Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Does rape culture exist? (POLL) Watch

  • View Poll Results: Does Rape Culture Exist?
    Yes
    136
    35.70%
    No
    214
    56.17%
    I don't know
    31
    8.14%

    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    Of course not. Most people wouldn't murder someone - but most people also wouldn't casually stab/attack someone. Most people wouldn't rape someone - but a lot of people would probably grope/harrass someone.
    Are you saying that there is a sliding scale of rape?

    There is a group of people who can get away with groping people they are called women but if a man does it, it isn't accepted
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Jack Roland)
    Look, i'm not disagreeing with what you have to say. But every man would act differently in different situations. This idea of "we live in a rape culture, therefore be afraid of men" is completely incorrect. For one thing, for every man that will actually grope or rape a girl, there are another 3, 5 or more that would never do that. That is what makes rape so difficult to stamp out. It isn't a culture, or a trend, or a society. It is the actions of individuals, and you simply cannot prevent every low-life from doing what they do best. At some point (although we are from this point) there has to be an element of okay, we will never be rid of this small minority of people, and so we must instead act on the cases we have in court and also on the courage of the victim.

    The reason rape/sexual assault convictions aren't higher, is like the other poster said, it is a very difficult crime to prove. If it comes down to one word against another, whatever the emotions, you cannot sentence a man based on that alone, especially due to the relatively common rate of false rape accusations these days. Of course the sentencing rate for rape should be higher, but like burglary and a drove of other crimes, we operate on a system of innocent until proven guilty, and we must stick to this system for the sake of justice. Young men are already losing their jobs, their lives, their families, their educations to false rape accusations, and so this is why, with a clear conscience, we cannot simply accept the words of the victim 100% of the time.
    Of course I understand that rape will never be completely wiped out, like every kind of crime, however horrific they are. Of course individuals are the ones who act - but it's individuals who make up society, and individuals who make up culture. For example - racism in America. Not everyone in America is racist, and the media purports that racism is wrong, and a lot of people would say they are against racism. Yet casual, institutional, and legal racism still exists in America.
    Here, not everyone is a rapist, and the media says that rape is wrong, and many people would agree.. but many people (of our age!) think that the bodies of males and females are public property, to be exploited, including educated young males at University, and that is wrong.
    And people seem to be suggesting that it's okay that we get groped, catcalled, followed home, that it's okay that we get raped, and silenced, and we don't have a big problem - and all of you are men.
    I'm not saying that men don't experience sexual assault - because they do, and they're most often scared of reporting it (stigma, another feature of rape culture). But all of you are denying that any males accept rape and that it's not a problem, and that low prosecution rates are to be expected, and it's just tough luck.
    It's just tough luck and rape will always happen and it's not rape culture its just normal in any society and most men wouldn't ever do that (normalisation of rape, another feature).
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by joecphillips)
    Are you saying that there is a sliding scale of rape?

    There is a group of people who can get away with groping people they are called women but if a man does it, it isn't accepted
    Not of rape, but of rape culture.
    As I've already said, rape culture is made up of many different features and is constantly evolving.
    And you've just added strength to my point - that is one of the features of rape culture - the belief that if it happens to a man, it is acceptable. I've never said that is acceptable and sexual assault on males is in fact one of the prominent features of today's rape culture because males are facing the same challenges women did back in 1975 - stigmatization, shame, and victim blame.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    Not of rape, but of rape culture.
    As I've already said, rape culture is made up of many different features and is constantly evolving.
    And you've just added strength to my point - that is one of the features of rape culture - the belief that if it happens to a man, it is acceptable. I've never said that is acceptable and sexual assault on males is in fact one of the prominent features of today's rape culture because males are facing the same challenges women did back in 1975 - stigmatization, shame, and victim blame.
    Rape isn't something that is made up of many different features, it is like saying we live in a murder culture because people punch each other, threaten violence and people say things like you should of just hit them back.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by joecphillips)
    Rape isn't something that is made up of many different features, it is like saying we live in a murder culture because people punch each other, threaten violence and people say things like you should of just hit them back.
    Rape as an act isn't made up of features - but rape as a concept is, and rape culture certainly is. If I was threatened with murder on a nearly daily basis I would most definitely say we live in a murder culture or at least, a violent one. As it is, I've never been threatened with murder nor have I been attacked.
    For example, I am threatened with rape on a daily basis when gaming, by really young kids. If I was a man, they wouldn't use this threat. It's worrying that children of the age of 10 think rape is an acceptable threat to use against a woman.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    Rape as an act isn't made up of features - but rape as a concept is, and rape culture certainly is. If I was threatened with murder on a nearly daily basis I would most definitely say we live in a murder culture or at least, a violent one. As it is, I've never been threatened with murder nor have I been attacked.
    For example, I am threatened with rape on a daily basis when gaming, by really young kids. If I was a man, they wouldn't use this threat. It's worrying that children of the age of 10 think rape is an acceptable threat to use against a woman.
    So your argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online.
    Do you believe these are credible threats or just kids online trying to act big? When they grow up people realise that stuff isn't accepted.

