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    (Original post by up the levs)
    true this pitch was one of those high scoring piches so i guess credit to both sides bowlers, also i think that t20 is the one format that is almost always a thrilling game but odi is more skill + power and test is pure class. thats why, in my opinion, thrilling tests are the most beautiful form of the game
    Test cricket is sooo long, i myself rarely watch it apart from the Ashes (occasionally). t20 has literally evolved from an average score of maybe 140 -50 to the point where even 200 wont necessarily guarantee a win
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    just a bit of a different question, what did you guys think of that proposed test match world cup? idk i thought it was interesting but wouldnt be as popular with the majority of fans but just me
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    (Original post by A$aprocky)
    Test cricket is sooo long, i myself rarely watch it apart from the Ashes (occasionally). t20 has literally evolved from an average score of maybe 140 -50 to the point where even 200 wont necessarily guarantee a win
    thats true, as was evident with the south africa vs england match
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    (Original post by up the levs)
    thats true, as was evident with the south africa vs england match
    Exactly, that match was mental!
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    (Original post by up the levs)
    just a bit of a different question, what did you guys think of that proposed test match world cup? idk i thought it was interesting but wouldnt be as popular with the majority of fans but just me
    I personally don't see how it would really work as a World Cup per se. There's the shear length of each game, and the high % of games that end in draws. But in principle the idea would be good, as test cricket is largely dead in 'competitiveness,' with the exception of the Ashes. Perhaps a championship type system where there is just one massive points table, then have a final?


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    (Original post by Asklepios)
    I personally don't see how it would really work as a World Cup per se. There's the shear length of each game, and the high % of games that end in draws. But in principle the idea would be good, as test cricket is largely dead in 'competitiveness,' with the exception of the Ashes. Perhaps a championship type system where there is just one massive points table, then have a final?


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    that'd be something i'd watch as it would mean much more high quality international cricket but it would intervene with club cricket i.e. ipl and the emerging psl. That's how most players earn decent money so I don't see them opting for international tournaments
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    An extraordinary game of cricket. Now the dust has settled, I can think clearly. And while I'm disappointed, it seems clear English cricket is in a great place. Just look at where the team is now compared with 12 months ago. Credit to Strauss, credit to Bayliss, credit to the players.

    Congratulations to the Windies. They are T20's entertainers. A really great side. It seems such a shame that this will be the last time we see the majority of this team together, to be honest. They have three victories - the Under-19s, the women, and the men - and the West Indies Cricket Board need to give their players a future in the game.

    I feel desperately sorry for Stokes, but he stepped up and was punished. I'd rather a player stepped up and failed than shirked away and didn't try. In truth, I thought the top order for England let the side down a hell of a lot more than Stokes. Hales/Roy offered nothing today, Morgan was once again ineffective (an average of 13 across the tournament is shambolic), and even Root - who shone at times (as well as surpassing KP's 2010 record of hitting 248 runs in the World Twenty20) - got out to an absolute brain fart of a shot.

    In other news, isn't it farcical how Moeen bats ahead of Willey? The guy averages 14, compared to Willey's 40, and has been out for a duck 6 times in his last 15 T20 innings. Willey played really well again today. I thought all of England's bowlers shone, bar Stokes perhaps. Jordan again showed his death bowling quality, and Plunkett was battered here there and everywhere, but Willey's 7 wickets from powerplays was the most of any bowler in the tournament and shows his promise. Rashid cost less than six an over, too.

    Why wasn't Moeen given the ball at all? Root didn't bowl at all after getting his two wickets, and if Moeen isn't deployed, why is he in the team as an all-rounder?

    Morgan showed once again that he has a canny knack for making the right decisions as captain. He lost the toss (but the toss isn't everything, as represented by the tightness of the game) but his decision to throw the ball to Root was extremely effective. Gayle and the Windies openers seemed absolutely bemused - and it paid off for England. The four openers scored just 6 runs today. That just shows the batting quality both sides have further down the order.

