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    (Original post by Frank Underwood)
    Agreed.

    That's why I said "eventually"
    What is your argument, that we should tax anything that, if consumed excessively, will eventually contribute to a person's death?
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    (Original post by Frank Underwood)
    Drinking too much water or coca-cola in one sitting will kill you.

    Drinking 3 bottles of water a day for 20 years will not kill you, but drinking 3 bottles of coca-cola a day for 20 years will have serious effects on your heath, which could amount to taking time off your life and eventually killing you for health reasons.

    There's a difference, brainiac.
    what if people prefer the pleasure of drinking a lot of sugar drinks over time regardless of the worse health consequences? don't they have a right to do that in a free society without a government essentially telling them they can't via taking their money the more they do it? I really like drinking alcohol and I recognise that it is going to shave a few years off of my life - but I prefer a happy life to a slightly longer one. that's my personal perspective and I deserve to have the right to hold it. it should be the same with sugary drinks - in fact, alcohol has this kind of behavioural tax already and it's moronic. I mean, I could tell you about education - the best education is experience - I've been fat in my life and I've also almost died from alcohol poisoning. I now know how to control my choices more intelligently. the government/taxes had nothing to do with it.
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    what if people prefer the pleasure of drinking a lot of sugar drinks over time regardless of the worse health consequences? don't they have a right to do that in a free society without a government essentially telling them they can't via taking their money the more they do it? I really like drinking alcohol and I recognise that it is going to shave a few years off of my life - but I prefer a happy life to a slightly longer one. that's my personal perspective and I deserve to have the right to hold it. it should be the same with sugary drinks - in fact, alcohol has this kind of behavioural tax already and it's moronic. I mean, I could tell you about education - the best education is experience - I've been fat in my life and I've also almost died from alcohol poisoning. I now know how to control my choices more intelligently. the government/taxes had nothing to do with it.
    Your unhealthy habits will cost the NHS money, therefore you should contribute towards this. You know this first hand, having used up a lot of money being cured of alcohol poisoning, yet you still think the tax on alcohol is moronic. How unbelievably selfish
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    what if people prefer the pleasure of drinking a lot of sugar drinks over time regardless of the worse health consequences? don't they have a right to do that in a free society without a government essentially telling them they can't via taking their money the more they do it? I really like drinking alcohol and I recognise that it is going to shave a few years off of my life - but I prefer a happy life to a slightly longer one. that's my personal perspective and I deserve to have the right to hold it. it should be the same with sugary drinks - in fact, alcohol has this kind of behavioural tax already and it's moronic. I mean, I could tell you about education - the best education is experience - I've been fat in my life and I've also almost died from alcohol poisoning. I now know how to control my choices more intelligently. the government/taxes had nothing to do with it.
    People can prefer to be unhealthy all they like, but their actions which may lead to obesity could result in other peoples' money having to cater for them.

    So to be honest, your argument is basically redundant. Because if more people were willing to buy high-sugar drinks, they would end up taking your money through the NHS anyway.
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    (Original post by pjm600)
    What is your argument, that we should tax anything that, if consumed excessively, will eventually contribute to a person's death?
    I think taxing sugar drinks gives the government extra money, it discourages unhealthy habits, and it would inevitably save money through less obesity. But it's not enough to make a difference really, which is why more needs to be taxed as well.

    But healthy foods should be cheaper.
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    (Original post by difeo)
    Your unhealthy habits will cost the NHS money, therefore you should contribute towards this. You know this first hand, having used up a lot of money being cured of alcohol poisoning, yet you still think the tax on alcohol is moronic. How unbelievably selfish
    I never got "cured" of alcohol poisoning. I went to a nurse for about 5 minutes and she suggested that I had mild alcohol poisoning from a night of manic binge-drinking and that I shouldn't drink for a couple of weeks. she said that the amount I drank was very dangerous and almost lethal. but I was fine in the end. if 5 minutes of a nurse's time warrants me paying for sugary drink taxes I think you're baffling. also, if we're making that connection, then I should *definitely* have paid for the nurse's time and not the drinks because the nurse was my choice and my utility, but sugar drink taxes paying for OTHER people is not going to be my choice.
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    (Original post by Frank Underwood)
    People can prefer to be unhealthy all they like, but their actions which may lead to obesity could result in other peoples' money having to cater for them.

