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Does rape culture exist? (POLL) Watch

  • View Poll Results: Does Rape Culture Exist?
    Yes
    136
    35.70%
    No
    214
    56.17%
    I don't know
    31
    8.14%

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    This case shows how much of a rape culture we live in
    http://www.southendstandard.co.uk/ne...meless_father/
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    Anyone who says the UK or even the West has a rape culture is a ****ing moron.

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    (Original post by TheOpinion)
    Rape culture is a term that was coined by feminists in the United States in the 1970's. It was designed to show the ways in which society blamed victims of sexual assault and normalized male sexual violence. I did copy paste that, I wasn't sure how to best describe it.
    Yes, it does. It's improving rapidly, but you are always hearing questions of "what were they wearing? Were they flirting? Were they out late? Were they drinking? Were they already engaged in sexual activity?"

    It's in the news all the time, so yes, something still exists here in the UK. I was told by a well meaning father of a friend (!) a few years ago that if I went for a walk on the local golf course on my own I would be "asking for it".

    Elsewhere in the world it obviously exists.
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    (Original post by DiddyDec)
    Anyone who says the UK or even the West has a rape culture is a ****ing moron.

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    Explain yourself.
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    (Original post by leavingthecity)
    Explain yourself.
    Rape is considered one of the worst crimes someone can commit, worse than murder in some cases. It is anything but social accepted. You can have your life ruined for simply being accused.

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    (Original post by DiddyDec)
    Rape is considered one of the worst crimes someone can commit, worse than murder in some cases. It is anything but social accepted. You can have your life ruined for simply being accused.

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    Ah, sorry I misunderstood you. Rape culture in this context is not about rape being socially acceptable, but that excuses for it are still engrained in our culture from the good old days of us being the possessions of men.
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    (Original post by leavingthecity)
    Ah, sorry I misunderstood you. Rape culture in this context is not about rape being socially acceptable, but that excuses for it are still engrained in our culture from the good old days of us being the possessions of men.
    And are those excuses accepted? No
    Now if a woman even reports a man for rape that mans life is ruined at that point, look at the case i posted he is still labeled a rapist even after the woman has been accused of making a false accusation.
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    (Original post by leavingthecity)
    Ah, sorry I misunderstood you. Rape culture in this context is not about rape being socially acceptable, but that excuses for it are still engrained in our culture from the good old days of us being the possessions of men.
    Firstly, I would point out that a different word should be used for what you're describing, because rape culture clearly implies a culture which accepts rape. So using the phrase 'rape culture' to refer to something different is at best misleading, and at worst deliberately lying to try and gain support for a side of an argument.

    Secondly, I don't agree that people excuse rape in the West. I have never come across someone suggesting women who dress provocatively deserve rape or bring it on themselves. I've heard people say that if you dress provocatively and walk around in dodgy areas late at night you increase the chance, but that isn't the same thing.
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    (Original post by Luke Kostanjsek)
    Firstly, I would point out that a different word should be used for what you're describing, because rape culture clearly implies a culture which accepts rape. So using the phrase 'rape culture' to refer to something different is at best misleading, and at worst deliberately lying to try and gain support for a side of an argument.

    Secondly, I don't agree that people excuse rape in the West. I have never come across someone suggesting women who dress provocatively deserve rape or bring it on themselves. I've heard people say that if you dress provocatively and walk around in dodgy areas late at night you increase the chance, but that isn't the same thing.
    As explained above by ThOpinion, this thread is about 'rape culture' as in the 1979's feminist definition.

    Back then it made sense as a term in academic circles at least, but it is obvious that the younger posters on here are confused by the term, which in today's Western context, is misleading.

    Now if you have not come across a woman being partially blamed for her own rape, then you have lived a sheltered life indeed. Google will help you now.
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    (Original post by joecphillips)
    And are those excuses accepted? No
    Now if a woman even reports a man for rape that mans life is ruined at that point, look at the case i posted he is still labeled a rapist even after the woman has been accused of making a false accusation.
    Your argument and POV is essentially a product of the celebrity witch hunt in the wake of the crimes commuted by Jimmy Savile.

    Previous to this, yes, in court those things would go against you and determine the ruling. 30 years ago certainly, women would often not report rapists because they were too embarrassed to be put through such questioning in a court room. You may have been asked the length of your skirt, or the type of underwear you were wearing back in those days.