    Latest statistics say there are 33,431 Incidents of rape (police recorded) and overall 99,609 incidents of sexual offences

    Compared with 403,957 incidents of violent crime with injury and 480,909 incidents of violent crime without injury.

    http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulati...#violent-crime
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by joecphillips)
    So your argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online.
    Do you believe these are credible threats or just kids online trying to act big? When they grow up people realise that stuff isn't accepted.

    Latest statistics say there are 33,431 Incidents of rape (police recorded) and overall 99,609 incidents of sexual offences

    Compared with 403,957 incidents of violent crime with injury and 480,909 incidents of violent crime without injury.

    http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulati...#violent-crime
    If you're claiming my entire argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online then you're disregarding everything I have said prior?
    Does it matter? It's not just kids, it's grown men too. When are they going to grow up? Or are rape threats to be taken lightly, because you know - it's only rape. If someone threatened to murder me online I would certainly say it would be a big deal regardless of age.
    1) police recorded is a big factor - many, many rape victims, especially males, never report their assault to police.
    2) your argument here is that violent crime (which encompasses a HUGE amount of offences) happens more (or is reported more) therefore, rape isn't a problem.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    If you're claiming my entire argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online then you're disregarding everything I have said prior?
    Does it matter? It's not just kids, it's grown men too. When are they going to grow up? Or are rape threats to be taken lightly, because you know - it's only rape. If someone threatened to murder me online I would certainly say it would be a big deal regardless of age.
    1) police recorded is a big factor - many, many rape victims, especially males, never report their assault to police.
    2) your argument here is that violent crime (which encompasses a HUGE amount of offences) happens more (or is reported more) therefore, rape isn't a problem.
    I have never said rape isn't a problem, go find somewhere I have said oh rape isn't a problem.

    And other victims don't come forward? we can only judge on the available FACTUAL evidence

    Are you saying that there is a majority or a sizeable minority who think it is ok? If you think that go actually talk to people.

    Have you considered just muting the gobby kids on games who talk like that, I've been threatened online that is what I did.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    Who would think of a fetish situation when it clearly isn't mentioned? As someone who does political research using questionnaires with the public, I think the question is about as clear as it could be. There's no suggestion it's anything other than sex.
    You seem to be in denial that any male would think non-consensual sex is okay. We know that rape does undeniably happen, so clearly there are people who do agree with that.
    Well seeing I'm someone who's also had to collect and analyse sociological data via questionnaires myself, they very fact you would get people responding to the "if a woman says no to sex, is that rape?" in a manner of 'it depends on the situation' would prove it's not quite clear cut. Unless you know the exact manner this study was undertaken you cannot comment in the slightest on the reasoning for their answer.

    I highly doubt those 23% literally think it's okay to rape a woman. However with the data provided you can in no way, shape or form suggest a reason for that answer. It's the basic difference between a quantitative and qualitative study that they teach at basic AS level.

    At the moment you're making an unsupported statement which has no more relevance than me saying I disagree.

    It's the main reason stat dropping without any relevant investigation into the reasons 'why' is highly discouraged.

    Am I in denial that some men think it's okay? I don't think anyone bar someone who could be classed as mentally ill could think such a thing is okay. People however still do things they know to be wrong. However what I do get annoyed by is questionable statistics, collected in a bias manner without any form of cross examination being use to demonize an entire gender.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by joecphillips)
    I have never said rape isn't a problem, go find somewhere I have said oh rape isn't a problem.