    So to be honest, your argument is basically redundant. Because if more people were willing to buy high-sugar drinks, they would end up taking your money through the NHS anyway.
    if you make stupid and unhealthy decisions which causes the NHS to incur costs, then you should pay for those costs. if we're talking about illnesses that people don't choose to get/inherit, then that should be an example of a legitimate use of NHS funds seeing as they're not based on choice in that sense. how is that an illogical conclusion to draw from the idea of personal responsibility? you can completely stop yourself from getting ill in that way just like you can stop yourself from becoming homeless.
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    I never got "cured" of alcohol poisoning. I went to a nurse for about 5 minutes and she suggested that I had mild alcohol poisoning from a night of manic binge-drinking and that I shouldn't drink for a couple of weeks. she said that the amount I drank was very dangerous and almost lethal. but I was fine in the end. if 5 minutes of a nurse's time warrants me paying for sugary drink taxes I think you're baffling. also, if we're making that connection, then I should *definitely* have paid for the nurse's time and not the drinks because the nurse was my choice and my utility, but sugar drink taxes paying for OTHER people is not going to be my choice.
    Lol okay, well your wording was misleading. Regardless, the point stands just you're not a good example of it.
    All taxes pay for other people, that's how taxes work.
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    (Original post by difeo)
    Lol okay, well your wording was misleading. Regardless, the point stands just you're not a good example of it.
    All taxes pay for other people, that's how taxes work.
    no they don't. but the police, the military, MPs, civil servants, judges etc all pay for the mechanisms for a society that I am a part of an am protected/served by. I use these services and the existence of these services directly benefits me in the sense that they safeguard my liberties. somebody else getting NHS treatment because they were stupid regarding their sugar intake is *not* beneficial to me so I shouldn't have to pay for it. comparatively, if somebody burgled me, I can use the police/courts to (hopefully) be compensated or have the criminal punished. if the NHS exists for all in society, it only concerns their own choices, not choices of criminals against them.
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    no they don't. but the police, the military, MPs, civil servants, judges etc all pay for the mechanisms for a society that I am a part of an am protected/served by. I use these services and the existence of these services directly benefits me in the sense that they safeguard my liberties. somebody else getting NHS treatment because they were stupid regarding their sugar intake is *not* beneficial to me so I shouldn't have to pay for it. comparatively, if somebody burgled me, I can use the police/courts to (hopefully) be compensated or have the criminal punished. if the NHS exists for all in society, it only concerns their own choices, not choices of criminals against them.
    You use/have used/will use the NHS.
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    because I, a citizen, am now going to become poorer because of my government, for the sake of other people who can't take responsibility for their own faults and failures. I am a fit/healthy guy and I enjoy eating sugary foods/drinks here and there, but I am perhaps active enough and prudent enough (regarding my other diet choices) to not let these foods make me gain weight. however, other people are simply too stupid or lazy to be healthy, so the goernment says "well **** you, healthy guy, we care about the stupid lazy people more than the responsible, so we're going to lump you into this tax as well because we can't think of a better idea" - I can think of a better idea. either don't have any kind of penalties for people's own life choices and allow them to learn their own lessons, OR simply impose a personal "fat person tax" for people that are of a certain amount over a "normal" weight - that means you won't punish healthy people for being responsible. the government is idioticly correlating food choices with healthiness - well I have unhealthy food choices here and there, but this tax won't change my weight. It'll simply change my ****ing bank balance. the government should do something more intelligent than make an innocent party like me poorer for the sake of other people's idiocies. goddamn.
    I am fat, but I am healthy, so STFU with your stereotypes that being fat makes someone lazy.

    Tell that to my doctor who themselves scratches their head my blood sugar, cholesterol, blood pressure are so good they are like someone who keeps fit.

    Maybe thats because I like to walk, don't drink or smoke I honestly cant remember last time I had something like KFC, Mcdonalds, Burger King I think around a year ago for each and even then maybe 2 or 3 times a year at most when no other option (or in summer when I want a ice cream and so get a meal deal as get one free with student card)

    Your post seems more ignorant than nasty but a little bit bitter at least.

