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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    Hear hear!

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------

    I'm a tory because I grew up. My blood still bleeds red in places, and I don't (like some people) think that tax is at all a bad thing. I believe that corporatism is pragmatic, if imperfect, but overall it's the best system we have. I think that we as a society work best when there's an equal balance in taxation and spending, so balancing the books is important to me. When the government spends nearly £50bn a year on interest repayments on the national debt (roughly £800 per person, per year) that's not sustainable. I think that overall spending should be lowered, but spending on infrastructure is okay, I think that a paternal government is the most practical, and the progressive nature of the modern tory party is something to be proud of. I trust the tories with my money and the economy moreso than Labour, even if I have a lot of respect for Corbyn (and don't think he's completely wrong).

    But then again, I'm not like most conservatives.
    Cameron's Conservative Party is not a party of fiscal responsibility. Their methods of reducing the national debt are a joke, their cuts are ideological and doing far more harm than good. You know Labour didn't wreck the economy. Brown over Osbourne any day of the week. And a smaller state (as implied by reduced spending) will tend to be less paternalistic.
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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    Cameron's Conservative Party is not a party of fiscal responsibility. They're methods of reducing the national debt are a joke, their cuts are ideological and doing far more harm than good. You know Labour didn't wreck the economy. Brown over Osbourne any day of the week. And a smaller state (as implied by reduced spending) will tend to be less paternalistic.
    I do know that, and I know that their cuts are going to far, and I even think that there is some sincerity in what IDS has said. This government isn't my ideal one, far too thatcherite, but I think that I can trust David Cameron with my money moreso than Corbyn, though that being said, I don't know if I can say the same thing for whoever replaces Cameron.

    I miss the old not-nuetral you, I must say.
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    (Original post by JRKinder)
    Well I'm in year 13 now and my school is in quite a deprived area, so you're going to have to trust me when I say there are some people out there who literally DO NOT want to work. Perhaps it's ingrained into their culture, which is quite likely as people with successful parents tend to also go on to be relatively successful, but if that's the case then we need to have a cultural change to one which celebrates education and rewards those who try hard. It's a tough situation really, because depriving them of benefits could give them an added incentive to get out there and try hard, but it's not going to be particularly inspiring to begin with and may impact on other parts of their life. So I think I agree with the principle, but I'm not qualified enough to really comment on the best way to implement it.

    And yeah high paid-high stress jobs aren't for everyone, and that wasn't what I was implying at all. Everyone should do a job that makes them happy and they're comfortable with, but I think it's important to be financially stable and not rely on the state.
    Of course, I grew up in a poor area too and met many over the years who never wanted to work who ende dup being the ones doing scams to get the most benefits and living in nice homes whilst I was barely making ends meet on benefits or working.

    But I met just as many people who were well off who felt like they were entitled to things despite living off mummy and daddy and talking about how lazy people on benefits are, the only difference was whom they got their money from.

    It was even harder when I was at school as the only people who had computers/internet were the very wealthy, revision was almost all written notes or study guides you purchased.

    Imagine the middle class kids buying private tuition, so no wonder they did better, and a school that didnt care I mean I left with 100% in many exams and still called slow and other things (I am autistic but that wasnt around in those days for diagnosis)
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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    I do know that, and I know that their cuts are going to far, and I even think that there is some sincerity in what IDS has said. This government isn't my ideal one, far too thatcherite, but I think that I can trust David Cameron with my money moreso than Corbyn, though that being said, I don't know if I can say the same thing for whoever replaces Cameron.

    I miss the old not-nuetral you, I must say.
    David Cameron might spend less money (though the stats aren't really in his favour) but it won't be spent well. I suspect the kind of Conservative Party you're looking for is basically a New Labour Party. I don't think Cameron's successor will be more centred than he is, though it is likely that Corbyn's will be.

    One must allow themselves a few moments of indulgence. But even outside the MHoC forum I'd never criticise a TSR party whilst in office.
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    It helps you get invited to dinner parties,makes you seem intelligent and annoys lefties.
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    (Original post by moggis)
    It helps you get invited to dinner parties,makes you seem intelligent and annoys lefties.
    I've never ever been invited to a dinner party, and tbh, I don't even think they're real.
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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    David Cameron might spend less money (though the stats aren't really in his favour) but it won't be spent well. I suspect the kind of Conservative Party you're looking for is basically a New Labour Party. I don't think Cameron's successor will be more centred than he is, though it is likely that Corbyn's will be.

    One must allow themselves a few moments of indulgence. But even outside the MHoC forum I'd never criticise a TSR party whilst in office.
    It all depends on the cabinet to be honest, I'd like to see a few of the last remaining compassionate conservatives in office, but that will likely only be achieved under Gove or Johnson.
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    You mean cuckservative?

