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Tory MPs set to rebel over disability cuts Watch

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    http://www.itv.com/news/2016-03-17/c...sability-cuts/

    Good on them.
    I'm genuinely interested to see if there are people on here who actually support disability cuts.

    If it's about money saving, then at the same time as reducing disability benefits, he's giving tax breaks to those earning the higher sums.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    http://www.itv.com/news/2016-03-17/c...sability-cuts/

    Good on them.
    I'm genuinely interested to see if there are people on here who actually support disability cuts.

    If it's about money saving, then at the same time as reducing disability benefits, he's giving tax breaks to those earning the higher sums.
    And so they should. Cutting money for the disabled will giving out tax breaks for corporations and high income earners is pretty scandalous. The Tories only have a majority of 12, I think that we will see more rebellions as backbenchers realise the power they have in their hands to change policy.

    The government was also defeated in the Lords this week over their attempts to nobble the trade unions and the funding Labour gets from them. Quite a few conservative lords strongly criticised the government and said they were acting in a way that was completely unreasonable and partisan
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    (Original post by BeastOfSyracuse)
    And so they should. Cutting money for the disabled will giving out tax breaks for corporations and high income earners is pretty scandalous. The Tories only have a majority of 12, I think that we will see more rebellions as backbenchers realise the power they have in their hands to change policy.

    The government was also defeated in the Lords this week over their attempts to nobble the trade unions and the funding Labour gets from them. Quite a few conservative lords strongly criticised the government and said they were acting in a way that was completely unreasonable and partisan
    So far this Parliament the tories are trying to reduce Labour funding by £8 million a year, reducing short money to labour, knock people off the electoral register, stuff the lords with tories and redraw the boundaries which will hurt Labour the most.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    So far this Parliament the tories are trying to reduce Labour funding by £8 million a year, reducing short money to labour, knock people off the electoral register, stuff the lords with tories and redraw the boundaries which will hurt Labour the most.
    They have been pretty brazen this parliament, haven't they? I've been really saddened by how arrogant and corrupt the conservatives have been acting on these issues, how they are totally unconcerned with how corrupt it looks that they are using all these measures to make it more likely they will win the next election and entrench their power.

    Also that now they're being challenged in the Lords, they are complaining that it is unrepresentative and unelected, as if they only just realised that and this issue has never been raised before.

    Even with all their meddling and gerrymandering, they still wouldn't be able to withstand it if there was a major swing to Labour. With the Tories breaking the old convention about doing party funding reform in a consensual and bipartisan way, I think when Labour gets back into power it should unilaterally go after their private sources of funding and introduce public funding for political parties.
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    It's hard to believe really. They want to take £3,500 per year off disabled people. Taking money away from the unemployed and low paid is one thing, but to take it from the most vulnerable is disgusting.
    It's not even about being a 'SJW', it's about having basic human decency.
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    Target the most vulnerable members of society. Way to go, lads!

    Hope a lot of the Tory MPs rebel.
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    (Original post by TSRFT8)
    Depends what sort of "disability" you are talking about? For those with life long illnesses and disabilities then no i dont agree. However there are thousands of people claiming this because they are "too fat" or "i sprained my ankle" this kind of ******** does not wear off with the Tories and rightly so.

    I definitely think that people need to be encouraged to work and many of the disabilities people use as excuses now a days are a joke, for example a few days ago i witnessed a man in his 50s doing road work and he was limping everywhere he was in obvious discomfort (some people would rather claim benefits) but he chose to work. HOWEVER there are many people in genuine need and their disabilities are ones which prevent them from working etc.. And for those people i think it is wrong to cut benefits.
    Where's your link that thousands claim because they're too fat or sprained their ankle? You can't claim benefits for a sprained ankle.
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    (Original post by TSRFT8)
    Depends what sort of "disability" you are talking about? For those with life long illnesses and disabilities then no i dont agree. However there are thousands of people claiming this because they are "too fat" or "i sprained my ankle" this kind of ******** does not wear off with the Tories and rightly so.
    That's simply not true. To claim a disability benefit you need to be disabled (to suffer from an illness that causes significant impairment now and will continue to do so in the future, and which you have been suffering already for at least 12 months).

