction module, and matrices beyond anything I saw in further maths in the quantum mechanics modules as early as 2nd and 3rd week of 1st year. Economics had similar use of differential equations, and obviously physics and maths progressed at a much faster pace than either of those. I think the leaders of those courses, plus leaders of maths courses at any top uni, would significantly object to a dumbing down of further maths!
    Completely agree with this. I can't imagine a science or engineering degree without maths well beyond FM....

    Also interesting re Oxford accepting FM as a separate subject for medicine. I stand corrected; I thought that was just a general "medicine thing"
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by shamika)
    Completely agree with this. I can't imagine a science or engineering degree without maths well beyond FM....
    Mathematics is not a linear subject. It's a selection of different topics. Some topics are built on other topics whereas other topics can be studied using just an elementary knowledge of mathematics. For example, vector calculus requires good knowledge of both vectors and calculus, but many of the topics on the A Level D papers can be successfully taught to kids in primary school who's mathematical knowledge is restricted to arithmetic and basic algebra.

    A book I recommend is Engineering Mathematics by K. A. Stroud.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by m.dani)
    So I was wondering whether further maths at A level is really going to affect whether you will get into the more prestigious universities like Oxford?
    Its very unrealistic for you to get into a prestigious uni to do a degree that requires maths without further maths. Some could potentially get in with AS further maths, and most will offer STEP/MAT.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by shamika)
    Completely agree with this. I can't imagine a science or engineering degree without maths well beyond FM....

    Also interesting re Oxford accepting FM as a separate subject for medicine. I stand corrected; I thought that was just a general "medicine thing"
    (Original post by Arran90)
    Mathematics is not a linear subject. It's a selection of different topics. Some topics are built on other topics whereas other topics can be studied using just an elementary knowledge of mathematics. For example, vector calculus requires good knowledge of both vectors and calculus, but many of the topics on the A Level D papers can be successfully taught to kids in primary school who's mathematical knowledge is restricted to arithmetic and basic algebra.

    A book I recommend is Engineering Mathematics by K. A. Stroud.
    (Original post by nexttime)
    On the other hand, Chemistry students at Oxford are doing 2nd and 3rd order differential equations in the rates of reaction module, and matrices beyond anything I saw in further maths in the quantum mechanics modules as early as 2nd and 3rd week of 1st year. Economics had similar use of differential equations, and obviously physics and maths progressed at a much faster pace than either of those. I think the leaders of those courses, plus leaders of maths courses at any top uni, would significantly object to a dumbing down of further maths!
    The maths is beyond FM but it's all the same type of stuff. We've done second and third order differentials, matrices crazier than any at FM, vectors and stuff way harder than at FM. It's just that we were exposed to everything at FM and learning the basics of a topic is always the hardest part, however we were exposed to the fundamentals at AL, which is why it is so much easier. Maybe I could've phrased it better.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by GreenOut)
    The maths is beyond FM but it's all the same type of stuff. We've done second and third order differentials, matrices crazier than any at FM, vectors and stuff way harder than at FM. It's just that we were exposed to everything at FM and learning the basics of a topic is always the hardest part, however we were exposed to the fundamentals at AL, which is why it is so much easier. Maybe I could've phrased it better.
    Maybe I'm comparing the maths you learn for physics at somewhere like Cambridge or Imperial... You'd have to learn group theory, the basics of quantum mechanics (mathematically I mean), how to solve plenty of DE's... It's similar in spirit to A-level core and further pure (ie you learn methods rather than proofs), but they are more complicated than anything you'd learn in A-level Further Maths.

    I'm assuming that level of maths is needed everywhere but maybe I'm mistaken
    Offline

    5
    ReputationRep:
    If you go on to study maths/physics/chemistry/engineering at university, then you'll basically cover A-level further maths content in the first few terms.