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    (Original post by ZakiTheTory)
    I'm Conservative because I believe in a low tax society in which people can have aspiration and work their way up the ranks. I'm also not a big fan of the generous welfare system which people exploited and on which nothing was done about under Labour. With a strong economy comes strong progress so I believe that a budget surplus is crucial to our long term development.

    I also am a fan of the modern day party's position on social equality; promoting how anyone should have equal rights and opportunity regardless of their gender, race or sexuality. We have taken great steps to legalise gay marriage and propose legislation to narrow down the gender pay gap.

    I'm not one to think well of the current socialist 'Labour' party; they are in a complete mess and Corbyn is just digging a hole for himself with his ultra-left ideas which will not win over the centrists and neutral- at the moment the conservatives are the only logical party who can get things done.
    If you think the welfare state is generous maybe you should go out into the real world, I mean that without offense as I grew up in a house with rotten floorboards, mouldy walls, no carpet and parents going without food, you are going by the people who played the system not realising the genuine claimaints always lost out.

    How can you believe in social equality when the tories have cut benefits to the needy? I am meant to get social workers to help me with my mental health issues but due to cutbacks I get none, I was meant to go on a training course with a GUARANTEED permanent job aimed at autistic people, guess what Tories cut funding to it.

    Seems you just respond to gestures aimed at fooling the public like legalising gay marriage and don't care that vulnerable people are screwed over or do equal rights not count there?
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    (Original post by Cato the Elder)
    Perhaps he's a Thatcherite?

    You're not very compassionate for a socialist...calling someone a "twerp" is very offensive and immature..
    Socialists are not supposed to be compassionate. Socialism ensures that we no longer need compassion to provide for people in dire straits. It just happens automatically via the social security system.
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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    It all depends on the cabinet to be honest, I'd like to see a few of the last remaining compassionate conservatives in office, but that will likely only be achieved under Gove or Johnson.
    A 'compassionate conservative' might not make the country much worse, but conservatives, by their very nature, struggle to improve anything. They're the ones who benefit from the status quo after all.

    Johnson? That socially liberal Thatcherite? Nah thanks. I'd condemn his views if they weren't so opaque.
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    (Original post by RayApparently)
    A 'compassionate conservative' might not make the country much worse
    Wasn't George Bush supposed to be a "compassionate conservative"

    ... yeah :beard:

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    (Original post by chemting)
    Wasn't George Bush supposed to be a "compassionate conservative"

    ... yeah :beard:

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    :laugh: Can't really compare with the Americans tbh.

    (Original post by scrotgrot)
    Socialists are not supposed to be compassionate. Socialism ensures that we no longer need compassion to provide for people in dire straits. It just happens automatically via the social security system.
    Hear, hear!
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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    I do know that, and I know that their cuts are going to far, and I even think that there is some sincerity in what IDS has said. This government isn't my ideal one, far too thatcherite, but I think that I can trust David Cameron with my money moreso than Corbyn, though that being said, I don't know if I can say the same thing for whoever replaces Cameron.

    I miss the old not-nuetral you, I must say.
    But that's because you have money. And the more money you have the less help you need from the state. I (will) have benefited greatly from the Tory budgets and certainly feel that the Tories will protect my money more, but it's not about what's best for me, I'm perfectly capable of taking care of that myself, it's about what's best for the country and the people in it.

    Corbyn, unfortunately, has neither the instinct nor the support to abolish income tax, council tax and value added tax in favour of land tax, property tax and cascading tax. That is the realm of left libertarians who never even get a mention let alone a sniff of power.

    But even if far from power, with radical solutions it is possible for normal people with decent income/capital to keep what they have while also providing abundantly for those who need it. Taking money off the middle classes and giving that to the poor is obviously not going to foster solidarity - which is exactly the way our betters like it.
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    (Original post by scrotgrot)
    But that's because you have money. And the more money you have the less help you need from the state. I (will) have benefited greatly from the Tory budgets and certainly feel that the Tories will protect my money more, but it's not about what's best for me, I'm perfectly capable of taking care of that myself, it's about what's best for the country and the people in it.

    Corbyn, unfortunately, has neither the instinct nor the support to abolish income tax, council tax and value added tax in favour of land tax, property tax and cascading tax. That is the realm of left libertarians who never even get a mention let alone a sniff of power.

