Identifying as a different race - transracial Watch

Feel Tha Bern
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#81
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#81
(Original post by teenhorrorstory)
Look up the definition of Arab and you'll find out why
It's linguistically defined


brb learning Arabic

http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/show...7#post63534537
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teenhorrorstory
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#82
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#82
(Original post by Feel Tha Bern)
It's linguistically defined


brb learning Arabic

http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/show...7#post63534537
You aint no Arab bruv
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Feel Tha Bern
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#83
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#83
(Original post by teenhorrorstory)
You aint no Arab bruv
*Akh
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High Stakes
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#84
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#84
You can call yourself an Arab if you want. I won't recognise you as an Arab though.
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C-rated
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#85
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#85
I identify as a white male who apparently looks like a viking
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Feel Tha Bern
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#86
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#86
(Original post by C-rated)
I identify as a white male who apparently looks like a viking
You really do lol


If you come near my future wife, I will have Scandinavia nuked
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C-rated
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#87
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#87
(Original post by Feel Tha Bern)
You really do lol


If you come near my future wife, I will have Scandinavia nuked
alright I'll go pillage a monastery instead
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Feel Tha Bern
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#88
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(Original post by C-rated)
alright I'll go pillage a monastery instead
Might join you tbh.
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luminarychild
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#89
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#89
I here by declare my self

A super saiyan
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Mii11
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#90
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You can't change your race because it has to do with your ethnicity and ancestry. Gender is social construct (to a certain degree) so anyone can change it. Sex is partially genetically predetermined (although there are some genetic disorders) but the final outcome is results of various hormonal changes during pregnancy. Therefore some people may be born with abnormal genitalia. Also sex is influenced by hormones. You can change your hormones and genitalia (to a certain extent) so you can change your sex partially but you can't change your race at all because it is purely based on your ancestors.
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ThatOldGuy
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#91
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#91
(Original post by Mii11)
You can change your hormones and genitalia (to a certain extent) so you can change your sex partially but you can't change your race at all because it is purely based on your ancestors.
You cannot change your sex. Period. You can change your gender, but you cannot change your sex.

A Eunuch is not a woman. A mannequin is not a woman. A sex toy shaped like women's genitalia is not a woman.

Sex is chromosomal and biological. You cannot change your sex. You can change your gender, but you cannot change your sex.
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Tom78
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#92
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#92
I want to identify as a mars bar and you can't stop me
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teenhorrorstory
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#93
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(Original post by jennaz77)
So how far do you want to go with your categorising? All blondes in this group, all green eyed in this group, all tanned skin in this group? Of course we are all different in different ways, so why is it that skin colour has been made into such a defined construct that has implications towards your place in society?

There are a lot of factors behind racism and it isn't just the blatant racism that is down to being seen as inferior. That type of racism is slowly being eradicated because it is easy to spot. But the subtle racism that comes down to being classed as different when you are not, is difficult to uproot. You can clearly see that even from your comments on this thread, along with some others, how blind you are to it's affects unless you have experienced it. And it's a shame that instead of listening to somebody with experience, you just challenge and think that you know better.

Yes my skin has more melanin and my hair is a different texture and my eyes are brown, but none of these features should have any affect on anything else to do with my life of who I am as a person. Everyone is still the same no matter the hair colour, eye colour, skin colour, tongue colour whatever. No one is denying people have different skin colours, but it doesn't need to be a defined construct that has any basis in society.
Don't make assumptions. I'm black myself :yy:

You fail to understand what I am saying. I'm not saying that it's necessary for us to be divided into separate races, but that the fact that certain groups of people appear slightly different to others is a self evident truth, so regardless of whether or not we have 'defined' races, we'd still notice these differences and any sort of discrimination or prejudice that *could* stem from this would happen anyway. Even if there were no defined races like black/caucasion etc.. fairer people would still recognise that some people are darker than them and could associate any negative beliefs/stereotypes with them.
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Karaleigh19
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#94
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#94
(Original post by Feel Tha Bern)
If people can sexually identify as the opposite gender, despite all biology and DNA indicating the opposite


Why can't I identify as an Arab, especially given that race is basically a social construct anyway?
Firstly, sex and gender are different. You can identify as a different gender but your sex is biological and you can't just turn that of. Transexual people are those who completely change their sex AND gender.
I may be wrong, but if you are biologically male but identify as female (gender wise) on medical forms under the section "Sex:" you still have to note down 'male', if it says "Gender:" you can put whatever the hell you want (non-binary, male, female, other etc).