    Therefore having done A-level further maths already at school will give you a huge support and head start.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    The Further Mathematics A Level was originally intended for students who proposed to study degrees in mathematics or theoretical physics. Many universities strongly preferred that applicants had the A Level because they didn't want to waste time repeating it in the 1st year. For other subjects such as engineering or more practical physics it was seen as a bonus but not essential. In recent years the value of further mathematics has increased in subjects such as engineering and physics due to the stripping out of content from the mathematics A Level. Complex numbers are used in AC circuit theory in electrical engineering. A topic no longer found in the mathematics A Level but covered by further mathematics.
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by GreenOut)
    The maths is beyond FM but it's all the same type of stuff. We've done second and third order differentials, matrices crazier than any at FM, vectors and stuff way harder than at FM. It's just that we were exposed to everything at FM and learning the basics of a topic is always the hardest part, however we were exposed to the fundamentals at AL, which is why it is so much easier. Maybe I could've phrased it better.
    You were exposed to the fundamentals of differential equations and matrices outside of further maths? Perhaps the syllabus has changed since my time!

    Personally I think that for having to do such maths just days into your degree, further maths in its current format (where matrices and differential equations are only briefly touched on) would be useful. Very useful.
    Offline

    22
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by tcameron)
    Completely pointless if you aren't going for maths, engineering or physics
    Most uni's don't accept boths maths and further maths A level as separate, so unless you want 6 extra exams for fun, there is no advantage.
    Right, I'll tell all those Cambridge colleges that require FM for econ to **** off, yeah?
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Zacken)
    Right, I'll tell all those Cambridge colleges that require FM for econ to **** off, yeah?
    Lmfao PRSOM.. Friend has an offer for John's econ which includes an A* in FM. Clearly has no importance whatsoever
    Offline

    22
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Student403)
    Lmfao PRSOM.. Friend has an offer for John's econ which includes an A* in FM. Clearly has no importance whatsoever
    brb emailing Cambridge Admissions and telling them to stop asking CompSci's to do FM or STEP.
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Zacken)
    brb emailing Cambridge Admissions and telling them to stop asking CompSci's to do FM or STEP.
    Ikr STEP with compsci like what? Bet STEP wasn't even meant to be taken by CompSciers like wat even
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nexttime)
    [b]You were exposed to the fundamentals of differential equations and matrices outside of further maths? Perhaps the syllabus has changed since my time! [/b]

    Personally I think that for having to do such maths just days into your degree, further maths in its current format (where matrices and differential equations are only briefly touched on) would be useful. Very useful.
    No mate, we were exposed to the fundamentals during AL (A-Level). And it probably has done.

    (Original post by shamika)
    Maybe I'm comparing the maths you learn for physics at somewhere like Cambridge or Imperial... You'd have to learn group theory, the basics of quantum mechanics (mathematically I mean), how to solve plenty of DE's... It's similar in spirit to A-level core and further pure (ie you learn methods rather than proofs), but they are more complicated than anything you'd learn in A-level Further Maths.

    I'm assuming that level of maths is needed everywhere but maybe I'm mistaken
    I'd like to point out I was simply talking about the maths in my "Mathematics" module which is entirely pure. All that quantum sh*t you spoke about I didn't do it, however we've learned a whole bunch of mathematical bs in our other modules e.g., structural mechanics, fluid mechanics, soil mechanics etc. Similarly it's mostly methodical, however there are quite a few proofs in structures etc. More complicated than AL yes, however FM has set it up to be relatively easy for me in comparison to my non-FM at AL classmates.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Zacken)
    Right, I'll tell all those Cambridge colleges that require FM for econ to **** off, yeah?
    allow me. I forgot about economics.
    Also, one university is not majority as most don't ask for further for economics or physics even. OP wants to go for medicine which further maths is clearly not needed for.
 
 
 
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    What's your favourite Christmas sweets?
    Help with your A-levels

    All the essentials

    The adventure begins mug

    Student life: what to expect

    What it's really like going to uni

    Rosette

    Essay expert

    Learn to write like a pro with our ultimate essay guide.

    Uni match

    Uni match

    Our tool will help you find the perfect course for you

    Study planner

    Create a study plan

    Get your head around what you need to do and when with the study planner tool.

    Study planner

    Resources by subject

    Everything from mind maps to class notes.

    Hands typing

    Degrees without fees

    Discover more about degree-level apprenticeships.

    A student doing homework

    Study tips from A* students

    Students who got top grades in their A-levels share their secrets

    Study help links and info

    Can you help? Study help unanswered threadsRules and posting guidelines

    Sponsored content:

    HEAR

    HEAR

    Find out how a Higher Education Achievement Report can help you prove your achievements.

    Groups associated with this forum:

    View associated groups
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.