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    (Original post by hitchhiker_13)
    Is that a good enough reason to legalise something though - because if it's illegal people will do it anyway? People apply this philosophy to other things - such as illegal drugs and prostitution - and I think it is flawed logic.
    Also, I think that whether you are for, against or undecided, you have to consider the morality of it, just as I think you should consider the morality or any action.
    But why not make drugs as prostitution legal. If they were they could be more easily regulated.
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    In my opinion, abortion is almost always wrong, but it shouldn't be illegal.

    The situations where abortion might not be wrong, (in my opinion) are:
    1. Risk to the mother's life
    2. Rape
    3. Child is handicapped
    4. Contraception failed

    In all but the first, I would still encourage the mother to have the baby and give it up for adoption....ok, maybe not with a handicapped child. I don't agree with abortions just because a child is handicapped, but then, the only person who can decide that is the person who has to look after the child.

    I'm a Christian, and I'd like to say I would never have an abortion. Even if I was raped, I hope I'd have the strength to go for adoption instead.

    I read an article which said that only 20% of 15 year olds across the country know that you can get contraception free on the NHS. If you use the pill and a condom every time you have sex, the chances of pregnancy are something like 3 in 100,000. With all the abortions that women are having every year, you can't tell me they were all being that careful. If they were the unlucky 0.003%, then the country would need to have a much bigger population, and all the fertile women would need to be having sex 24/7. Education is the issue. People are just too damn lazy/stupid/ignorant/careless to use proper protection.

    Abortion is generally wrong, but preferable to young girls killing themselves with backstreet abortions gone horribly wrong because they can't get legal, safe abortions. Proper protection is infinitely MORE preferable still. If everyone was as careful as they should be, the debate about where life begins would effectively become null and void.
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    (Original post by Friday's Child)
    I read an article which said that only 20% of 15 year olds across the country know that you can get contraception free on the NHS. If you use the pill and a condom every time you have sex, the chances of pregnancy are something like 3 in 100,000. With all the abortions that women are having every year, you can't tell me they were all being that careful. If they were the unlucky 0.003%, then the country would need to have a much bigger population, and all the fertile women would need to be having sex 24/7. Education is the issue. People are just too damn lazy/stupid/ignorant/careless to use proper protection.
    Or some women could like me, never want to take the pill because there are possible side effects. That leaves condoms as the main form on contreception. Now this has a 2% failure rate so could account for a few more of the women. Yes this doesn't account for all of them but it is another option for why so many women get pregnant. I agree with you that education is the way forward.
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    (Original post by Friday's Child)
    In my opinion, abortion is almost always wrong, but it shouldn't be illegal.

    The situations where abortion might not be wrong, (in my opinion) are:
    1. Risk to the mother's life
    2. Rape
    3. Child is handicapped
    4. Contraception failed

    In all but the first, I would still encourage the mother to have the baby and give it up for adoption....ok, maybe not with a handicapped child. I don't agree with abortions just because a child is handicapped, but then, the only person who can decide that is the person who has to look after the child.

    I'm a Christian, and I'd like to say I would never have an abortion. Even if I was raped, I hope I'd have the strength to go for adoption instead.

    I read an article which said that only 20% of 15 year olds across the country know that you can get contraception free on the NHS. If you use the pill and a condom every time you have sex, the chances of pregnancy are something like 3 in 100,000. With all the abortions that women are having every year, you can't tell me they were all being that careful. If they were the unlucky 0.003%, then the country would need to have a much bigger population, and all the fertile women would need to be having sex 24/7. Education is the issue. People are just too damn lazy/stupid/ignorant/careless to use proper protection.

    Abortion is generally wrong, but preferable to young girls killing themselves with backstreet abortions gone horribly wrong because they can't get legal, safe abortions. Proper protection is infinitely MORE preferable still. If everyone was as careful as they should be, the debate about where life begins would effectively become null and void.
    Is that article online or is possible to acquire it like a pamphlet? I have to admit that yes people are too lazy. Why don't some of them end sex where becoming pregnant is zero? I need not to say what.

    Situations 1 and 2 was covered in the courts (under a defence of duress) before abortion was legalised in statute. Makes you wonder why they had the statute to begin with since it practically mirrored the judicial precedent on this matter.
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    (Original post by randdom)
    I think that most people who have abortions probably do feel guilt or responsibility for what they have done. But the women who do this feel it is best for them and I think that we have to respect that.