    And other victims don't come forward? we can only judge on the available FACTUAL evidence

    Are you saying that there is a majority or a sizeable minority who think it is ok? If you think that go actually talk to people.

    Have you considered just muting the gobby kids on games who talk like that, I've been threatened online that is what I did.
    If there are 99,000 incidents of sexual assault then yes of course there must be a minority of people who think it is okay - and that's not including the people who continue to construct a society where bodies are gendered and owned.
    Of course I mute abusive players - but muting them doesn't get rid of their views or mean they don't continue to believe that its acceptable. The fact that they are saying those things in the first place is the issue, not how I deal with that fact.
    Or of course.. it is my fault for not immediately muting people on games.. unfortunately you can't mute people in the street or in nightclubs or in the safety of your own home who threaten your sexual safety either.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    If you're claiming my entire argument is a bunch of kids are nasty online then you're disregarding everything I have said prior?
    Does it matter? It's not just kids, it's grown men too. When are they going to grow up? Or are rape threats to be taken lightly, because you know - it's only rape. If someone threatened to murder me online I would certainly say it would be a big deal regardless of age.
    1) police recorded is a big factor - many, many rape victims, especially males, never report their assault to police.
    2) your argument here is that violent crime (which encompasses a HUGE amount of offences) happens more (or is reported more) therefore, rape isn't a problem.
    He's saying we're much more likely to live in a culture of violence and murder than rape culture based merely on the proportions of claimed actions undertaken.

    Questioning validity of feminist claims concerning rape does not equal stating rape is not a problem and to be quite honest it's a very obvious diversionary tactic.

    The whole idea of a 'rape culture' does not fit into any realistic or current definition of culture. The only way it does is if you then try and change the definition of culture.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by DanB1991)
    Well seeing I'm someone who's also had to collect and analyse sociological data via questionnaires myself, they very fact you would get people responding to the "if a woman says no to sex, is that rape?" in a manner of 'it depends on the situation' would prove it's not quite clear cut. Unless you know the exact manner this study was undertaken you cannot comment in the slightest on the reasoning for their answer.

    I highly doubt those 23% literally think it's okay to rape a woman. However with the data provided you can in no way, shape or form suggest a reason for that answer. It's the basic difference between a quantitative and qualitative study that they teach at basic AS level.

    At the moment you're making an unsupported statement which has no more relevance than me saying I disagree.

    It's the main reason stat dropping without any relevant investigation into the reasons 'why' is highly discouraged.

    Am I in denial that some men think it's okay? I don't think anyone bar someone who could be classed as mentally ill could think such a thing is okay. People however still do things they know to be wrong. However what I do get annoyed by is questionable statistics, collected in a bias manner without any form of cross examination being use to demonize an entire gender.
    But the question wasn't 'dependent on the situation'. And that goes to say that any question asked in any questionnaire is irrelevant and can't be used as evidence because, you know, in the respondents head they may have 'added' or elaborated context to the question that was never put there by the researcher.
    You find it 'highly unlikely' those 23% of men think rape is okay, does that mean you don't think ANY of those men think it is okay? or half of them?
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    Absolutely yes
    Not just in every day society but especially in the military (particularly the U.S military) where many military staff still think of rape as a tactic/strategy, and not a crime. The invasion of Iraq and the war crimes that occurred there not only show the elements of rape culture that are stagnant within society and military but also the colonial and imperialist undertones of it. Today there was an article about the fact that a Spanish judge asked a rape victim 'if she tried closing her legs'. I think that's pretty strong evidence of the rape culture in Europe and other places today.
    If they were to bring back hanging I`d lose no sleep if that judge were to be the first in line. Men/psychopaths with that attitude to the victims of rape don`t even deserve to be considered human.

    You don`t even begin to discover how many men think rape is ok by asking them. It does n`t even start there! All my posts are immediately deleted as consequence to my handling the truth. They are deleted by men! Rape is common in marriage - Males, as females, tend to a sexual ownership mindset. The difference is that when males have sex taken from them many try their hardest to take it back. Surveys are useless here, as most of the men that forcefully maintain sexual activity don`t consider it as rape, not even as being genuinely forceful. It`s very common, the female moves beds, but the male follows. Most of the men that "think rape is ok" are likely either unaware of it, that they think this, or otherwise, in denial. The survey would have to be subliminal!