    By the way I changed from sugary drinks to sugar free last year except now and again (as some things have no sugar free versions)

    And also I know many thin people who are very unhealthy and despite me being 30 people think I am much younger due to good skin, no wrinkles, and when walking with friends even hillwalking at college I am the fastest one there and barely struggling to breathe whilst others at the bottom of the hill are gasping for breath and constantly stopping.

    Also FYI the reasons I am fat in the first place is due to mental health reasons though always been large built so even when a stone underweight I looked fat, if anything now I am really fat people think I am far thinner than I actually am(but still fat)

    Onto the sugar tax not read onto how it will be implemented, but sugar itself is cheap the prices for things like drinks is almost all profit anyway, so instead of lower but still massive profits companies will increase prices.

    I worry it will be even worse for nights out because as is many prices charge the same or even far more for a soft drink than a pint of lager!
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    (Original post by drbluebox)
    I am fat, but I am healthy, so STFU with your stereotypes that being fat makes someone lazy.

    Tell that to my doctor who themselves scratches their head my blood sugar, cholesterol, blood pressure are so good they are like someone who keeps fit.
    You're young, of course your blood pressure etc will be in the normal range despite being fat. As you get older they will get worse quicker than someone is a healthy weight. Being fat is not healthy.
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    (Original post by difeo)
    You use/have used/will use the NHS.
    hardly. I use it to the extent that I would be better off paying for it privately than paying taxes to get it publicly. besides, when it comes to life-threatening illnesses and surgeries, from the experience of both my father and mother (both cancer), I can tell you that the waiting times were so long that they had to go private because the waiting time might have been too long for them. I know they say that they put people onto fast tracks i it's drastic but that really wasn't the treatment that they received. and we're a poor family. believe me. we're not people who expect privileged treatment.
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    (Original post by drbluebox)
    I am fat, but I am healthy, so STFU with your stereotypes that being fat makes someone lazy.

    Tell that to my doctor who themselves scratches their head my blood sugar, cholesterol, blood pressure are so good they are like someone who keeps fit.

    Maybe thats because I like to walk, don't drink or smoke I honestly cant remember last time I had something like KFC, Mcdonalds, Burger King I think around a year ago for each and even then maybe 2 or 3 times a year at most when no other option (or in summer when I want a ice cream and so get a meal deal as get one free with student card)

    Your post seems more ignorant than nasty but a little bit bitter at least.

    By the way I changed from sugary drinks to sugar free last year except now and again (as some things have no sugar free versions)

    And also I know many thin people who are very unhealthy and despite me being 30 people think I am much younger due to good skin, no wrinkles, and when walking with friends even hillwalking at college I am the fastest one there and barely struggling to breathe whilst others at the bottom of the hill are gasping for breath and constantly stopping.

    Also FYI the reasons I am fat in the first place is due to mental health reasons though always been large built so even when a stone underweight I looked fat, if anything now I am really fat people think I am far thinner than I actually am(but still fat)

    Onto the sugar tax not read onto how it will be implemented, but sugar itself is cheap the prices for things like drinks is almost all profit anyway, so instead of lower but still massive profits companies will increase prices.

    I worry it will be even worse for nights out because as is many prices charge the same or even far more for a soft drink than a pint of lager!
    drbluebox thank you very much for this combination of whining and excusing yourself. I will very much consider possibly replying to this inspiring and thought-provoking message in the coming future.
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    I dont think its bad, but it is uneven and just headline grabbing. Why not tax other products with sugar in. i was reading some starbucks contain 27 teaspoons of sugar.
    Yes, maybe the most sweet thing you can find on the menu, but I doubt that a normal cup of coffee has more than a teaspoon or two.

    Besides, people who drink sweet coffee deserve diabetes, if you want something sweet go drink something else for ****s sake. Coffee is not supposed to be sweet.
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    (Original post by popcornjpg)
    Yes, maybe the most sweet thing you can find on the menu, but I doubt that a normal cup of coffee has more than a teaspoon or two.

