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This is what the Liberal Democrats protected us from - is it time to bring them back? Watch

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    Barbaric cuts to welfare for the disabled. Gradual destruction of the NHS. Forceful privatisation of our schools. Theresa May's Snooper's Charter stripping away our privacy in the most dangerous, incompetent way possible. Efforts to take away our universal Human Rights and replace them with a new Tory interpretation.

    These things are all happening now. The Lib Dems stopped them happening 5 years ago. Had there been no winner of the 2010 General Election, there'd have been a second general election - and the Conservatives might have won that one. The Lib Dems prevented this from happening by forming the coalition.

    People are understandably upset that the Lib Dems didn't do everything they said they would while in power - I know that, as a student myself, tuition fees will have a big impact for me. But it's important to keep in mind that they didn't have a majority - they simple couldn't do everything they wanted to do, because they were outnumbered.

    That said, the Lib Dems actually achieved a huge amount in their time in government. Everything that the Conservatives are doing now, they wanted to do in 2010, but the coalition wouldn't allow them to. The Liberal Democrats blocked the Snooper's Charter, they blocked some of the more severe cuts to welfare and public services, and they protected our rights. Now that the Tories have a majority, we're seeing what could have happened if the coalition wasn't formed.

    The political situation in the UK is turbulent and fragile right now. A lot of parties are presenting radical, impractical or naive views.

    The Liberal Democrats, on the other hand, are sticking to policies that are progressive, based on real evidence, and that will benefit all of us. And I genuinely believe that they have some of the most principled politicians in parliament - whatever you thought of the coalition at the time, we can see now that Nick Clegg saved us from the Tories, and sacrificed his career and reputation to do it.

    The Lib Dems represent a fair, forward-looking middle ground. Maybe it's time that we give them another chance?

    You can read their policies in their manifesto. Some highlights include eliminating the deficit by investing in growing business sectors while making less cuts, giving the NHS the extra £8billion they need and investing in long-neglected mental health care, and helping young people with housing, travel and apprenticeships.
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    Absolutely not, the Liberal Democrats divided the left and let the Tories win. If Lib Dems cared about the country at all they would join Labour.
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    (Original post by Snufkin)
    Absolutely not, the Liberal Democrats divided the left and let the Tories win. If Lib Dems cared about the country at all they would join Labour.
    Got to say I agree, I mean really what's the difference between them? Pretty much zero


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    (Original post by JordanL_)
    Barbaric cuts to welfare for the disabled. Gradual destruction of the NHS. Forceful privatisation of our schools. Theresa May's Snooper's Charter stripping away our privacy in the most dangerous, incompetent way possible. Efforts to take away our universal Human Rights and replace them with a new Tory interpretation.

    These things are all happening now. The Lib Dems stopped them happening 5 years ago. Had there been no winner of the 2010 General Election, there'd have been a second general election - and the Conservatives might have won that one. The Lib Dems prevented this from happening by forming the coalition.

    People are understandably upset that the Lib Dems didn't do everything they said they would while in power - I know that, as a student myself, tuition fees will have a big impact for me. But it's important to keep in mind that they didn't have a majority - they simple couldn't do everything they wanted to do, because they were outnumbered.

    That said, the Lib Dems actually achieved a huge amount in their time in government. Everything that the Conservatives are doing now, they wanted to do in 2010, but the coalition wouldn't allow them to. The Liberal Democrats blocked the Snooper's Charter, they blocked some of the more severe cuts to welfare and public services, and they protected our rights. Now that the Tories have a majority, we're seeing what could have happened if the coalition wasn't formed.

    The political situation in the UK is turbulent and fragile right now. A lot of parties are presenting radical, impractical or naive views.

    The Liberal Democrats, on the other hand, are sticking to policies that are progressive, based on real evidence, and that will benefit all of us. And I genuinely believe that they have some of the most principled politicians in parliament - whatever you thought of the coalition at the time, we can see now that Nick Clegg saved us from the Tories, and sacrificed his career and reputation to do it.

    The Lib Dems represent a fair, forward-looking middle ground. Maybe it's time that we give them another chance?

    You can read their policies in their manifesto. Some highlights include eliminating the deficit by investing in growing business sectors while making less cuts, giving the NHS the extra £8billion they need and investing in long-neglected mental health care, and helping young people with housing, travel and apprenticeships.
    As Snufkin said. Heck, even AFTER the 2010 election the Lib Dems could have stood their groun and prevented the Tories ever reaching power in the first place had they been so inclined.
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    (Original post by Saoirse:3)
    As Snufkin said. Heck, even AFTER the 2010 election the Lib Dems could have stood their groun and prevented the Tories ever reaching power in the first place had they been so inclined.
    Not really.

    The only way to scrape a majority would have been to create a rainbow coalition of several different parties which was not practical and likely would have resulted in a second election within months or zombie government.

    The only alternative to that would have been that the Lib Dems not go into coalition and force an immediate general election to which a leaderless Labour and a Tory party who had not yet cut would have said.. 'this is why you must give us a mandate' and i see no reason why they would not have gotten a majority.