    The Windies never stop believing, though. They can thank Samuels and Brathwaite, who proved the Windies have 15 match-winners in their squad and have heavy hitting right through the setup. Remarkable stuff.

    England were strangled with the bat - they scored only 33 in the powerplay, their lowest in six overs. Badree's figures of 2-16, with 14 dot balls, showed how impressive he can be, and Benn was excellent too.
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    Great game of cricket. Only saw the first innings, but kept an eye on the rest of the match. I was one of those fans that didn't really give WI a chance to win the title, but they showed the experience and match winners that they have. Commiserations to England, but considering they lost to WI in their opening game, they showed a lot of character and ability to come back and end up as runners-up. Both teams played really good cricket in the tournament, as a whole.

    Brathwaite was, obviously, exceptional to get 4 sixes in the last over, but WI shouldn't have really let it get down to needing 19 of the last over anyway. WI, as a whole, definitely do have brains, but Sammy as a batsman, I am not so sure. So many times, he has come in and just gone for the big shot and got himself out when the team needed him. He didn't have a good tournament, as a batsman, but his captaincy was pretty decent. He was lucky that someone stepped up in every match, with only the bowlers being consistent (mainly Badree), though.

    This year has been exceptional for WI having one 3 world cups, but there is still a long way to go for them. The pinnacle of cricket is test cricket, and they need to become more competitive in that format. Still, congratulations to them and they are definitely going to party long and hard for this victory! Hopefully, the board give them more support and organise more tours for them! Cricket will be a much better place when WI are a strong team again.

    It's weird that both captains were pedestrian, at best, with the bat in the tournament and they still found themselves in the final.

    Stokes will definitely come back from this stronger, but he must be feeling so upset and down about that last over.

    Has been a successful world cup which has been really fun to watch and be a part of! Obviously, am sad that India didn't win but life goes on!

    Will post my team of the tournament soon
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    (Original post by moment of truth)
    This year has been exceptional for WI having one 3 world cups, but there is still a long way to go for them. The pinnacle of cricket is test cricket, and they need to become more competitive in that format. Still, congratulations to them and they are definitely going to party long and hard for this victory! Hopefully, the board give them more support and organise more tours for them! Cricket will be a much better place when WI are a strong team again.

    It's weird that both captains were pedestrian, at best, with the bat in the tournament and they still found themselves in the final.

    Will post my team of the tournament soon
    Will post my team of the tournament tomorrow!

    Stokes will come back stronger. He's such a talent, and he stepped up when it mattered today. You can't say anything to console him on nights like tonight, because the emotion is so raw and the repercussions so clear.

    He's the future of English cricket, alongside Root. The latter was an exceptional figure for us, throughout the tournament, and I don't think that anybody could have argued had the Player of the Tournament award gone to him rather than Kohli.

    The Windies are a curious outfit. You can never write them off, but even when Pakistan and SL are ran so badly, they can't hold a torch to the WICB. The whole system in the Carribbean is a joke.

    I don't begrudge the T20 giants chasing a paycheque to be honest. The WICB have shown them no loyalty, no security. No wonder Sammy was so livid post-match today, and aimed his ire at the selectors/board.

    But, you're absolutely right, Test cricket is the pinnacle and it's just a tragedy we aren't seeing the likes of Gayle in cricket whites.

    The Windies players are practically guns for hire: open to the highest bidder, travelling the world and picking up big pay days for smashing the ball in the world's best T20 competitions and entertaining millions. No shame in that. But, it's so soul-destroying for those of us who love nothing more than a five-day Test match.

    Remember how poor WI were in Australia at Christmas? It was one of the most one-sides series I've ever seen. Bangladesh would have beaten them. So would Zimbabwe.

    Something needs to change.
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    (Original post by Mackay)
    X.
    Neat summation of today's game. West Indies nearly contrived to throw it away - Gayle's style is what it is but he was so premature in trying to get rid of Root when it was clear what their gameplan was. Bit of patience wouldn't have gone amiss.