    Besides, people who drink sweet coffee deserve diabetes, if you want something sweet go drink something else for ****s sake. Coffee is not supposed to be sweet.
    Dunno dont care. If you are worried about sugar consumption then it makes sense to look at all sources of sugar intake including food and confectionery.
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    (Original post by sleepysnooze)
    drbluebox thank you very much for this combination of whining and excusing yourself. I will very much consider possibly replying to this inspiring and thought-provoking message in the coming future.
    Im so sorry a family member being murdered and my grandfather getting cancer at same time and members of the public pointing fingers at my family because we were on benefits destroyed my mental health, im so sorry that I gained weight only at exam time when I was busy revising, im so sorry I cook home made food and hardly ever eat big portions.

    Fact is you don't know anything about me or why I became this way you just see I am overweight, I know you are just trolling but you seem to be living in a bubble or just not that intelligent.

    (Original post by difeo)
    You're young, of course your blood pressure etc will be in the normal range despite being fat. As you get older they will get worse quicker than someone is a healthy weight. Being fat is not healthy.
    Im 33, and how do you know what my diet and lifestyle is?

    And how do you explain the doctors themselves outright scratching their heads and saying my results show me to be HEALTHIER than someone who keeps fit.

    Maybe its the fact I dont also drink tea or coffee, I don't eat many fatty foods.

    My only vice for years was sugary drinks and since being off them I have lost weight, and whenever I had a family trauma I ate fast food for that period that lasted 2-3 months then ok rest of year.

    I only eat butchers meat never frozen or even supermarket premium.

    I never eat at McDonalds or simiar,

    So again why do you think just being fat is bad against people who gorge on bad food all the time, drink.smoke and other unhealthy things but are thin?

    My parents are fat and their idea of a takeaway is like 2 or 3 times a year, my dad spends 2-3 hours a day making meals from scratch be it a stew or home made lentil soup, mum never eats sweets and both rarely snack and its often apples and bananas (very rarely crisps)

    So explain why they are fat and they themselves get good results at doctors? Any health conditions they have had over the years have been due to things like cancer or the accident my dad had when younger.
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    (Original post by drbluebox)
    Fact is you don't know anything about me or why I became this way you just see I am overweight, I know you are just trolling but you seem to be living in a bubble or just not that intelligent.



    Im 33, and how do you know what my diet and lifestyle is?

    And how do you explain the doctors themselves outright scratching their heads and saying my results show me to be HEALTHIER than someone who keeps fit.

    Maybe its the fact I dont also drink tea or coffee, I don't eat many fatty foods.

    My only vice for years was sugary drinks and since being off them I have lost weight, and whenever I had a family trauma I ate fast food for that period that lasted 2-3 months then ok rest of year.

    I only eat butchers meat never frozen or even supermarket premium.

    I never eat at McDonalds or simiar,

    So again why do you think just being fat is bad against people who gorge on bad food all the time, drink.smoke and other unhealthy things but are thin?

    My parents are fat and their idea of a takeaway is like 2 or 3 times a year, my dad spends 2-3 hours a day making meals from scratch be it a stew or home made lentil soup, mum never eats sweets and both rarely snack and its often apples and bananas (very rarely crisps)

    So explain why they are fat and they themselves get good results at doctors? Any health conditions they have had over the years have been due to things like cancer or the accident my dad had when younger.
    33 is young.
    You're fat because you eat too many calories. Maybe it's in the form of good food, but quantity is as important as quality.
    It's funny how every fat person says how their numbers are healthy and their doctors don't understand how. I seriously doubt it's the case.
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    (Original post by difeo)
    33 is young.
    You're fat because you eat too many calories. Maybe it's in the form of good food, but quantity is as important as quality.
    It's funny how every fat person says how their numbers are healthy and their doctors don't understand how. I seriously doubt it's the case.
    ITs funny how every person thinks they know everything about being fat especially when they are not fat themselves and likely just know what they read.

    And what makes you an expert over thet doctors hey even a dietician I spoke to said what I eat wasnt the problem it was the quantity, I dont smoke, drink, never really drink tea or coffee. rarely eat sweets,

    I don't doubt my diet isn't that great but nor is it a stereotype me stuffing my face, I could list you what little I ate many days and it may all be bad, and I could list you small things which aren't the best but not the worst just full of calories.