    The scenario in which Labour governed during the 2010-2015 period is one that's just too far fetched.
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    Regarding the OP i'll say that actually i was quite a fan of the coalition and greatly impressed by Cleggers and Alexander and Laws in particular. While i am happy with the Tory majority so far (bar the EU and leadership waffle) i'd certainly not be sad if the Orange Bookers rose to prominence and joined a coalition again.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Not really.

    The only way to scrape a majority would have been to create a rainbow coalition of several different parties which was not practical and likely would have resulted in a second election within months or zombie government.

    The only alternative to that would have been that the Lib Dems not go into coalition and force an immediate general election to which a leaderless Labour and a Tory party who had not yet cut would have said.. 'this is why you must give us a mandate' and i see no reason why they would not have gotten a majority.

    The scenario in which Labour governed during the 2010-2015 period is one that's just too far fetched.
    Remember Brown did not resign as leader immidiately but during coalition negotiations once it became clear the Lib Dems were unwilling to work with him. Labour could have continued as a minority caretaker administration, and potentially replaced Brown with a new leader - I expect it might actually have been David Milliband in this scenario - who'd have then gone to the country for a mandate. There's every chance the Tories would have at least in part turned on Cameron hurting their own chances in the process and I wouldn't say the Conservatives would necessarily win a second election later in the year. That's assuming also that there wouldn't have been the numbers to push through electoral reform - if Labour could have been convinced in return for being guarenteed first talks with the Lib Dems after the new election it may well have done. Labour + Lib Dem + Green + SNP + Plaid + SDLP would have been 328 at the time, an effective majority of 6.
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    (Original post by Saoirse:3)
    Remember Brown did not resign as leader immidiately but during coalition negotiations once it became clear the Lib Dems were unwilling to work with him. Labour could have continued as a minority caretaker administration, and potentially replaced Brown with a new leader - I expect it might actually have been David Milliband in this scenario - who'd have then gone to the country for a mandate. There's every chance the Tories would have at least in part turned on Cameron hurting their own chances in the process and I wouldn't say the Conservatives would necessarily win a second election later in the year. That's assuming also that there wouldn't have been the numbers to push through electoral reform - if Labour could have been convinced in return for being guarenteed first talks with the Lib Dems after the new election it may well have done. Labour + Lib Dem + Green + SNP + Plaid + SDLP would have been 328 at the time, an effective majority of 6.
    6 parties and knowing for sure everyone must turn up and all vote the same way to get anything done even assuming you could agree on anything.

    Oh yea and then there's the issue of partnering the snp pre referendum and the smell test of the public going err wtf?


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    (Original post by paul514)
    6 parties and knowing for sure everyone must turn up and all vote the same way to get anything done even assuming you could agree on anything.

    Oh yea and then there's the issue of partnering the snp pre referendum and the smell test of the public going err wtf?


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    Not suggesting on general matters they would - just for the hypothetical electoral reform vote. This was also before the SNP won their majority in 2011, and it could have been presented to the public as allowing for stability without "compromising the wishes of the electorate" by putting the Tories into permanent government without anywhere near majority support (given the Lib Dems were viewed by many of their own voters at the time as a left-wing alternative to Labour!).
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    (Original post by Saoirse:3)
    As Snufkin said. Heck, even AFTER the 2010 election the Lib Dems could have stood their groun and prevented the Tories ever reaching power in the first place had they been so inclined.
    They alo could have withdrawn from the coalition at any point during that 5 year period, citing what the Tories were trying to get through, however they c;lung to power in a foolish attempt to retain some power for a very short period of time.


    You know, I think this is symptomatic of a general problem in British politics, one party fails miserably to deliver what it said it would so gets voted out, a couple of years down the line the next government is equally unpopular so people, for some strange reason, flock back to the party that has failed over and over again.
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    (Original post by Snufkin)
    Absolutely not, the Liberal Democrats divided the left and let the Tories win. If Lib Dems cared about the country at all they would join Labour.
    For one thing they are not left wing. Since 2007 the Orange Bookers had control. For another had they gone into coalition with Labour there would still have been some austerity and now at the 2015 election we would be looking at a thumping Blair scale Tory majority.

    OK they have had 10 years rather than 5 to bugger up the country but in the coalition tempered by the Lib Dems and now tempered by their pathetic majority of 12, defeated by their own moderate MPs on major policy commitments etc.
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    (Original post by JordanL_)
    Barbaric cuts to welfare for the disabled. Gradual destruction of the NHS. Forceful privatisation of our schools. Theresa May's Snooper's Charter stripping away our privacy in the most dangerous, incompetent way possible.
    The problem is that the loony left accused the Government of doing precisely the same things under the Coalition. If anything, the Lib Dems got it worse than the Conservatives. Still, these accusations generally were *******s then and they're *******s now.

    The problem with overblown rhetoric is when something worse does happen, you've got nowhere to go and you've already bored people to death with scaremongering.