    Today, this does not happen here in the UK, though rapes and sex crimes still occur because there are many backward men who believe that certain behaviour is 'asking for it'.

    Again, the thread you created and referred to; this is something that has been in the news a great deal post Jimmy Savile because there have been some women who have seen in the media the devastating effect that an accusation can have abuse it, because the police have deviated from what should be 'innocent until proven guilty' over the course of this witch hunt.
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    (Original post by leavingthecity)
    As explained above by ThOpinion, this thread is about 'rape culture' as in the 1979's feminist definition.

    Back then it made sense as a term in academic circles at least, but it is obvious that the younger posters on here are confused by the term, which in today's Western context, is misleading.

    Now if you have not come across a woman being partially blamed for her own rape, then you have lived a sheltered life indeed. Google will help you now.
    That's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying no woman is ever blamed for being raped in Britain, there are always going to be some morons who say dumb ****. But to refer to it as a culture implies the problem is pervasive across society, that it's a widespread thing. And I haven't seen any evidence to suggest that this is the case. I've never seen it suggested in any media outlet that women are in any way responsible for a sexual assault they suffer, I've never seen it suggested in law that that should be the case. There isn't anything - so far as I can see - to suggest that this attitude is widespread across Britain, or the West in general.

    The closest we've come is polls that return a figure around 20% of people saying that if the women was very drunk at the time, then she is partly responsible. But these polls typically have the same two issues. Firstly, they always disproportionately contain ethnic minorities - because apparently they're racist otherwise - and people from countries in the middle east and north africa especially have a very different view of women to us, which skews the numbers. Secondly, they're worded in a way which invites misunderstanding. For instance, if someone gets very drunk and hence is taken advantage of sexually, did her actions somewhat lead to her sexual assault? Well, yes, they did. That doesn't mean to say she's to blame, not at all, but her actions did contribute to what happens to her. It's like asking if you don't lock your front door at night, are you responsible for being robbed? To an extent, yes you are. You aren't to blame, but what you chose to do made it easier for someone to commit that crime.
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    (Original post by leavingthecity)
    Your argument and POV is essentially a product of the celebrity witch hunt in the wake of the crimes commuted by Jimmy Savile.

    Previous to this, yes, in court those things would go against you and determine the ruling. 30 years ago certainly, women would often not report rapists because they were too embarrassed to be put through such questioning in a court room. You may have been asked the length of your skirt, or the type of underwear you were wearing back in those days.

    Today, this does not happen here in the UK, though rapes and sex crimes still occur because there are many backward men who believe that certain behaviour is 'asking for it'.

    Again, the thread you created and referred to; this is something that has been in the news a great deal post Jimmy Savile because there have been some women who have seen in the media the devastating effect that an accusation can have abuse it, because the police have deviated from what should be 'innocent until proven guilty' over the course of this witch hunt.
    Your argument is it happened 30 years ago and their are still a few scumbags around.

    It still shows that rape isnt accepted.

    There is one group of people who can basically get away woth this and it is women.
    One teaching assistant slept with a student 50 times and got a suspended sentence whereas a man doesnt even have to sleep with a woman to be jailed.
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    Not in the UK to the extent that there is in other countries. But still, yes. I think a lot of people get offended and misinterpret rape culture as meaning a culture in which men rape and think it's ok to rape and it's all men's faults blablabla, which it isn't.

    To my mind, it just means a culture in which men who do commit rape find it easier, due to certain factors, including victim blaming, perceived blurred lines over what constitutes rape, low conviction rates, and so on. That kind of culture allows men to carry out acts that they otherwise might not be able to.

    PS it's not just men who rape, but there is certainly not a 'culture' surrounding female rape in my opinion.
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    (Original post by abc:))
    Not in the UK to the extent that there is in other countries. But still, yes. I think a lot of people get offended and misinterpret rape culture as meaning a culture in which men rape and think it's ok to rape and it's all men's faults blablabla, which it isn't.

    To my mind, it just means a culture in which men who do commit rape find it easier, due to certain factors, including victim blaming, perceived blurred lines over what constitutes rape, low conviction rates, and so on. That kind of culture allows men to carry out acts that they otherwise might not be able to.