    You can find me at www. amazon philosophy/much younger/older partners/friendships/romance.com
    As I`ve said, men, likely the enemy, are deleting all of my posts. Bird is with me, but then she`s not male.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by DanB1991)
    He's saying we're much more likely to live in a culture of violence and murder than rape culture based merely on the proportions of claimed actions undertaken.

    Questioning validity of feminist claims concerning rape does not equal stating rape is not a problem and to be quite honest it's a very obvious diversionary tactic.

    The whole idea of a 'rape culture' does not fit into any realistic or current definition of culture. The only way it does is if you then try and change the definition of culture.
    Quite honestly I think we do have a culture of violence, especially within the media and entertainment industries..
    but irregardless, by claiming you have to change the definition of culture to discuss rape culture is rather odd. Does that mean there isn't rape culture in Eastern countries like the others were saying?
    Should a theory such as 'new wars' be disregarded because in order to understand it, the definition of war must change?
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    If there are 99,000 incidents of sexual assault then yes of course there must be a minority of people who think it is okay - and that's not including the people who continue to construct a society where bodies are gendered and owned.
    Of course I mute abusive players - but muting them doesn't get rid of their views or mean they don't continue to believe that its acceptable. The fact that they are saying those things in the first place is the issue, not how I deal with that fact.
    Or of course.. it is my fault for not immediately muting people on games.. unfortunately you can't mute people in the street or in nightclubs or in the safety of your own home who threaten your sexual safety either.
    Of course there is a minority I said sizeable minority, there is a minority of people who deny the holocaust does that mean we have a culture of holocaust deniers.

    People are entitled to their views, do you want thought crime laws as well?

    You have said they are kids have you never said anything that you now realise was wrong?
    When they grow up the majority will realise that they are wrong.

    There will always be scumbags who will break the law that is a fact that does not mean that the behaviour is accepted when people come across it
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by joecphillips)
    Of course there is a minority I said sizeable minority, there is a minority of people who deny the holocaust does that mean we have a culture of holocaust deniers.

    People are entitled to their views, do you want thought crime laws as well?

    You have said they are kids have you never said anything that you now realise was wrong?
    When they grow up the majority will realise that they are wrong.

    There will always be scumbags who will break the law that is a fact that does not mean that the behaviour is accepted when people come across it
    Assaulting people isn't a view! It's a crime. As is threatening people. I have never threatened anyone, no. I've never threatened to commit violence/crime on anyone. And I also said not all of them are kids.
    Yet when my housemate was showing people pictures of nudes sent to him, not one guy in a house of six said anything against it. That's a majority to me.
    A majority that accepts the fact that other men think of women as own-able, even if they don't agree with it themselves.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    If there are 99,000 incidents of sexual assault then yes of course there must be a minority of people who think it is okay - and that's not including the people who continue to construct a society where bodies are gendered and owned.
    Of course I mute abusive players - but muting them doesn't get rid of their views or mean they don't continue to believe that its acceptable. The fact that they are saying those things in the first place is the issue, not how I deal with that fact.
    Or of course.. it is my fault for not immediately muting people on games.. unfortunately you can't mute people in the street or in nightclubs or in the safety of your own home who threaten your sexual safety either.
    :facepalm: So you don't see the hypocrisy here?

    You don't understand why such people say such things in the first place. It's offences/threats aimed at an individual with the gender been used to personalise the offence. Not them offending them because of their gender.

    Women tend to be offended with charged sexual language, mostly because violence against women by men is seen as worse in many respects worse than rape. By comparison they will tell other men they will have sex with their parents/siblings/relatives, beat them up, kill them etc. Due to homophobia a man will generally not say they will rape another man unless they want to actively play on that individuals own homophobic fears.

    People know online abuse is a serious issue, but once again it's hardly a gendered issue. There's also a suggestion of 'open door syndrome', aka women are used to being treated politely (thus opening doors etc) and in person offences in general are much rarer and usually instead aimed at men (even then most abuse is women on women). Online, the consensus is, despite your real life gender and even if the abuser knows your gender, social rules online are genderless. Aka your gender will not decide per se if you receive abuse online or not, more as the actual content. Day to day, men receive similar levels of abuse online, if not slightly more, In real life however men receive drastically higher levels of physical and verbal abuse than women, even if you include rapes/sexual assaults etc.