Secondly, you can identify as a different race. If you belong to that culture and social contrast, as you said, then there is no harm to it. Race, a.k.a. ethnicity, is what your focus is, right? Well here is the definition of ethnicity; An ethnic group or ethnicity is a category of people who identify with each other based on common ancestral, social, cultural, or national experiences.

As long as you fit into one of those "categories" (social/cultural) then you can identify as whatever race you like. You couldn't identify as a different race based on ancestry though, if you have an Irish ancestry, you can't change that. But you can identify with a different race due to feeling like you belong in their culture/society etc.
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Mii11
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#95
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#95
(Original post by ThatOldGuy)
You cannot change your sex. Period. You can change your gender, but you cannot change your sex.

A Eunuch is not a woman. A mannequin is not a woman. A sex toy shaped like women's genitalia is not a woman.

Sex is chromosomal and biological. You cannot change your sex. You can change your gender, but you cannot change your sex.
It's funny that you say that you can change your gender but then you go one about 'eunuch' (I assume you imply trans women are eunuchs...) cannot be a woman. A woman is a social construct and it is an example of gender in the society. As Simone de Beauvoir beautifully put it: One is not born a woman, but rather, becomes a woman. If you said 'female' then that would be perhaps more correct (as female is used to describe sex more often) but now you are contradicting yourself.

I don't see any arguments in this reply. Sorry to break your bubble but you can change sex (although, like I said to a degree as you can't change your genetical make up and some internal organs still remain after sex change).That is why sex reassignment process is called a 'sex change'. Sex hormones play a big part in determining one's sex and they can be easily changed so that a male subject is able to has hormone levels of a female. A young trans person could essentially look like their desired sex which is an example of sexual dimorphism. After the final surgery, a subject doesn't have gamets nor gonads so the only indicators of the original sex are chromosmes (although some people undergoing sex change, like Caroline Cossey, have abnormal chromosomes) and internal organs. also keep in mind that 'sex change' does not only refer to transsexual people but also to intersexual people. Perhaps it is not a complete 'sex change' although certain aspects of one's sex can clearly be changed.
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ThatOldGuy
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#96
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#96
(Original post by Mii11)
It's funny that you say that you can change your gender but then you go one about 'eunuch' (I assume you imply trans women are eunuchs...) cannot be a woman. A woman is a social construct and it is an example of gender in the society. As Simone de Beauvoir beautifully put it: One is not born a woman, but rather, becomes a woman. If you said 'female' then that would be perhaps more correct (as female is used to describe sex more often) but now you are contradicting yourself.

I don't see any arguments in this reply. Sorry to break your bubble but you can change sex (although, like I said to a degree as you can't change your genetical make up and some internal organs still remain after sex change).That is why sex reassignment process is called a 'sex change'. Sex hormones play a big part in determining one's sex and they can be easily changed so that a male subject is able to has hormone levels of a female. A young trans person could essentially look like their desired sex which is an example of sexual dimorphism. After the final surgery, a subject doesn't have gamets nor gonads so the only indicators of the original sex are chromosmes (although some people undergoing sex change, like Caroline Cossey, have abnormal chromosomes) and internal organs. also keep in mind that 'sex change' does not only refer to transsexual people but also to intersexual people. Perhaps it is not a complete 'sex change' although certain aspects of one's sex can clearly be changed.


The proper terminology is actually a, "Gender reassignment surgery". It is not a "sex change" because you cannot change your sex. You can mutilate your flesh, but lopping off your genitalia does not make you a member of the opposite sex. It just means you have a cleverly mutilated organ.
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Multiculturalism
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#97
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#97
Yes! Identify as another race! Learn tolerance and acceptance through friendship!

We are all human!

Love trumps hate!

