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    (Original post by paul514)
    She's doing an MA, so her previous qualification was an undergrad in an elective system. Point stands.

    As does everything else I've said.


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    she graduated in psychology as an undergrad meaning she focused on that for her second third and fourth years.
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    (Original post by MJlover)
    she graduated in psychology as an undergrad meaning she focused on that for her second third and fourth years.
    2 years of study the earliest you can take the required classes to go on a major is the second year.

    Even if you were right it's still irrelevant


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    I'm sorry but this is nonsense. You can't attribute the despicable behaviour of the minority of refugees to PTSD. PTSD does not cause a person to go around sexually harassing women,raping young boys, or making disgusting comments towards women that clearly highlight an underlying problem regarding the mindset of those people. They are sexist,ungrateful idiots,and are making the lives of other refugees more difficult. Because of their actions, countries are now reluctant to take in any more refugees. If it was down to PTSD, then why are men significantly over represented in comparison to women? Both sexes lived through the horrors of war, yet it's a specific group of young adult males committing crimes.
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    (Original post by MJlover)
    I'm not misinformed, I have psychosis and anxiety myself and am not a violent person, yet I can't speak for people with different experiences to me, especially since my illness wasn't bought on witnessing war.
    How does that qualify you not to be misinformed about PTSD?

    (Original post by MJlover)
    I did reference studies and stats but most here are anti-Muslims who would turn a deaf ear to that
    Who on this thread is Anti-Muslim? (Or are you just running out of arguments and know try to call everyone Anti-Muslim, who disagrees with you?) I think most on this thread are rather disturbed, that you link the crimes you have cited (and that is, what you have done, you haven't said "act more aggressive", but "sexual assault/Cologne/etc.") towards refugee with PTSD and thus spread misinformation about PTSD which will harm those, actually suffering from it.
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    (Original post by The Epicurean)
    I made a point not too different from this about a year ago regarding refugees fighting on a boat and some got pushed overboard. But basically, it doesn't seem unfathomable that experiences have had a negative effect upon them. To borrow from my old post:



    One does have to ask whether we are doing the necessary checks on people coming in to ensure that they haven't been psychologically effected by their experiences, and if so, are we providing them with the necessary therapy and care. Also, it seems to me that we seen to throw all refugees/migrants (or whatever term you wish to use) together, ignoring the fact that they often come from different countries, speak different language, have different cultures, different religions etc.. Hostilities that already existed between these groups and they wont suddenly magically disappear and so obviously there will be a lot of tension.

    It is quite clear also that a negative environment can have huge negative effects on individuals. One only needs to look at prisons. People often get sent to prison for small petty crimes, but their mixing with much more violent and aggressive criminals in a rather horrible environment often results in them becoming more hardened criminals. We can see the negative effects when we look at the high rates of re-offenders. If we are having these issues with prisoners, then it isn't unfathomable that we will have issues with people escaping from war zones, who will also have been negatively affected by their environment.
    I think, the debate here is more about linking those crimes specifically to PTSD, which is a whole different story, that to being brutalized (etc.) by war and/or coming from an upbringing/situation, where being violent was the normal behaviour.

    (Original post by MJlover)

    I don't know the specifics of PTSD as I study History
    To bgein with: Have you read the DSM and/or ICD definitions?
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    Hahaha, PTSD, the new universal justification of being an overly sensitive spoiled brat. You can throw it into the same bag with Asperger's and ADHD.
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    (Original post by Nathanielle)
    I think, the debate here is more about linking those crimes specifically to PTSD, which is a whole different story, that to being brutalized (etc.) by war and/or coming from an upbringing/situation, where being violent was the normal behaviour.
    I'm not willing to link any the crimes committed to PTSD, but I do believe this thread opens an important debate up about the negative impacts the experiences could have had on those migrating to Europe, which I think we should try and steer the topic towards. We don't really seem to be doing much, if anything at all, to make the appropriate checks and ensuring that they get the necessary care and treatment (although this is admittedly difficult when huge numbers of people are crossing borders daily).
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    (Original post by Life_peer)
    Hahaha, PTSD, the new universal justification of being an overly sensitive spoiled brat. You can throw it into the same bag with Asperger's and ADHD.
    PTSD isnt a joke,it's a serious mental illness, which is why its so important to understand it properly so we don't end up doing what OP is doing
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    (Original post by The Epicurean)
    I'm not willing to link any the crimes committed to PTSD, but I do believe this thread opens an important debate up about the negative impacts the experiences could have had on those migrating to Europe, which I think we should try and steer the topic towards. We don't really seem to be doing much, if anything at all, to make the appropriate checks and ensuring that they get the necessary care and treatment (although this is admittedly difficult when huge numbers of people are crossing borders daily).
    Yes, but as the OP clearly stated a link between PTSD and those crimes, I think, this thread isn't the right place to lead another debate, because it will be really confusing.
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    This thread is actually full of complete morons;

    Do half of you even know what PTSD is and what makes you suffer it? Most of your logic is that it is a free card to do what you want well its not and its not "racist" to think that refugees should not be "raping" and "murdering" this countries nationals (some idiot is just using the race card in this thread)

    Secondly if the logic applies, then the rape victims ALSO should be entitled to go and kill their attacker (or does PTSD only apply when you want?)