    On Moeen, his place is in serious jeopardy. As soon as he did his usual waft ball before, it looked ominous. I think Rashid would keep his place but maybe when Zafar Ansari is fit he'll take Moeen's place - left armer, not bad with the bat, is worth a go. On the whole though, positives for England. Only Morgan played in the 2010 final - the spine of this team (Roy, Root, Buttler, Willey, Stokes) have had experience of this game so it should bode well for them when they are in a big final next time round.

    West Indies' future should be promising but with the battles with the Board, hesitant to say that with confidence.

    Also, seems Flintoff and Atherton may have squashed their beef with their punditry spell today!
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    (Original post by Aky786UK)
    Neat summation of today's game. West Indies nearly contrived to throw it away - Gayle's style is what it is but he was so premature in trying to get rid of Root when it was clear what their gameplan was. Bit of patience wouldn't have gone amiss.

    On Moeen, his place is in serious jeopardy. As soon as he did his usual waft ball before, it looked ominous. I think Rashid would keep his place but maybe when Zafar Ansari is fit he'll take Moeen's place - left armer, not bad with the bat, is worth a go. On the whole though, positives for England. Only Morgan played in the 2010 final - the spine of this team (Roy, Root, Buttler, Willey, Stokes) have had experience of this game so it should bode well for them when they are in a big final next time round.

    West Indies' future should be promising but with the battles with the Board, hesitant to say that with confidence.

    Also, seems Flintoff and Atherton may have squashed their beef with their punditry spell today!
    Thanks, mate.

    I think Morgan throwing the ball to Root just played with the Windies' heads. They expected Plunkett, maybe Willey, at a push Rashid or Moeen. But Root?

    Gayle was probably caught between playing Root out safely to hold his wicket, and chasing the runs because he's not a fully-fledged bowler.

    It was a stroke of genius from Morgan.

    Completely agree. The future is so bright for this English side. With Farbrace, Bayliss and Strauss, I think we can do great things in all three formats over the next five years. Root, Stokes and Buttler will be the core players to anchor any success.

    Great shout re. Ansari. Hopefully his hand fully recovers soon. I was gutted for him when he had to pull out of the squad pre-debut.
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    (Original post by Mackay)
    Will post my team of the tournament tomorrow!

    Stokes will come back stronger. He's such a talent, and he stepped up when it mattered today. You can't say anything to console him on nights like tonight, because the emotion is so raw and the repercussions so clear.

    He's the future of English cricket, alongside Root. The latter was an exceptional figure for us, throughout the tournament, and I don't think that anybody could have argued had the Player of the Tournament award gone to him rather than Kohli.

    The Windies are a curious outfit. You can never write them off, but even when Pakistan and SL are ran so badly, they can't hold a torch to the WICB. The whole system in the Carribbean is a joke.

    I don't begrudge the T20 giants chasing a paycheque to be honest. The WICB have shown them no loyalty, no security. No wonder Sammy was so livid post-match today, and aimed his ire at the selectors/board.

    But, you're absolutely right, Test cricket is the pinnacle and it's just a tragedy we aren't seeing the likes of Gayle in cricket whites.

    The Windies players are practically guns for hire: open to the highest bidder, travelling the world and picking up big pay days for smashing the ball in the world's best T20 competitions and entertaining millions. No shame in that. But, it's so soul-destroying for those of us who love nothing more than a five-day Test match.

    Remember how poor WI were in Australia at Christmas? It was one of the most one-sides series I've ever seen. Bangladesh would have beaten them. So would Zimbabwe.

    Something needs to change.
    Yep, agreed! The whole team will be in pain, but it's worse for him. Still, he will come back stronger, similar to Broad after Yuvraj smashing him for 6 maximums!

    There isn't much to say about Joe Root, to be fair. He really is the future and has the ability to be the one of the greatest batsmen's of all time.

    It's such a shame, because when the WI are good and are able to play, they can be ridiculously good (similar to Pakistan). If only the WICB gave them the chance.