    There are people with terminal cancer who have been judged fit for work by ATOS, so you can't seriously claim that the system is actually too lax on them.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    It's hard to believe really. They want to take £3,500 per year off disabled people. Taking money away from the unemployed and low paid is one thing, but to take it from the most vulnerable is disgusting.
    It's not even about being a 'SJW', it's about having basic human decency.
    We have a debt of honour to the disabled, an obligation as a civilised society to look after them. It really is the lowest of the low to attack them in this way

    The Education minister said on the BBC that apparently this policy is "just a suggestion", they are already scrambling to backtrack. It's almost like they are so lacking in basic compassion and empathy that they didn't realise that other people would be horrified by this and see it as insanely sociopathic

    I am glad that disabled organisations like the MS Society have been forcing Tory MPs who voted in favour of disability cuts to resign from their positions as trustees. They will not be permitted to vote to attack the disabled then grandstand as if they are a great friend of the disabled
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    (Original post by TSRFT8)
    Wait, before you get defensive, my post was never to offend anyone, but to say that people dont scam the benefit system is quite naive of you. Thousands do, have a look.
    The fact there are scams would be a justification for putting some money into investigators who can look into that kind of thing.

    You are supporting a policy that takes away money from all disabled benefits recipients. That is illogical.

    In fact, when researchers have looked into it they've shown that the amount of benefits taken fraudulently is miniscule, something like 0.001%.

    The Tory (and your) position is like, "Well, some people are defrauding the system so let's crack down on and cut everyone's benefits"
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    (Original post by BeastOfSyracuse)
    That's simply not true. To claim a disability benefit you need to be disabled (to suffer from an illness that causes significant impairment now and will continue to do so in the future, and which you have been suffering already for at least 12 months).
    This isn't true. To claim PIP, you need to have the needs for 3 months and expect them to last for another 9 months. No such limit for people who claim ESA. (which means if you're short term ill on JSA, you can switch benefits for a temporary period)
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    (Original post by Tiger Rag)
    This isn't true. To claim PIP, you need to have the needs for 3 months and expect them to last for another 9 months.
    I was referring to Disability Living Allowance, to get that kind of benefit you need to be disabled according to the legal definition (which I mentioned; significant impairment, 12 months etc).

    What I was saying is that you can't just claim disability benefits if you can't be arsed to work or claim you have whiplash and put on a neckbrace and waddle into the benefits office. It involves real assessment by your own doctors, by ATOS physicians, etc. It is a serious process, not a lark
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    (Original post by TSRFT8)
    Re-read what i said, i said i dont agree with them cutting the benefits of those of are in genuine need? Did i not?
    The gist of your comment I understood that you were generally agreeing with what the Conservatives are doing, and the reality of their policy is that they are hitting people who are vulnerable and genuinely in need

    If i was PM i would reform the whole benefit system, crack down on the fraudsters and use the money saved in benefit fraud and give more to those with life long disabilities. My post might have sounded one sided and for that i apoligise.
    No worries, fair play and no need to apologise. My own view is that of course you can't let people defraud benefits, but the amount of money in tax evasion is much, much larger and the government has been cutting the budget of the HMRC office that investigated large-scale and corporate tax evasion. To me it makes no sense for a government that desperately needs every penny to be making investigators redundant who could have brought in a lot of money from corporate and large-scale tax evasion cases. So it seems quite wrong to be cutting benefits and hitting the poorest while handing money over to the well off
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    lol You can tell who in this thread has lived on council estates (especially during the Labour years) and who hasn't.
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    Pretty awful what they have done to the most sick and vulnerable even before this.

    The new changes will save 1.2billion a year yet we still give 12billion a year away in foreign aid to despots and countries with huge militaries and space programs

    Charity starts at home
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    Aside from the rights and wrongs of the policy, there's an interesting development happening here.

    We are starting to see (possibly accelerated because of the EU referendum) the backbenchers of the Tory party starting to assert their independence. With a majority of 12, backbenchers have a lot of leverage and are a more dangerous opposition than the Labour party.

    We saw this happen over Sunday trading last week and now its happening over PIP changes.
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    i can see this being it for George Osbourne as a potential leader....

    can't see him ever being popular again.
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    (Original post by TSRFT8)
    Depends what sort of "disability" you are talking about? For those with life long illnesses and disabilities then no i dont agree. However there are thousands of people claiming this because they are "too fat" or "i sprained my ankle" this kind of ******** does not wear off with the Tories and rightly so.

    I definitely think that people need to be encouraged to work and many of the disabilities people use as excuses now a days are a joke, for example a few days ago i witnessed a man in his 50s doing road work and he was limping everywhere he was in obvious discomfort (some people would rather claim benefits) but he chose to work. HOWEVER there are many people in genuine need and their disabilities are ones which prevent them from working etc.. And for those people i think it is wrong to cut benefits.
    Or potentially he was refused benefits he was eligible for and so had no choice to work...
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    As a Conservative supporter I completely disagree with these disability cuts and makes me dislike Osborne even more, if i was an MP I would rebel for sure.
 
 
 
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