    Also are you also suggesting physical safety is less than a issue than sexual safety?

    It's been suggested in studies numerous times stereotypical rapes is often about dominance and control. Just in the same manner assaults between two males or two females is about dominance and control. If you start viewing stereotypical rape as mostly a violent act before sexual then realistically a rape threats are no different in reality to a threat of physical violence.

    Then you have the really basic fact online humour is extremely more dark than in real life. Rape and child abuse is about as dark as you can go seeing murder is allowed in mainstream comedy thus it's popularity online.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by DanB1991)
    :facepalm: So you don't see the hypocrisy here?

    You don't understand why such people say such things in the first place. It's offences/threats aimed at an individual with the gender been used to personalise the offence. Not them offending them because of their gender.

    Women tend to be offended with charged sexual language, mostly because violence against women by men is seen as worse in many respects worse than rape. By comparison they will tell other men they will have sex with their parents/siblings/relatives, beat them up, kill them etc. Due to homophobia a man will generally not say they will rape another man unless they want to actively play on that individuals own homophobic fears.

    People know online abuse is a serious issue, but once again it's hardly a gendered issue. There's also a suggestion of 'open door syndrome', aka women are used to being treated politely (thus opening doors etc) and in person offences in general are much rarer and usually instead aimed at men (even then most abuse is women on women). Online, the consensus is, despite your real life gender and even if the abuser knows your gender, social rules online are genderless. Aka your gender will not decide per se if you receive abuse online or not, more as the actual content. Day to day, men receive similar levels of abuse online, if not slightly more, In real life however men receive drastically higher levels of physical and verbal abuse than women, even if you include rapes/sexual assaults etc.

    Also are you also suggesting physical safety is less than a issue than sexual safety?

    It's been suggested in studies numerous times stereotypical rapes is often about dominance and control. Just in the same manner assaults between two males or two females is about dominance and control. If you start viewing stereotypical rape as mostly a violent act before sexual then realistically a rape threats are no different in reality to a threat of physical violence.

    Then you have the really basic fact online humour is extremely more dark than in real life. Rape and child abuse is about as dark as you can go seeing murder is allowed in mainstream comedy thus it's popularity online.
    Men actually receive more abuse online and women are more likely to abuse women online.
    http://www.pewinternet.org/2014/10/2...ne-harassment/
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by joecphillips)
    Men actually receive more abuse online and women are more likely to abuse women online.
    http://www.pewinternet.org/2014/10/2...ne-harassment/
    Urgh my english in that post is horrific.... so many mistake...time for bed me thinks.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by birdie95)
    Quite honestly I think we do have a culture of violence, especially within the media and entertainment industries..
    but irregardless, by claiming you have to change the definition of culture to discuss rape culture is rather odd. Does that mean there isn't rape culture in Eastern countries like the others were saying?
    Should a theory such as 'new wars' be disregarded because in order to understand it, the definition of war must change?
    By large I wouldn't say there is a public rape culture in eastern countries. It's still a highly abhorrent crime in those area's, if not more so than in the west. In many eastern countries it's often seen as a crime worse than murder!

    However the main difference it how the gauge men and womens guilt concerning the act and women are still seen as property. That means many men, despite opposing rape, still believe it is okay to rape their own 'property'. Even then still the minority commit it and it's extremely questionable to call it a rape culture per se.

    By comparison certain parts of africa you could almost certainly agree something resembling a rape culture exists. But then I don't think an in depth study in mens opinions on the matter in africa really exist. The main reason I resist using rape culture in these situations is the sociological examples given to explain rape culture is aimed mostly at the western world. Certain parts of the definition definitely do not fit into eastern or african cultures, for example rape being used as an extreme form of punishment akin to capital punishment would not fit into rape culture.

    (Original post by birdie95)
    Yet when my housemate was showing people pictures of nudes sent to him, not one guy in a house of six said anything against it. That's a majority to me.
    A majority that accepts the fact that other men think of women as own-able, even if they don't agree with it themselves.
    Women do that too you know? Does that mean women think they own the guys body?
 
 
 
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Would you like to hibernate through the winter months?
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.