    Like you said, I don't blame them, at all. It is completely understandable that they only have the motivation to play T20 cricket in domestic leagues all around the world, instead of putting the hard graft of test cricket. For me, test cricket will always be the pinnacle and teams should always strive to be the best in test matches. I admire that about English cricket.

    Yep, they were awful. Carlos Brathwaite was one of the positives and it's good that they stuck with him for this tournament.
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    (Original post by Mackay)
    Moeen.
    I think poor captaincy was the downfall of England today. The way Badree/Rashid/Root bowled showed that the pitch was offering some assistance. Could've utilised Moeen for at least 2 or 3 overs to stem the run flow but he was essentially just a fielder today. He failed with the bat but so did Roy and Hales so it's a bit unfair to blame him. But, I reckon he should've redeemed himself with the ball and Morgan will rue his decision not to deploy him.

    Anyway, this England team should not be too disheartened. Only a year ago they were on a downward spiral heading nowhere. No set team. No sense of direction. No confidence. Now, they are IMO one of the best T20 teams in the World and they have a decent bowling but a strong batting unit. Bayliss and Morgan deserve all the credit. We have found a star in Willey and Roy and the team looks more or less settled.

    Onwards and upwards!


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    (Original post by moment of truth)
    Yep, agreed! The whole team will be in pain, but it's worse for him. Still, he will come back stronger, similar to Broad after Yuvraj smashing him for 6 maximums!

    Like you said, I don't blame them, at all. It is completely understandable that they only have the motivation to play T20 cricket in domestic leagues all around the world, instead of putting the hard graft of test cricket. For me, test cricket will always be the pinnacle and teams should always strive to be the best in test matches. I admire that about English cricket.

    Yep, they were awful. Carlos Brathwaite was one of the positives and it's good that they stuck with him for this tournament.
    I was thinking earlier: Stokes just needs to look at Broad, and how he has reached his prime in his late-20s. Stokes has a heck of a career ahead of him.

    Brathwaite in only his eighth T20, too. Remarkable that he had the presence of mind and cool-head to just flick those balls away for six in the final over. Stokes will be a key all-rounder, possibly the best of his generation, and a key figure for England in the decade to come. You imagine today will be Brathwaite's career highlight, but Stokes' lowlight.

    Absolutely. I love Test cricket. Nothing beats it.

    (Original post by Enginerd.)
    I think poor captaincy was the downfall of England today. The way Badree/Rashid/Root bowled showed that the pitch was offering some assistance. Could've utilised Moeen for at least 2 or 3 overs to stem the run flow but he was essentially just a fielder today. He failed with the bat but so did Roy and Hales so it's a bit unfair to blame him. But, I reckon he should've redeemed himself with the ball and Morgan will rue his decision not to deploy him.

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    Agree with everything you say, but I'm unsure the pitch offered assistance. Badree/Benn are skiddy wrist bowlers. The pitch didn't really aid them, the ball just skidded on. Roy's dismissal was a prime example. It was a carbon copy of the way he got out against NZ.
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    (Original post by Aky786UK)
    Neat summation of today's game. West Indies nearly contrived to throw it away - Gayle's style is what it is but he was so premature in trying to get rid of Root when it was clear what their gameplan was. Bit of patience wouldn't have gone amiss.

    On Moeen, his place is in serious jeopardy. As soon as he did his usual waft ball before, it looked ominous. I think Rashid would keep his place but maybe when Zafar Ansari is fit he'll take Moeen's place - left armer, not bad with the bat, is worth a go. On the whole though, positives for England. Only Morgan played in the 2010 final - the spine of this team (Roy, Root, Buttler, Willey, Stokes) have had experience of this game so it should bode well for them when they are in a big final next time round.

    West Indies' future should be promising but with the battles with the Board, hesitant to say that with confidence.

    Also, seems Flintoff and Atherton may have squashed their beef with their punditry spell today!
    Agree so much!! I understand Charles going after Root but gameplan of off-spinner to Gayle was so obvious no idea why he fell right into the trap.