    In response to your comment about the abortion showed on my feotus. I don't understand how people can say that it is not ok to abort a feotus which yes is small and vulnerable because it can't defend itself ect but you are quite happy to see pigs and cattle (who at that stage in their lives are more aware of what is happening and are more of an intellegent life form than a first trimester feotus) killed for their meat. I mean at this point they are more alive than the feotus that is aborted so why can they die and feotus not.
    Really randdom old chap, how on earth would you know whether or not I am veggie? Just out of interest, because if you do somehow have access to details of my life like this, I am a little concerned. As it happens, your intelligence is misled: I am veggie, I support small farms, I hate agri-business, I am anti-vivisection...I'm not a campaigny type, but I have my beliefs. Ok? NOW can I be anti-abortion, please Sir?
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    (Original post by jackgiraffe)
    Really randdom old chap, how on earth would you know whether or not I am veggie? Just out of interest, because if you do somehow have access to details of my life like this, I am a little concerned. As it happens, your intelligence is misled: I am veggie, I support small farms, I hate agri-business, I am anti-vivisection...I'm not a campaigny type, but I have my beliefs. Ok? NOW can I be anti-abortion, please Sir?
    I would refrain from making personnal comments if i was you ie about her intelligence.
    She mearly made the point that for anti abortionists its a little curious they are do not want to terminate the embryo which in its early stages is very similar to the life of a cow in terms of biological complexity. You have failed to deal with this point. No where did she say you were a veggie either.

    And yes she is a girl so "old chap" isnt a great way to start your post. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Speciez99)
    And yes she is a girl so "old chap" isnt a great way to start your post. :rolleyes:
    You learn something every day
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    (Original post by Friday's Child)
    In my opinion, abortion is almost always wrong, but it shouldn't be illegal.

    The situations where abortion might not be wrong, (in my opinion) are:
    1. Risk to the mother's life
    2. Rape
    3. Child is handicapped
    4. Contraception failed
    Pretty much my view exactly, though i assume when you talk of the possibility of disability you mean serious to the point where the child would be nothing more than a vegetable and probably have an extremely limited lifespan - abortions because of a hair lip or anything that minor are truly disgusting.

    (Original post by Friday's Child)
    In all but the first, I would still encourage the mother to have the baby and give it up for adoption....ok, maybe not with a handicapped child. I don't agree with abortions just because a child is handicapped, but then, the only person who can decide that is the person who has to look after the child.
    Agreed. I dont understand why people seem so reluctant to use adoption if they dont want children i mean honestly, are 9 months of your life so much to give up (especially considering that its not really a herculean task to keep from getting pregnant in the first place) just so that the child may live?

    (Original post by Friday's Child)
    I read an article which said that only 20% of 15 year olds across the country know that you can get contraception free on the NHS. If you use the pill and a condom every time you have sex, the chances of pregnancy are something like 3 in 100,000. With all the abortions that women are having every year, you can't tell me they were all being that careful. If they were the unlucky 0.003%, then the country would need to have a much bigger population, and all the fertile women would need to be having sex 24/7. Education is the issue. People are just too damn lazy/stupid/ignorant/careless to use proper protection.
    Exactly. Its not the hardest thing in the world, should you wish to remain childless, to :

    1) Not have sex in the first place
    2) Not have sex without use of a condom
    3) Not have sex without use of a diaphram
    4) Not have sex without being on the pill
    5) Not have sex without using the contraceptive sponge
    6) Not have sex without using spermicides

    To name only the most 'accessible' contraceptive devices. As you say almost all unwanted pregnancies come about as a result of people being too lazy,stupid,ignorant and careless to prevent it.

    (Original post by Friday's Child)
    Abortion is generally wrong, but preferable to young girls killing themselves with backstreet abortions gone horribly wrong because they can't get legal, safe abortions. Proper protection is infinitely MORE preferable still. If everyone was as careful as they should be, the debate about where life begins would effectively become null and void.
    Fair point.
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    A or swallow haha j/k
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    (Original post by an Siarach)
    Exactly. Its not the hardest thing in the world, should you wish to remain childless, to :