    Thirdly, many people suffer PTSD after road accidents, you dont see them doing some of the things you claim are "okay" by refugees.

    Lastly stop putting all refugees under the same category, MOST are just normal people trying to take away from a warzone, some are undeniably scum and well that is what happens when you let THOUSANDS in. This country like every other EU country took the wrong decision in who it let in, it should have been letting in young kids with their mothers, instead they let in young men some of who just have nothing but hate towards the west and westerners.
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    (Original post by teenhorrorstory)
    PTSD isnt a joke,it's a serious mental illness, which is why its so important to understand it properly so we don't end up doing what OP is doing
    It is when someone claims she got it on Twitter or a flight from Turkey. That's what I meant.
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    What we have seen in Europe is " Migrants " acting so disrespectfully towards others who have allowed them to claim asylum. We have witnessed rapes , murders and such disgusting behaviour ( " migrants running around causing chaos , smashing peoples houses , cars up , assaulting Europeans because they looked at them .... I'm sure but having PTSD doesn't justify this behaviour and I hope this gets sorted out before people take up arms against " Migrants" ( Trust me it will happen and if I have to take up arms to protect myself then I will )
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    (Original post by Nathanielle)
    How does that qualify you not to be misinformed about PTSD?


    Who on this thread is Anti-Muslim? (Or are you just running out of arguments and know try to call everyone Anti-Muslim, who disagrees with you?) I think most on this thread are rather disturbed, that you link the crimes you have cited (and that is, what you have done, you haven't said "act more aggressive", but "sexual assault/Cologne/etc.") towards refugee with PTSD and thus spread misinformation about PTSD which will harm those, actually suffering from it.
    I've actually quoted stats about PTSD and refugees on this thread and as I said, people seem to be arrogantly shouting over it. There is quite a lot of research for the mental health of refugees in Europe.
    Obviously they did not survey every Syrian refugee, however took a sample and found a trend.

    I actually said in my OP that I don't agree with rape, and that I'm not using PTSD as an excuse/justification, for any crime.

    Gosh how thick you must be to think those who have escaped violent war zones must not be psychologically effected by it. And I bet that if we were discussing refugees of other religions there would be more want for rehabilitation.
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    (Original post by TSRFT8)
    This thread is actually full of complete morons;

    Do half of you even know what PTSD is and what makes you suffer it? Most of your logic is that it is a free card to do what you want well its not and its not "racist" to think that refugees should not be "raping" and "murdering" this countries nationals (some idiot is just using the race card in this thread)

    Secondly if the logic applies, then the rape victims ALSO should be entitled to go and kill their attacker (or does PTSD only apply when you want?)

    Thirdly, many people suffer PTSD after road accidents, you dont see them doing some of the things you claim are "okay" by refugees.

    Lastly stop putting all refugees under the same category, MOST are just normal people trying to take away from a warzone, some are undeniably scum and well that is what happens when you let THOUSANDS in. This country like every other EU country took the wrong decision in who it let in, it should have been letting in young kids with their mothers, instead they let in young men some of who just have nothing but hate towards the west and westerners.
    not racist? but why bring their race up when only condemning those communities for crimes?

    Don't forget they're fleeing to the very countries that are responsible for causing and supporting conflict in their countries of origin.

    PTSD can effect anyone including the victims of violent crime, and btw show me anywhere on this thread where I've shown sympathy to rapists and those who are perpetrators of violent crime?
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    (Original post by MJlover)
    I've actually quoted stats about PTSD and refugees on this thread and as I said, people seem to be arrogantly shouting over it. There is quite a lot of research for the mental health of refugees in Europe.
    Obviously they did not survey every Syrian refugee, however took a sample and found a trend.

    I actually said in my OP that I don't agree with rape, and that I'm not using PTSD as an excuse/justification, for any crime.

    Gosh how thick you must be to think those who have escaped violent war zones must not be psychologically effected by it. And I bet that if we were discussing refugees of other religions there would be more want for rehabilitation.
    Then what point are you even trying to make? You stated in your OP that the riots,serious crimes, and sexual attacks 'could be a reaction to what they have seen in war' and that ' violent outbursts like riots and stabbings are the effects of coming from war-torn countries'. Of course it's very likely that some of these refugees suffer from PTSD, but you cannot prove that this is what is causing their behaviour. Like I said before, if it was down to PTSD, it wouldn't only be young males behaving like this.
    I come from a war torn country, as a child my family moved from one country because of a civil war, only to find ourselves caught up in another war(2006 lebanon war). I know the effects that war and PTSD can have on a person. While PTSD can manifest in different ways(for example for me I had trouble sleeping,started having panic attacks,developed a phobia of fireworks,any loud sound would leave me in hysterics etc), believe me the last thing anyone who has lived through wars and seen all sorts of suffering should want to do is subject others to that. This is why I find the behaviour of those refugees so shocking.