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Mii11
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#98
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#98
(Original post by ThatOldGuy)
The proper terminology is actually a, "Gender reassignment surgery". It is not a "sex change" because you cannot change your sex. You can mutilate your flesh, but lopping off your genitalia does not make you a member of the opposite sex. It just means you have a cleverly mutilated organ.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_ch...ical_procedure
I think you cannot read because, as I have already said and provided you with enough information, you can change your sex to a degree.
The surgery is not a mutilation - it is not just like circumcision, castration, removal of the ovaries, sex change performed on intersex individuals (with their consent) or tonsillectomy is not a mutilation as well. You show your ignorance and lack of knowledge by saying it is lopping off genitalia. In case of male to female transsexuals the genitalia are reshaped and very little of the tissue is removed. Newly created structure is called a neovagina. In case of female to male individuals it is called a neophallus.
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ThatOldGuy
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#99
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#99
(Original post by Mii11)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_ch...ical_procedure
I think you cannot read because, as I have already said and provided you with enough information, you can change your sex to a degree.
The surgery is not a mutilation - it is not just like circumcision, castration, removal of the ovaries, sex change performed on intersex individuals (with their consent) or tonsillectomy is not a mutilation as well. You show your ignorance and lack of knowledge by saying it is lopping off genitalia. In case of male to female transsexuals the genitalia are reshaped and very little of the tissue is removed. Newly created structure is called a neovagina. In case of female to male individuals it is called a neophallus.
No, you really cannot. You can repeat it as often as you want, but a male will still have the genetic markers of a male regardless of how cleverly someone took a scalpel to their penis. You can repeat that I am 'Ignorant' as long as you want, but it doesn't change the fact that just because something is shaped like a penis does not mean it is a penis. If I glue Michelangelo's David's genitalia to my body, I would not be a dual-penis'd superman. I would just be a guy who glued a sculpted penis to my body. If I glued a sex toy shaped like women's genitalia to my body, I would not be a hermaphrodite. I would just be a guy who glued a sex toy to my body.

You cannot change your 'sex' to any degree because sex is intrinsic. It is chromosomal. It is one of the first things genetically determined(Though won't show for some time after conception).

You are part of the problem - Confusing sex and gender is a major problem and part of the reason so much heat comes in to this.

You are simply wrong.
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Mii11
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#100
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#100
(Original post by ThatOldGuy)
No, you really cannot. You can repeat it as often as you want, but a male will still have the genetic markers of a male regardless of how cleverly someone took a scalpel to their penis. You can repeat that I am 'Ignorant' as long as you want, but it doesn't change the fact that just because something is shaped like a penis does not mean it is a penis. If I glue Michelangelo's David's genitalia to my body, I would not be a dual-penis'd superman. I would just be a guy who glued a sculpted penis to my body. If I glued a sex toy shaped like women's genitalia to my body, I would not be a hermaphrodite. I would just be a guy who glued a sex toy to my body.

You cannot change your 'sex' to any degree because sex is intrinsic. It is chromosomal. It is one of the first things genetically determined(Though won't show for some time after conception).

You are part of the problem - Confusing sex and gender is a major problem and part of the reason so much heat comes in to this.

You are simply wrong.
No, it is you who is part of the problem. You lack basic knowledge of something that you promote. You say that 'an eunuch cannot be a woman' yet you say it is possible to change gender. Woman is not a biological thing. Female is.

Sex is not only determined by chromosomes and someone has to have poor knowledge to think so. Although chromosomal sex is quite important, it is not always the best indicator of other aspects of sex. E.g. some male-assigned people with de la Chapelle syndrome have XX chromosomes but some of those men have also SRY gene which determines whether a person has testis. This happens due to unequal crossing over during meiosis. A person like that would have female chromosomal sex but obviously would appear otherwise male. It is aslo important to mention that not all of the people with de la Chapelle syndrome have SRY gene so it complicates things even further.

Using your logic, women with AIS would be considered 'men' just because they have XY chromosomes and testis. That is not the case in medical profession. Neovaginal reconstruction and neophallic reconstruction is not only carried out on transsexual people, but also on people who lack genitalia for various reasons (amputation, women born with no vaginas, etc) so would you also call their genitalia fake as well? Obviously it is not as natural as the original ones but that's why these are called reconstructive surgeries.
There are many ways in which sex can be used to describe sex-related characteristics in humans:
- chromosomal sex
- nuclear sex
- gonadal sex
- somatic sex (although this one is not really used in English speaking world)
- morphological sex
- endocrinologic sex
- metabolic sex
- psychological sex (although this one can be considered connected to the idea of gender)

Wikipedia doesn't agree with you as well:
The term "sex change" is sometimes also used for the whole process of changing gender role ("living as a woman" instead of living as a man, or vice versa), not limited to medical procedures. (This process is often much more important to transgender people than the medical procedures themselves, although medically induced changes and surgeries may be needed to make a change of gender role possible, both socially and legally; they can also have a very significant impact on the person's well-being.)Many people also see "sex change" as factually inaccurate.[16] Sex in humans is usually determined by four factors:Not all of these factors can be changed, however:
  • Chromosomes cannot be changed.
  • Gonads can be removed, but not replaced
  • Hormone status is easily changed
  • Existing secondary sex characteristics can to some extent be changed; existing ones mostly through surgery, non-existing ones can be induced to grow through hormones.
    For example: Changing a male genital anatomy into a good or even excellent female appearance with functioning is complicated, but entirely possible; changing a female genital anatomy into an even reasonably male appearing one however is extremely complicated and not successful very often; function is always limited.
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