    But even if far from power, with radical solutions it is possible for normal people with decent income/capital to keep what they have while also providing abundantly for those who need it. Taking money off the middle classes and giving that to the poor is obviously not going to foster solidarity - which is exactly the way our betters like it.
    You know nothing about me m8.
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    (Original post by Lime-man)
    You know nothing about me m8.
    What are you taking offence at? You said "the Tories will protect my money", ergo you have some money. Therefore you are not as important a target for wealth redistribution as people who have no money. Since the wealth distribution is so egregiously skewed towards the rich you would probably get a fair whack extra anyway if wealth was properly redistributed rather than just bumped around between the various working classes (this includes the middle class).
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    (Original post by JRKinder)
    And it's situations like this where a welfare system is important. But I think he was referring to the people who literally do not even attempt to try hard at school who see living on benefits a viable future; being against paying benefits to these types of people is a sentiment I share because it undermines the hard work of others.

    I was one of those people.

    (In fact,although it's a long time since I've claimed benefits that's only because I chanced upon a money making opportunity when I was at my lowest point.)

    And I simply don't understand why anyone would have a problem with such people.

    Far from undermining the 'hard work' of others they accentuate the 'hard work' of others.

    I say 'hard work' because of course most people don't work hard.

    Most people in life do as little work as they can get away with.

    And so they should.

    Because whilst I'm not going to claim to know the purpose of life I'm pretty sure it's probably **** all to do with working hard!

    And those people that do work hard do so either because they are driven-so not really their decision then,or because they worship money or because their parents strongly encouraged them to or because they have a particular job that they feel they really must do or else they won't be happy or because they are stupid,

    Personally,none of those impress me but each to their own,eh?

    I loathe Conservatives.I really do.Absolutely hate them.They make me puke.

    Because they never ever come out with the truth.

    The reason people are conservative is because they are selfish .All other reasons are total bs.

    And there's nothing really wrong with that.Almost everyone is.


    Which of course is partly why capitalism works so damnedly well.


    (Sorry,I realise of course,just about having enough intelligence to know,that this post adds nothing other than to make me feel temporarily better. Which to be fair is the only reason I post.)
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    I'm a Conservative because i believe in fiscal conservatism, that the state spends too much on crap and burdens the populous with too much taxation. Having grown up poor i'm entirely convinced that there is a deserving and undeserving poor (the likes of the disabled or redundant are undeserving) but such a life has also instilled in me the value of hard work, an aspirational mindset and has made me appreciate what the market can do for the working poor. I believe very much in a property owning democracy and while none was perfect i consider MacMillan and Thatcher to be utterly brilliant and Major the epitamy of what a Conservative should be. Although not as important to me i also believe in much of what Lime Man said on the previous page and post below, i believe in a somewhat parental state (i find the notion that the state would condone the suicide of it's suicide through euthanasia to be offensive for example) and i also on foreign policy issues especially have a morally conservative streak which lends me to abhor pacifism and isolationism (the left should be ashamed of what they've allowed to happen in Syria - millions fled, half a million are dead and Russia has been granted a strategic victory). I do however have a somewhat libertarian streak when it comes to domestic social policy (i support gay marriage and prostitution for example) and i'm not fixed when it comes to constitutional reform.

    *I should say that i'm a pragmatist however and i'm prepared to use the state to achieve Tory ends where it's not politically practical to put in place a pure ideological solution.

    In short..



    (Original post by similarBlank)
    Hello,

    I'm curious,

    Why do people identify as Conservative and why do they think this is the best ideology?
    (Original post by Lime-man)
    Hear hear!

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------

    I'm a tory because I grew up. My blood still bleeds red in places, and I don't (like some people) think that tax is at all a bad thing. I believe that corporatism is pragmatic, if imperfect, but overall it's the best system we have. I think that we as a society work best when there's an equal balance in taxation and spending, so balancing the books is important to me. When the government spends nearly £50bn a year on interest repayments on the national debt (roughly £800 per person, per year) that's not sustainable. I think that overall spending should be lowered, but spending on infrastructure is okay, I think that a paternal government is the most practical, and the progressive nature of the modern tory party is something to be proud of. I trust the tories with my money and the economy moreso than Labour, even if I have a lot of respect for Corbyn (and don't think he's completely wrong).

    But then again, I'm not like most conservatives.
    Having been a part of Conservative Future and on TSR (and in the TSR Tories, many of whom are RL Tory members) i can tell you that there are more people who think like us than you realise (bar the Corbyn respect i imagine - i can't say i really have much respect for him and what he's doing to a party that produced Blair).
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    (Original post by Cato the Elder)
    Perhaps he's a Thatcherite?

    You're not very compassionate for a socialist...calling someone a "twerp" is very offensive and immature..
    You think that's the worse things socialists call Thatcherites :rofl:

    I'm an old fashioned socialist. You know, like going to Spain to kill fascists. Not one of these drippy love everyone hippies.

    I'm calling him a twerp on behalf of all the cleaners he insulted (I've done jobs that involve cleaning). Worker solidarity!
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    Rakas21

    This was the last time the Tories won a London Majority in a GE. It's not hard to see why.

    Love Major <3
 
 
 
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