    More should be done to help those refugees suffering from trauma I agree, but it's not the trauma that's causing the minority of them to behave in the way we've witnessed, and shame on you for labelling anyone who disagrees with you as racist or 'islamophobic.'
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    (Original post by childofthesun)
    Then what point are you even trying to make? You stated in your OP that the riots,serious crimes, and sexual attacks 'could be a reaction to what they have seen in war' and that ' violent outbursts like riots and stabbings are the effects of coming from war-torn countries'. Of course it's very likely that some of these refugees suffer from PTSD, but you cannot prove that this is what is causing their behaviour. Like I said before, if it was down to PTSD, it wouldn't only be young males behaving like this.
    I come from a war torn country, as a child my family moved from one country because of a civil war, only to find ourselves caught up in another war(2006 lebanon war). I know the effects that war and PTSD can have on a person. While PTSD can manifest in different ways(for example for me I had trouble sleeping,started having panic attacks,developed a phobia of fireworks,any loud sound would leave me in hysterics etc), believe me the last thing anyone who has lived through wars and seen all sorts of suffering should want to do is subject others to that. This is why I find the behaviour of those refugees so shocking.

    More should be done to help those refugees suffering from trauma I agree, but it's not the trauma that's causing the minority of them to behave in the way we've witnessed, and shame on you for labelling anyone who disagrees with you as racist or 'islamophobic.'
    I never labelled all people on this thread as Islamophobic/racist. just specific ones who have said stuff to substantiate it.
    I don't understand why you don't comprehend that I'm seeking an explanation and not justification of those crimes?
    I've even posted that army vets in the US have been found to have PTSD and have been convicted of crimes, no-one seemed to have a problem it as such :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by MJlover)
    I never labelled all people on this thread as Islamophobic/racist. just specific ones who have said stuff to substantiate it.
    I don't understand why you don't comprehend that I'm seeking an explanation and not justification of those crimes?
    I've even posted that army vets in the US have been found to have PTSD and have been convicted of crimes, no-one seemed to have a problem it as such :rolleyes:
    Still peddling the same rubbish as last night.

    You can't be taken seriously you must substantiate your claims


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    (Original post by paul514)
    Still peddling the same rubbish as last night.

    You can't be taken seriously you must substantiate your claims


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    I have repeatedly, stop quoting me if you think my claims aren't true. Do you have anything better to do? Also you don't have an argument yourself other than childishly attempting to discredit my evidence with empty insults.
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    (Original post by MJlover)
    I never labelled all people on this thread as Islamophobic/racist. just specific ones who have said stuff to substantiate it.
    I don't understand why you don't comprehend that I'm seeking an explanation and not justification of those crimes?
    I've even posted that army vets in the US have been found to have PTSD and have been convicted of crimes, no-one seemed to have a problem it as such :rolleyes:
    Saying there's a problem with culture is not enough to substantiate being called racist or Islamophobic. I am Middle Eastern myself,and while I disagree with the way people make generalisations about all Arabs and Arab countries, it'd be foolish of me to pretend that culture isn't a factor in the behaviour we've been seeing.
    Where did I claim you were attempting to justify it? I'm saying that your explanation doesn't hold.

    Are you seriously comparing war veterans to ordinary civilians? The link between PTSD in veterans and their increased likelihood of being convicted of crimes is a very complicated one. Usually, other factors are involved and it's not solely down to PTSD.
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    (Original post by childofthesun)
    Saying there's a problem with culture is not enough to substantiate being called racist or Islamophobic. I am Middle Eastern myself,and while I disagree with the way people make generalisations about all Arabs and Arab countries, it'd be foolish of me to pretend that culture isn't a factor in the behaviour we've been seeing.
    Where did I claim you were attempting to justify it? I'm saying that your explanation doesn't hold.

    Are you seriously comparing war veterans to ordinary civilians? The link between PTSD in veterans and their increased likelihood of being convicted of crimes is a very complicated one. Usually, other factors are involved and it's not solely down to PTSD.
    I don't see the problem in people comparing people who have witnessed war and those who had been involved as civilians.
    what do you actually know specifically about PTSD and those who are army vets?

    I find it racist to blame cultures as encouraging crime and deviancy and not to say the same thing about criminals from western countries - we never say their culture is responsible.

    As a somali woman I know that my culture has respect for others and civility and the people are not predisposed to crime, somali refugees who commit crime are reacting to enviornments.
 
 
 
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