    PS it's not just men who rape, but there is certainly not a 'culture' surrounding female rape in my opinion.
    Except for women it is the first it is accepted and they get much shorter sentences for more serious crimes and people just say the victim should be happy a woman is sleeping with them.
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    Not in the UK. In places like the Congo then yes.
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    (Original post by Luke Kostanjsek)
    That's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying no woman is ever blamed for being raped in Britain, there are always going to be some morons who say dumb ****. But to refer to it as a culture implies the problem is pervasive across society, that it's a widespread thing. And I haven't seen any evidence to suggest that this is the case. I've never seen it suggested in any media outlet that women are in any way responsible for a sexual assault they suffer, I've never seen it suggested in law that that should be the case. There isn't anything - so far as I can see - to suggest that this attitude is widespread across Britain, or the West in general.

    The closest we've come is polls that return a figure around 20% of people saying that if the women was very drunk at the time, then she is partly responsible. But these polls typically have the same two issues. Firstly, they always disproportionately contain ethnic minorities - because apparently they're racist otherwise - and people from countries in the middle east and north africa especially have a very different view of women to us, which skews the numbers. Secondly, they're worded in a way which invites misunderstanding. For instance, if someone gets very drunk and hence is taken advantage of sexually, did her actions somewhat lead to her sexual assault? Well, yes, they did. That doesn't mean to say she's to blame, not at all, but her actions did contribute to what happens to her. It's like asking if you don't lock your front door at night, are you responsible for being robbed? To an extent, yes you are. You aren't to blame, but what you chose to do made it easier for someone to commit that crime.
    I agree with all of this, apart from it not being widespread. I think it is quite common in one subtle form or other, though yes, calling a rape culture just doesn't sound appropriate anymore.
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    (Original post by joecphillips)
    Your argument is it happened 30 years ago and their are still a few scumbags around.

    It still shows that rape isnt accepted.

    There is one group of people who can basically get away woth this and it is women.
    One teaching assistant slept with a student 50 times and got a suspended sentence whereas a man doesnt even have to sleep with a woman to be jailed.
    No, no it's not my argument.

    Neither is my argument that rape is accepted. Come on have you read my comment/definitions given by others above?

    Now your comments about rape accusations are a serious, however different subject. Either integrate them properly into the debate instead of shooting off examples, or start a new thread debate about the abuse/ sentencing injustice.
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    (Original post by leavingthecity)
    Yes, it does. It's improving rapidly, but you are always hearing questions of "what were they wearing? Were they flirting? Were they out late? Were they drinking? Were they already engaged in sexual activity?"

    It's in the news all the time, so yes, something still exists here in the UK. I was told by a well meaning father of a friend (!) a few years ago that if I went for a walk on the local golf course on my own I would be "asking for it".

    Elsewhere in the world it obviously exists.
    The burden of risk lies on the potential victim, but the burden of blame lies on the perpetrator in my opinion.

    The whole 'teach your child not to rape' thing gets on my nerves. There of course needs to be better safeguards but there also needs to be some precautions taken. Basically I could say, teach your child not to steal, so I don't have to put locks on my door.
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    (Original post by TheOpinion)
    The burden of risk lies on the potential victim, but the burden of blame lies on the perpetrator in my opinion.

    The whole 'teach your child not to rape' thing gets on my nerves. There of course needs to be better safeguards but there also needs to be some precautions taken. Basically I could say, teach your child not to steal, so I don't have to put locks on my door.
    Exactly, the precautions need to be taken not because we are victim blaming but because bad people exist and always will.

    But still there's a good deal of work I be done in some sections of society in their attitudes toward sex.

    ....so you could say that there is no ONE rape culture today, but there is one within certain socio-economic groups.

    I'm guessing you'd like to scrap the term? Understandable. Me too.
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    (Original post by leavingthecity)
    As explained above by ThOpinion, this thread is about 'rape culture' as in the 1979's feminist definition.

    Back then it made sense as a term in academic circles at least, but it is obvious that the younger posters on here are confused by the term, which in today's Western context, is misleading.
    The term says that it normalises male sexual violence which is pretty clear that this has not occurred in the modern West.

    Are you calling me a younger poster?

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