    Mooen hasn't been great but his role with the bat I don't think suits him best. I think he'd be best at 4 but with Root and Morfan there replacing Mooen wouldn't be bad shout although i have to be honest and say I know Ansari's FC credentials but not seen enough of him in Limited Overs to know if he's a 'hitter' or not. Whereas Willey is given license to biff th ball in Limited overs even when opening for Northants in T20.

    Although not so confident of Windies future still plenty of development required for U19 Winners and worry they won't get that development as much as English, Indian, Aussie players etc. Look at Darren Bravo few yrs ago was one of best youngsters equal stats to Lara after something like 13 Tests. Now well adrift of Kohli, Williamson etc. Natural talentvonly gets you so far.
    Also as Mackay rightly points out its many of these players last ICC tournament and potentially last game in a Windies shirt.We should have enough to be competitive in T20s in future - though wonder who the spinners will be given that there are so many 'successful' spinners in Windies but largely a result of awful pitches Nagpur-esque
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    My team of the tournament:

    1) Jason Roy - played two fantastic knocks, against SA and NZ in must win games. He failed in the final, but overall he had a good tournament.

    2) Kane Williamson (captain) - Didn't have the best tournament with the bat, it must be said, but he still produced a few key innings. He rallied his team very well as a young captain and showed that NZ cricket is in very safe hands after Brendon McCullum retired.

    3)Virat Kohli - don't think I have to say much about why he's in here :lol:

    4) Joe Root - Was behind Virat Kohli in the list for the man of the tournament, I would think. He stood up when his team needed him playing a match winning knock against SA and scoring a battling 50 against WI in the final. Has a huge future, as everyone already knows.

    5) Angelo Mathews - really struggled for this position. Mathews played as a one-man team, pretty much. No-one else in SL stood up. He nearly took them over the line against England, and his bowling is normally economical.

    6) MS Dhoni (wk) - His captaincy fell apart a little in the semis against WI, but other than that he was good. Behind the stumps, he showed the speed that he has as well as his ability. He did drop a couple of catches, but I didn't see a better wicketkeeper in the tournament.

    7) Dwayne Bravo - Arguably, the best death bowler in the world. He didn't show his ability with the bat in the tournament, though.

    8) David Willey - Was excellent with the new ball in basically every game. Showed his ability with the bat against Afghanistan and WI, too.

    9) Mitchell Santner - Was between him and Ish Sodhi, but as I have already included Samuel Badree, Santner gets it. Was an integral part of their run in the group stages. Also has ability with the bat in the lower order.

    10) Samuel Badree - The best spin bowler in the tournament. His record speaks for itself.

    11) Mustafizur Rahman - This guy has an incredible future in cricket. At only 20 years old, he already makes some of the best batsman in the world look ordinary (see his battle against Williamson). He didn't play every game due to injury (I think?), but he when he did play, he was exceptional.

    Noticeable mentions - Mohammad Shahzad, Martin Guptill, Usman Khawaja, Ish Sodhi, Jasprit Bumrah, Ashish Nehra and Mohammad Amir.
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    (Original post by Enginerd.)
    I think poor captaincy was the downfall of England today. The way Badree/Rashid/Root bowled showed that the pitch was offering some assistance. Could've utilised Moeen for at least 2 or 3 overs to stem the run flow but he was essentially just a fielder today. He failed with the bat but so did Roy and Hales so it's a bit unfair to blame him. But, I reckon he should've redeemed himself with the ball and Morgan will rue his decision not to deploy him


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    With DJ Bravo struggling with pace and Rashid I think Morgan was petrified of giving him and Windies an opportunity to gain momentum. Of course Mooen could've got a hattrick for all we know but he'd be quite predictable whereas Rashid has googly to use and is quite skiddy so Windies batsmen were hesitant to attack him.

    I actually think Morgan regarding bowling options was very clever - used Root 2nd over nabbed 2 wickets kept pressure on Windies players by not turning to Mooen or trying to sneak in cheap extra overs from Root. Jordan over Stokes for final over maybe but no-one would have questioned Morgan using Jordan in 19th over when he left Stokes 19 to defend. Bowling in the final over is as much about skill as character and Stokes has the character so actually I understand Morgan's choice there.