    1) Not have sex in the first place
    2) Not have sex without use of a condom
    3) Not have sex without use of a diaphram
    4) Not have sex without being on the pill
    5) Not have sex without using the contraceptive sponge
    6) Not have sex without using spermicides
    I agree that points 2-6 make sense in preventing pregnancy but point 1 is a lot more debatable. Wanting to sleep with people is an urge that most people have. It is only natural that people would want to do it. I don't think that people should be condemed for doing it but it is there responsibility to be safe. However unfortunately people forget, don't bother or contreception fails and I think that Abortion is acceptable in these situations.
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    if a girl aged 13 living in a poor area gets raped and gets pregnant with a handicapped child then she has every right to have an abortion.
    but i dont agree with using it as a form of contraception.
    it should be a last resort not an answer to laziness and lack of responsibility.
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    (Original post by icklehc)
    if a girl aged 13 living in a poor area gets raped and gets pregnant with a handicapped child then she has every right to have an abortion.
    but i dont agree with using it as a form of contraception.
    it should be a last resort not an answer to laziness and lack of responsibility.
    I agree with you there but how can you tell that it is being used as contreception and a person hasn't just had two/three unfortunate incidents which can happen if you are not aware of how to use contreception effectively.
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    (Original post by randdom)
    I agree with you there but how can you tell that it is being used as contreception and a person hasn't just had two/three unfortunate incidents which can happen if you are not aware of how to use contreception effectively.
    I personally would not do something unless I knew enough about it. Would I jump on a motorbike and drive on the motorway without taking a test (ignoring the legal stuff)?
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    (Original post by NDGAARONDI)
    I personally would not do something unless I knew enough about it. Would I jump on a motorbike and drive on the motorway without taking a test (ignoring the legal stuff)?
    but with somethings in life you just have to take a leap into the dark otherwise you are going to miss out on alot of things
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    (Original post by randdom)
    I agree with you there but how can you tell that it is being used as contreception and a person hasn't just had two/three unfortunate incidents which can happen if you are not aware of how to use contreception effectively.
    i was just going on experience of knowing a girl in my school who used abortion as a contraception. She "couldnt be bothered" to go on the pill or use condoms and ended up getting pregnant 3 times and just having abortions.
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    (Original post by icklehc)
    i was just going on experience of knowing a girl in my school who used abortion as a contraception. She "couldnt be bothered" to go on the pill or use condoms and ended up getting pregnant 3 times and just having abortions.
    She doesn't help her fellow 'sisters' supporting abortion at all. She should be greatful she doesn't live in Northern Ireland, because I believe the rules are different there. Why don't they log people how many abortions etc.? I wouldn't feel sorry for her at all if she did intentionally become pregnant and wanted a kid and along comes a lunatic and stabs the foetus, next she be wanting him done for murder....

    Wouldn't it be less hassle just to go on the pill? I'd rather someone go on the pill than have an abortion like she does. She's wasting tax payers money and I have to pay for my medicine even though I rarely go to the doctors and am in full time education with no job for over a year. I fall in the benefit trap only because of my age.

    I would like to know how much it costs on average per abortion.
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    (Original post by NDGAARONDI)
    She doesn't help her fellow 'sisters' supporting abortion at all. She should be greatful she doesn't live in Northern Ireland, because I believe the rules are different there. Why don't they log people how many abortions etc.? I wouldn't feel sorry for her at all if she did intentionally become pregnant and wanted a kid and along comes a lunatic and stabs the foetus, next she be wanting him done for murder....

    Wouldn't it be less hassle just to go on the pill? I'd rather someone go on the pill than have an abortion like she does. She's wasting tax payers money and I have to pay for my medicine even though I rarely go to the doctors and am in full time education with no job for over a year. I fall in the benefit trap only because of my age.

    I would like to know how much it costs on average per abortion.
    I beleive abortions go into your hospital journal, dont they? Btw, most contraceptives are about 99% certain meaning 1 out of 100 wommen will get pregnant eaven if they use it. In a population of several million people it is therefore not unlikely that some get pregnant three times despite using contraceptives. One of the problems is you cant really determine why a person has become pregnant. Many people here seem to think that the only way someone could get pregnant unintentionally would be if they ignored contraception. This is not the case. Condoms can burst or be defective, pills dont always work etc... I am also surprised how many people do not see the difference between a 4 week old eggcell and a newborn baby. Having an abortion after a month is not equivalent to killing your baby after it is born.
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    (Original post by Jonatan)
    One of the problems is you cant really determine why a person has become pregnant.
    That is the most difficult problem arguably.

    (Original post by Jonatan)
    Condoms can burst or be defective, pills dont always work etc...
    Yet we are in the 21st century! How we speak of advances in medicine and we can't even perfect the pill and contraception which are both 'ancient'.

    (Original post by Jonatan)
    I am also surprised how many people do not see the difference between a 4 week old eggcell and a newborn baby. Having an abortion after a month is not equivalent to killing your baby after it is born.
    Why? Just because it has been expelled from the body? So if someone saw their ex girlfriend who cheated on him (and had sex with the other guy) and was due to give birth the next day came along and stabbed her foetus this would be different than if he waiting for her to give birth, then killing it?
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    (Original post by Speciez99)
    but with somethings in life you just have to take a leap into the dark otherwise you are going to miss out on alot of things
    Could you expand a little further on this point please. I'm not 100% sure on your whereabouts. If you leap in the dark in other things in life it can always cost you your life.

    Yeah but there's a saying, "Be prepared"
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    (Original post by NDGAARONDI)
    Could you expand a little further on this point please. I'm not 100% sure on your whereabouts. If you leap in the dark in other things in life it can always cost you your life.

    Yeah but there's a saying, "Be prepared"
    lol its wasnt a serious point on this debate
    More the fact that decisions in life are like gambling, some have high risks, some low with a range of risks between the two. Sometimes alot can be gained from taking a moderate risk.
 
 
 
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