    Not every fat person says their numbers are healthy though, you just ignore ones which do so.

    Yes my diet today was bad, home made pizza with onion, and a packet of micro chips, can of sugar free energy drink (first one I had in about a month) in fact thats all I ate today.

    What part of my problem so I have been told is I starve until bedtime when I feel weak then eat a lot in one go, I have some 2 butchers chicken burgers in the fridge and I will have those and if still hungry a macaroni pie.

    Yesterday was my one takeaway for the week which was a donner kebab(which I left about 4/5 of and just ate the bread and salad) with a large seperate side salad, and though that may seem I ate junk for 2 days it just so happens those 2 days were the bad ones for this week. I also drank 3 small bottles of iced tea

    Tuesday was half a large pie and a lot of potatos spread out over the whole day, I did eat 2 creme eggs though. and 3 cans of pepsi max

    Yes all bad food and calorific but am I stuffing my face? The other half of my problem is that I dont each much veg and potato, lets say I make chicken and rice I make too much as it looks small but things like rice bulk up.

    So that diet was junk but not on large portions rest of week was things like leftovers.

    What I am saying though is its wrong to think automatically I am unhealthy because I am fat its more correct to say that its possible I am less heathy than a thin person with the same lifestyle (just eating less) but also being thin doesn't mean they are far more healthy than I am as they could be unhealthy.

    Why is it ok to just assume fat people are autotmatically unhealthy.

    Finally you dont know if my weight gain is ongoing or limited to certain periods in my life, each time I gained weight was in response to trauma like family death, or exam period, or other excessive event. rest of the year I never gained weight it was just it never dropped off either.
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    (Original post by drbluebox)
    ITs funny how every person thinks they know everything about being fat especially when they are not fat themselves and likely just know what they read.

    And what makes you an expert over thet doctors hey even a dietician I spoke to said what I eat wasnt the problem it was the quantity, I dont smoke, drink, never really drink tea or coffee. rarely eat sweets,

    I don't doubt my diet isn't that great but nor is it a stereotype me stuffing my face, I could list you what little I ate many days and it may all be bad, and I could list you small things which aren't the best but not the worst just full of calories.

    Not every fat person says their numbers are healthy though, you just ignore ones which do so.

    Yes my diet today was bad, home made pizza with onion, and a packet of micro chips, can of sugar free energy drink (first one I had in about a month) in fact thats all I ate today.

    What part of my problem so I have been told is I starve until bedtime when I feel weak then eat a lot in one go, I have some 2 butchers chicken burgers in the fridge and I will have those and if still hungry a macaroni pie.

    Yesterday was my one takeaway for the week which was a donner kebab(which I left about 4/5 of and just ate the bread and salad) with a large seperate side salad, and though that may seem I ate junk for 2 days it just so happens those 2 days were the bad ones for this week. I also drank 3 small bottles of iced tea

    Tuesday was half a large pie and a lot of potatos spread out over the whole day, I did eat 2 creme eggs though. and 3 cans of pepsi max

    Yes all bad food and calorific but am I stuffing my face? The other half of my problem is that I dont each much veg and potato, lets say I make chicken and rice I make too much as it looks small but things like rice bulk up.

    So that diet was junk but not on large portions rest of week was things like leftovers.

    What I am saying though is its wrong to think automatically I am unhealthy because I am fat its more correct to say that its possible I am less heathy than a thin person with the same lifestyle (just eating less) but also being thin doesn't mean they are far more healthy than I am as they could be unhealthy.

    Why is it ok to just assume fat people are autotmatically unhealthy.

    Finally you dont know if my weight gain is ongoing or limited to certain periods in my life, each time I gained weight was in response to trauma like family death, or exam period, or other excessive event. rest of the year I never gained weight it was just it never dropped off either.
    So you say your diet is good and then go on to say you eat too much and a lot of it is *****y food (3 cans of pepsi in one day, creme eggs, doner kebab, barely any veg)... okay

    Being fat doesn't mean you're always stuffing your face. It does mean you eat too many calories.
 
 
 
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