    And then Brathwaite - I've been advocate of him being in Limited Overs side for few yrs now and Test side for a while aswell so glad he's gotten his chance. In Tests think he's even more crucial for balance of our side. Think only with both Holder and Brathwaite playing can we really go 5 bowlers imo. Tempted to give him Joint Man of the Match as his bowling earlier was crucial. With Russell hit and miss, Badree bowled out, Benn struggling and DJ Bravo largely being saved for death his overs in the middle were crucial and he probs stopped England getting another 30 runs by getting 2 best batsmen out and crucial wicket of Willey.
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    (Original post by moment of truth)
    My team of the tournament:

    1) Jason Roy - played two fantastic knocks, against SA and NZ in must win games. He failed in the final, but overall he had a good tournament.

    2) Kane Williamson (captain) - Didn't have the best tournament with the bat, it must be said, but he still produced a few key innings. He rallied his team very well as a young captain and showed that NZ cricket is in very safe hands after Brendon McCullum retired.

    3)Virat Kohli - don't think I have to say much about why he's in here :lol:

    4) Joe Root - Was behind Virat Kohli in the list for the man of the tournament, I would think. He stood up when his team needed him playing a match winning knock against SA and scoring a battling 50 against WI in the final. Has a huge future, as everyone already knows.

    5) Angelo Mathews - really struggled for this position. Mathews played as a one-man team, pretty much. No-one else in SL stood up. He nearly took them over the line against England, and his bowling is normally economical.

    6) MS Dhoni (wk) - His captaincy fell apart a little in the semis against WI, but other than that he was good. Behind the stumps, he showed the speed that he has as well as his ability. He did drop a couple of catches, but I didn't see a better wicketkeeper in the tournament.

    7) Dwayne Bravo - Arguably, the best death bowler in the world. He didn't show his ability with the bat in the tournament, though.

    8) David Willey - Was excellent with the new ball in basically every game. Showed his ability with the bat against Afghanistan and WI, too.

    9) Mitchell Santner - Was between him and Ish Sodhi, but as I have already included Samuel Badree, Santner gets it. Was an integral part of their run in the group stages. Also has ability with the bat in the lower order.

    10) Samuel Badree - The best spin bowler in the tournament. His record speaks for itself.

    11) Mustafizur Rahman - This guy has an incredible future in cricket. At only 20 years old, he already makes some of the best batsman in the world look ordinary (see his battle against Williamson). He didn't play every game due to injury (I think?), but he when he did play, he was exceptional.

    Noticeable mentions - Mohammad Shahzad, Martin Guptill, Usman Khawaja, Ish Sodhi, Jasprit Bumrah, Ashish Nehra and Mohammad Amir.
    Shazhad for Williamson (more for his impact then necessarily his record)

    Tahir for Santner. Difficult choice for No.11 one of Bumrah, Nehra or Mustafizur for me. And Buttler for Dhoni otherwise my XI would probably be the same.
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    Here's my alternative team (1 player from each Super 10 side and then an associate) not neccessarily the best player for their country but also considering balance of side.

    Tamim
    Sharjeel
    Kohli
    Watson
    Mathews
    Buttler (wk)
    Nabi
    DJ Bravo
    Sodhi
    Van Meekeren (Holland)
    I Tahir

    Have tried to aim for both depth in batting and multiple bowling options. Was gonna pick Root but didn't know who for keeper as having Dhoni would mean no Kohli. Also Watsom for latter half of group stage.

    Do you guys think this side or your own version of this XI could beat your country in a one off T20 game

    Should also note that if I had choice in pitch this would be for T20 in Nagpur
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    (Original post by JoJo9)
    Shazhad for Williamson (more for his impact then necessarily his record)

    Tahir for Santner. Difficult choice for No.11 one of Bumrah, Nehra or Mustafizur for me. And Buttler for Dhoni otherwise my XI would probably be the same.
    I understand why would say those changes. Who would be your captain then?
 
 
 
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