    I loved the Coalition. I thought it was a great thing for this country and the Lib Dems did well within it. The problem was that the Lib Dems had attempted to be all things to all people for a very long time. As such, there was some belief among their newer voters that they were a left-wing alternative to Labour - essentially some sort of socialist party with no taint from the Iraq War. Utter nonsense of course, but it explains why their position was never sustainable.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    The problem is that the loony left accused the Government of doing precisely the same things under the Coalition. If anything, the Lib Dems got it worse than the Conservatives. Still, these accusations generally were *******s then and they're *******s now.

    The problem with overblown rhetoric is when something worse does happen, you've got nowhere to go and you've already bored people to death with scaremongering.
    Yeah IDS is a 'loony lefty'.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    The problem is that the loony left accused the Government of doing precisely the same things under the Coalition. If anything, the Lib Dems got it worse than the Conservatives. Still, these accusations generally were *******s then and they're *******s now.

    The problem with overblown rhetoric is when something worse does happen, you've got nowhere to go and you've already bored people to death with scaremongering.

    I loved the Coalition. I thought it was a great thing for this country and the Lib Dems did well within it. The problem was that the Lib Dems had attempted to be all things to all people for a very long time. As such, there was some belief among their newer voters that they were a left-wing alternative to Labour - essentially some sort of socialist party with no taint from the Iraq War. Utter nonsense of course, but it explains why their position was never sustainable.
    The Social Democratic Party was a social democratic party funnily enough.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    Yeah IDS is a 'loony lefty'.
    Yes, I very much recall seeing IDS claim the Government were introducing "barbaric cuts to welfare for the disabled", destroying the NHS, introducing "privatisation of our schools" and attempting to "take away our universal human rights".

    Christ...
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    (Original post by L i b)
    Yes, I very much recall seeing IDS claim the Government were introducing "barbaric cuts to welfare for the disabled", destroying the NHS, introducing "privatisation of our schools" and attempting to "take away our universal human rights".

    Christ...
    He pretty much has been saying the former, although in politer terms this morning on the Adrew Marr show. He's been calling the cuts unfair and immoral and that the tories don't care about those who don't vote for them (like the poor and disabled).
    Actually watch it before you make a judgement.

    I know it suits your agenda and narrative to portray anyone who so much questions the impact of the cuts as a 'loony lefty' and that there is no legitimate opposition to such cuts. Overton Window much?

    But given that the right wing of the tory party are claiming these cuts are unfair and immoral, it pretty much nullifies your argument that it is all 'loony lefties'.

    Let's not resort to childish name-calling in a bid to restrict debate.
    Many Tories do want to get rid of the HRA. The tories do want to allow private markets into state schools. The NHS is struggling. SO much so that David Laws said that there is a 16bn black hole, not an £8n one as the tories claim in NHS funding.

    None of that is 'subjective'.
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    (Original post by Snufkin)
    Absolutely not, the Liberal Democrats divided the left and let the Tories win. If Lib Dems cared about the country at all they would join Labour.
    Nonsense.

    Gordon Brown was hugely unpopular and labour was far more authoritarian then- see child detention centers, ID cards etc. The lib dems whose raison d'etre is civil liberties would have struggled in coalition (and arguably have been seen to have been undemocratic in that they stopped the largest party (tories) from winning).

    Labour were done for in 2010, and its probably a good thing.

    Now I would be quite happy if the lib dems split and joined the tories/ labour.
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    Nonsense.

    Gordon Brown was hugely unpopular and labour was far more authoritarian then- see child detention centers, ID cards etc. The lib dems whose raison d'etre is civil liberties would have struggled in coalition (and arguably have been seen to have been undemocratic in that they stopped the largest party (tories) from winning).

    Labour were done for in 2010, and its probably a good thing.

    Now I would be quite happy if the lib dems split and joined the tories/ labour.
    Blair called it right though, the LD spent three elections campaigning from the left of Labour and then joined with the Tories.
    However, my position on the Lib Dems has softened somewhat. I think they were right to join but should have got a guarantee for things like a vote on PR and no rise in tf before entering.

    Having seen what they stopped the Tories from doing, it's hard not to miss them atm.

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    (Original post by Davij038)
    Nonsense.

    Gordon Brown was hugely unpopular and labour was far more authoritarian then- see child detention centers, ID cards etc. The lib dems whose raison d'etre is civil liberties would have struggled in coalition (and arguably have been seen to have been undemocratic in that they stopped the largest party (tories) from winning).

    Labour were done for in 2010, and its probably a good thing.

    Now I would be quite happy if the lib dems split and joined the tories/ labour.

    I didn't mention 2010. None of what you said is relevant to my post. There are quite a lot of constituencies where, if Labour and Lib Dem votes were combined, they would be enough to kick out the Tory MP. If all Lib Dem supporters voted Labour, we would never have a Tory government again.
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    (Original post by paul514)
    Got to say I agree, I mean really what's the difference between them? Pretty much zero
    Right. Obviously what we need are even fewer options, because the electorate can't be arsed learning the difference between parties.
 
 
 
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